Downrigger braid

[blackvelvet]

I just got a new spool of gangon if anyone wants help setting up riggers. Just bring them by.

I'm 90 minutes south of the border, any chance we could meet halfway ??? Ha Ha Ha Ha.....You guys need to school the Washington guys about the tuna cord. I don't see anyone down here doing it that way. You BC guys are always ahead of the curve for sure. Nice job.

 

[Englishman]

Also my riggers are old and the pulleys are old some people say that could chop the braid but I've had no issues up to 15 pound balls.

GDW is right. Do not be foolish like I was and put braid onto older downriggers that have been run with wire for a long time. The pulley wheels get scuffed or grooved and the edges are burred/rough over time. This wears on the braid like crazy and you get sudden break offs after only a few months.
In fact the friction of synthetic braid on plastic pulleys is huge, especially with the first lower of the day when everything is dry. My braid used to make a taught pinging noise as it went over the pulleys and that was telling me something and I did not listen.
I will never go back to braid again unless I get new downriggers with shiny smooth metal pulley wheels!!

 

[GDW]

You read my post wrong Englishman I said the exact opposite of you. My riggers are 10 plus years old have always used cable switched to braid last season and not one problem since then. I'm still using the old pulleys too. No frays, no break offs, no strange noise letting the balls down.

I got the good stuff though - 200 pound power pro. If I remember correctly you tried to use another type of braid that might have been your downfall.

 

[Englishman]

You beat me was going to say same thing you got something else going on how what knot are you using?

GDW - sorry if I misinterpreted your post. I was taking my cue from my own experience. I did not use Powerpro, but I don't remember exactly what it was. Could be the make was the issue but now I'm gun shy. Also it was the second season that my breaks started to happen (i.e. after 6-9 months)

High Five, it was nothing to do with the knot, because that never came into contact with the pulleys. The breaks would happen 10-30 feet above the ball. One time twice in a day!!
I have discussed this experience in some earlier threads. The breaks I was getting have no other explanation than wear/fraying/friction going over the pulley. (PS check on the physics of this on the web. The friction of a synthetic (organic) braid on a plastic pulley (also organic) is very high.)

 

[Tips Up]

English... you got trim tabs?
Had an issue with braid on a boat and took a while to find out it was rubbing on trim tabs when turning and freighed the braid.

I have been all steel cable up until now. One side needs to be changed and I will be using braid based on good experiance on other boats.

Tips

 

[Bows Up]

Going to be switching to braid when the wire starts to fray. In preparation, I checked my fairleads and they had grooves in them so I bought new ones. Pulleys seemed fine.

English, I'm sure you looked but are your fairleads OK ?

 

[Englishman]

English... you got trim tabs?
Had an issue with braid on a boat and took a while to find out it was rubbing on trim tabs when turning and freighed the braid.

I have been all steel cable up until now. One side needs to be changed and I will be using braid based on good experiance on other boats.

Tips

Yes, I do have trim tabs. I had not thought of that one so I will check it out. I don't think the cable/braid comes into contact with the tabs except maybe on sharp turns. However, when dropping and retrieving on normal tack I am pretty confident the wires don't rub the tabs but it is worth checking out.

 

[Englishman]

Englishman yes I know the physics...Power-pro is polyethylene its not like standard braid which some have extremely high co-efficient. High the co-efficient worse it is. Scotty uses an ABS blend. It is also re-enforced with different components but it also has a very low co-efficient.

If your statement was correct everyone would have same problem....I suspect you did not use power pro and something else.... Anyhow there is no real clear winner in battle of the lines just use what you feel is best for your situation. I know lots of guys that get very big fish consistently with wire as they no how to set the voltages just right.... But....I just chose the braid as it simple to use that's all or I would have stayed with wire...

Yep, like I said I did not use Power Pro. It was something else and probably cheap. Maybe that was my mistake?
Also the reason other guys don't get my problem is they all have much nicer, newer, free running pulley wheels. Mine is a venerable old boat with downriggers to match which is all I could afford. Like I said I would give braid another try if I had brand new downriggers which will likely happen.......errr never! LOL

P.S. still playing with the voltage thing. Removed all my zincs the other day and sanded them shiny and put them back. Will see if that makes any difference tomorrow....

 

[Seafever]

I am using downriggers that are close to 13 years old.

When I switched to braid I took a good look at the pulleys.

They had grooves in them.

I sanded the grooves out and smoothed off the rough edges with 150 grit I think it was.

Then finished 'em with 300 grit.

I also had a groove on the Scotty main big take-up pulley on the downrigger.

Don't know how the heck I got one in that place. But I did that one too.

No fray issues now.

 

[Hit em Hard]

Yep, like I said I did not use Power Pro. It was something else and probably cheap. Maybe that was my mistake?
Also the reason other guys don't get my problem is they all have much nicer, newer, free running pulley wheels. Mine is a venerable old boat with downriggers to match which is all I could afford. Like I said I would give braid another try if I had brand new downriggers which will likely happen.......errr never! LOL

P.S. still playing with the voltage thing. Removed all my zincs the other and sanded them shiny and put them back. Will see if that makes any difference tomorrow....

Hello English
If you do change back to braid and you have Scotty down-riggers you could always purchase new pulley wheels. I did and they worked just fine for braid. sorry but I don't remember the cost.
h.e.h.

 

[Englishman]

Going to be switching to braid when the wire starts to fray. In preparation, I checked my fairleads and they had grooves in them so I bought new ones. Pulleys seemed fine.

English, I'm sure you looked but are your fairleads OK ?

Not sure what you mean by fairleads. I checked on the web and maybe you are referring to the pulley wheel housing (the two plastic plates on either side of the wheels?). Anyway mine are burred, rough and gouged from long use with wire so that is what I am saying. I should have replaced the whole business end of the downrigger arm but didn't. Just took off the wire and put on braid (one side only to try it). Fine for 6 months or so and then bang, bang - random breaks I'm sure due to abrasion of the roughened plastic on the braid over time (probably heat generated which would be a killer on a polymer).
Like I say I will try braid again with new downriggers and nice shiny metal pulleys (don't know when that will be!!). Till then no point......

 

[Seafever]

I didn't know they made Scotty downriggers with metal pulleys.........

 

[Dogbreath]

Not sure what you mean by fairleads......

 

[Englishman]

I am using downriggers that are close to 13 years old.

When I switched to braid I took a good look at the pulleys.

They had grooves in them.

I sanded the grooves out and smoothed off the rough edges with 150 grit I think it was.

Then finished 'em with 300 grit.

I also had a groove on the Scotty main big take-up pulley on the downrigger.

Don't know how the heck I got one in that place. But I did that one too.

No fray issues now.

Hey Seafever,
You were much more careful and diligent than I was.
That was and is the way to go no doubt. Just slapping on braid onto downwriggers that have long been used with wire is asking for trouble. That is all I was trying to say.
If I had rejuvenated or replaced the business end of the downrigger arm I would probably not be writing this...Ah well back on wire both sides till the day I get new downriggers.
(Funny thing was, the winter I ran braid one side and wire the other, the wire side outfished the braid 4:1 (I put a post up about that).....so I am happy to be back to two wires anyway......)

 

[Seafever]

I had sort of the same thing happen.......I finally got so ticked off with wire that I switched to wire one side and braid the other.......and the wire would get fish when the braid wouldn't.....but I still decided that I was going to braid both sides...and since then the braid has gotten me way more fish.

When I ran wires I had a blackbox and spent hours trying to calculate and adjust voltages,also refurbishing of Zincs and cleaning of terminals......and on and on it went.

I like the toughness of wire but I also like the no-hassle policy of braid.

Some day in the future maybe they'll come up with a line that has both these features.

Until then....may the Chinooks flock to your boat , sir......

 

[cpony]

Hi Englishman, Take your Riggers to Scotty's out in Sidney and explain the situation and ask what they can do. Their customer service is top notch if you are honest. If you do get them to put braid on ask for their smallest braid which I think is 175 lb. Switched 3-4 years ago and still have not replaced it and still fishes as good or better than wire, no down time and quick repairs. Just cut off and retie when it starts to looked frayed on the first couple of feet from use and abuse.
ie: tangled on crab traps on rocks.

 

[fish stalker]

sounds like the break might be around where your first clip is? using or doing anything funky that could cause a fray...?

 

[scott craven]

My advice if you're going to braid , use 200lb powerpro
it's the best.

 

[burnsy22]

Agreed.....

My advice if you're going to braid , use 200lb powerpro
it's the best.

 

[Seafever]

Heard the PowerPro 200 has less blowback than Scotty braid and it is thinner than Scotty yet stronger.......

That true?