green party ,, your thoughts

[bigbruce]

My point, exactly, fin. I get so tired of the armchair environmentalists telling us that the only thing that matters is the environment as they sit in their gas or electric heated homes and then tow their gas sucking boats with their gas sucking trucks to go fishing - and then rant against the very corporations who provide the jobs that enable them to have jobs so they can afford their houses, trucks and boats. They refuse to recognize that every time they step into their underwear in the morning, they've made an economics/environmental compromise.

 

[agentaqua]

..We use to be first in the world with some of our high tec.
Till it was sent off shore by the folks that knew the cost of everything but the value of nothing...

ANOTHER excellent post GLC!!! We are also losing our life skill base, our communities, and our abiities to provide and endure for the benefit of some politicians stock portfolio. Its way beyond criminal...

 

[profisher]

You can be green without being a fanatic. There is so much that can be done without harming jobs but would improve everyone's life. I can be green and still not agree with all the policies. Just like someone who is Catholic might not agree with everything coming out of the Vatican.

 

[Gunsmith]

Yes there is common ground. We can have our cake and eat it, but it might not be black forest cake.

You can be green without being a fanatic. There is so much that can be done without harming jobs but would improve everyone's life. I can be green and still not agree with all the policies. Just like someone who is Catholic might not agree with everything coming out of the Vatican.

 

[bigbruce]

Anybody here have a pension? Mutual Funds? RRSPs? If you answer 'yes', you better hope the stock market does well. Anybody work for a non-government organization? If you answer 'yes', you better hope the economy does well. Anybody work for the government? live off welfare, EI or other government handouts? Again, you better hope the economy does well or the people who work to pay the taxes so you can live will be joining you and eventually the gravy train will run dry.
Profisher and Gunsmith are right - there has to be trade-offs. Unless you're prepared to live in a cave somewhere and eat bugs and rabbits, you can't be totally 'green'. To sit at your computer terminal and suggest otherwise is rather hypocritical IMHO.

 

[GLG]

You're kidding right? First of all, I didn't say anything about 50/50. And if you really mean what you say - that the environment is #1 - please tell me that you are rowing out to the fishing grounds having somehow gotten your boat there on the back of your bicycle.

I never said you said 50/50..... I said it ... LOL
I don't row to the fishing grounds.. I run a well tuned 4 stroke there.
In my light aluminum boat... sure it's a rough ride at times but it gets great mileage.
Once there I run my kicker..... I mostly fish close to home so the ramp is just a few blocks away.
Yup I'm not driving much any more and never had to.
You see I have changed my ways to tread a little lighter on the planet.
I suspect you have too.... most of us have, in one way or another, changed.
I'm not preaching to fish from a kayak although that does look fun.
What I am saying is consider what you are trading when you put the "buck" before the earth.
It's coming back to bite us, all this crap.
Reading today that FDA down south is finding lead in the rice imported from China.
The levels are 10 times to high for children's consumption.
Think about that for a minute next time you go to a restaurant with your family.
Mercury in fish.... you must have heard about that.
Where do you think the mercury comes from?
Vancouver Port is set for an expansion for exporting coal and the fish bring it back to your plate.
Call me a lefty....LOL You don't know me....
Call me concerned....

 

[bigbruce]

GLG - we might be having a "violent agreement" here. (I reread my post, and I did not call you 'lefty'.) It does appear by your comments though that you agree that everyone must consider both economics and environment in deciding how they will live their lives. I too have changed many behaviours and am treading somewhat more lightly on the planet, however, many of my decisions have been based as much on "being green' factors as economic factors as it is simply getting too expensive to, for example, drive as much as I used to. I'm using CFL and LED light bulbs in my house because the Government won't let me buy the good old incandescent bulbs anymore, even thought those pesky little CFL's with their mercury are probably worse for the planet than the incandescents they are replacing.
Anyway - you keep on doing what you're doing - and keep smiling! And I will too.

 

[profisher]

CFL & LED lights do have small amounts of harmful chemicals in them. However they can be dissembled and those chemicals recovered and recycled. CFS which there are more of out there are already under such a program. However the "LESS" green parties in power make you pay an ECO fee up front but then make no requirement that you return the bulb to have the recovery done. HOW FRICKEN STUPID!!!! They collect revenue and most still end up in the garbage. The greens I hope would continue with an ECO fee but like beverage containers give you a worthwhile refund for taking them to a proper recycle depot.

 

[GLG]

GLG - we might be having a "violent agreement" here. (I reread my post, and I did not call you 'lefty'.) It does appear by your comments though that you agree that everyone must consider both economics and environment in deciding how they will live their lives. I too have changed many behaviours and am treading somewhat more lightly on the planet, however, many of my decisions have been based as much on "being green' factors as economic factors as it is simply getting too expensive to, for example, drive as much as I used to. I'm using CFL and LED light bulbs in my house because the Government won't let me buy the good old incandescent bulbs anymore, even thought those pesky little CFL's with their mercury are probably worse for the planet than the incandescents they are replacing.
Anyway - you keep on doing what you're doing - and keep smiling! And I will too.

LOL
The lefty thing was my attempt to lighten it up, hence the LOL
Yup you are trying to lightin your foot print, we all have to.
To be clear.... don't put the economy ahead of the environment.
That path leads to a place we can't live in.

Any way this thread is going off the rails.
Can't vote green so carry on without me....

 

[GLG]

Ok back for one more comment.
Was watching the news and had a good laugh on CBC.
I'll paraphrase and add a little...
Conservatives claim to have a steady hand on the tiller of the economy.
The Liberals claim to have built the boat.
The Republicans accidentally shot a hole in it while fooling around with their assault rifle.
The Greens claim to know how to fix it by replacing the motor with a sail.

 

[finaddict]

You can be green without being a fanatic. There is so much that can be done without harming jobs but would improve everyone's life. I can be green and still not agree with all the policies.

Based on whose definition of "green"?

Just like someone who is Catholic might not agree with everything coming out of the Vatican.

Not according to the dude at the top. Again definition is unclear. So it is with those who condemn anyone who puts the economy first.

 

[Rockfish]

Anybody here have a pension? Mutual Funds? RRSPs? If you answer 'yes', you better hope the stock market does well. Anybody work for a non-government organization? If you answer 'yes', you better hope the economy does well. Anybody work for the government? live off welfare, EI or other government handouts? Again, you better hope the economy does well or the people who work to pay the taxes so you can live will be joining you and eventually the gravy train will run dry.
Profisher and Gunsmith are right - there has to be trade-offs. Unless you're prepared to live in a cave somewhere and eat bugs and rabbits, you can't be totally 'green'. To sit at your computer terminal and suggest otherwise is rather hypocritical IMHO.

What just the environment; you missed the opportunity to blame unions, child labour laws and anti slavery fanatics.

If you want money for the environment, health care, roads, education and a good retirement plus lower taxes I would suggest that Canada and our politicians stop viewing our economy as nothing more than a northern banana republic resource extraction nation whereby we extract and give away to foreign controlled corporations our resources as fast as possible with ridiculously low royalties accruing to the owners (Canada).

Now they don’t even want to employee Canadians while they bend us over. 300,000 “temporary” foreign workers and headed for millions while the middle class disappears (millions of Canadians out of work) and we become impoverished peasants in our own wealthy land.

In the past wars were fought to take other nations resources. In Canada’s case all you need is some corrupt politicians. Why invade, we invite them. Take a look at Norway’s oil and gas royalties and quality of life and compare it with Canada. We were a just society once that actually had a growing middle class. Time for a rethink.

 

[spring fever]

"Green" an over used word!! I could vote for the concept-but the party-well where do they stand on other things-other than "green" things? Are they socialist looking for redistribution of wealth-Where do they stand on education,what about the fishery-I know it's federal-are they going to try and shut everything down and let FN"friends of the earth" take it all. What happens to the Ferries and the workers? There are many none "green "questions that have to be answered by the green party before I would vote for them .

 

[Rockfish]

"Green" an over used word!! I could vote for the concept-but the party-well where do they stand on other things-other than "green" things? Are they socialist looking for redistribution of wealth-Where do they stand on education,what about the fishery-I know it's federal-are they going to try and shut everything down and let FN"friends of the earth" take it all. What happens to the Ferries and the workers? There are many none "green "questions that have to be answered by the green party before I would vote for them .

Extremes of the right and extremes of the left; two sides of the same coin and equally destructive. Time for a shift to the middle.

 

[Last Chance]

It's really a shame we can't just take a toilet snake to the whole provincial government and start over. It's kind of like the salad only buffet on the afternoon ferries, there is just not a lot of great choices..

The greens are looking better and better, however, green means "expensive" . Two words for you, Carbon Tax. Damn easy to collect, and damn easy to impliment. Green tends to lean towards social programs. We can't afford the actual social programs that we already have and really need. Since the HST was canned, there will be even less money for that.

We currently have a province with no discernable economy (Really, what do we do), some really expensive housing costs and social baggage, and really, the only people left to look towards paying that are the middle class. Yep, that's us, the house owning, car driving, 9-5 working class. BACK OFF.

I'd almost vote for the marijhauana or however you spell it party. Doing nothing for the next 4 years can't be any worse then whats probably going to happen.

We have the Liberals who have been completley gutted of any real tallent of leadership. We have the NDP who put this province on the rocks in the 1990's. We have the Greens who have not really had a chance to show how they can lead (They sure can preach ideals)..

Last, but not least, I have been told it is going to cost me 5 grand to hire a biologist to supervise me putting a culvert across a dry ditch (That you can stride across) on a non fish bearing stream on my new property.. This is not 300 feet upstream from an existing culvert on Sooke River Road. I would need to know that I would not see any more of this BS from the Green Party, just as an example..

Real green decisions are great, "feel good" expensive BS is not. (Don't touch my car, China builds 3 coal plants a day, we are a p** in the wind as far as carbon issues). Put some fish in the creeks, trees on the hills, have have some usefull workers come out of schools, and less emphasis on university and college courses that have the words "Arts" and "Studies" in them.

I'll probably just, on election day, say FUGGIT, hop in my Diesel F350, rumble on down the two blocks and vote Green becauase well, it can't get any worse...

 

[Last Chance]

Great example. We do care about the environment. North America (United States) really lead the world in the clean air initiative through the 1970's energy crunch. Cars now burn cleaner then they ever did, home are more energy efficient then they ever have been, and the recent glut in Natural Gas Prices and fracking revolution ensure clean energy for decades to come.

However, there are those who wish to use green initiatives to take from those who do, and give to those who don't (And who are most likely to vote in a manner that gives them such).

We are damn green per capita. Just make sure that you ballance cost versus benfit when you go green. EG, my culvert on a dry creek, big problem, cost land owner months and thousands, fish farms, cost province a fishery... One is a "feel good" iniative, one is not...

 

[Last Chance]

Sorry, I derailed the thread. Green will begrudging get my vote....

 

[triplenickel]

You can be green without being a fanatic. There is so much that can be done without harming jobs but would improve everyone's life. I can be green and still not agree with all the policies. Just like someone who is Catholic might not agree with everything coming out of the Vatican.

So what in your opinion should the economic driver of this province be?

 

[triplenickel]

Anybody here have a pension? Mutual Funds? RRSPs? If you answer 'yes', you better hope the stock market does well

And most funds have energy stocks in the portfolio.

 

[triplenickel]

Its a wait and see to see if he is like his dad was.

As in wait to see if he decides to destroy the western economy with his socialist policies?

Politics is so frustrating, partisan ideals don't work no one party has all the answers and when it comes down to it they lie to get into power, they make big campaign promises that with a little further thought can obviously never implement, they don't change much and the status quo generally prevails.

Edit; I'm not looking to pick a fight or argue here, it's pointless I'm just venting. Hopefully we can find some kind of balance.