Braid vs Wire (from the Sooke reports thread)

[Seafever]

BlindMonkey:-


When using wire:-

Wire goes through pulley.

As you troll, pulley is pulled back on an angle.

Wire is making contact with the edge of the pulley.

Because of tightness at the pulley swivel, the pulley may not go back far enough as it's supposed to.

As you raise or lower the wire while underway it makes contact with the pulley housing and will wear a groove in the edge sometimes.

If you are at a dead stop and raise the wire, there is less chance of this happening because the pulley has gone back to straight up and down.

Now you switch to braid and those grooves are still in the pulley housing.

Your pulley swivel still does not swing freely....so the braid is rubbing on the pulley just like the wire.

The old grooves in the pulley housing from the wire now chafe your braid.....

and the next trip out:- goodbye cannonball.




Generally:- Since really big salmon are much more sensitive to voltage than smaller salmon you would think that the bigger the salmon the more finicky with the voltage one would have to be.


I doubt that anybody actually nails their voltage dead on...even with a black box....unless your wire is brand new.

After a couple times in the chuck the wire starts to get a patina of surface oxidation/corrosion on it......

The black box just tells you how much voltage is going to the wire......it doesn't tell you the actual effect being dissipated from the surface-corroded patina-covered wire.

And then you have the wire length/voltage disparity.

If one side is at 75ft and the other side is at 200ft.........you can't balance the voltage because they are both fed from the same box.........and Scotty DOES NOT recommend

using individual black boxes per side.

You get a voltage drop when you go down deep so to compensate you have to jack the voltage.......which makes your shallow line too hot.

(You could unplug the shallow side of course....but then because it's wire you don't know what your actual voltage would be on that side......the voltage from the other side is going to affect it even though the shallow side is unplugged because it is all part of the anode /cathode matrix).




It is also unclear to me how the statement can be made that if one's lure is 30ft back of the wire the effect of voltage is nullified.............yet the claim is made that the voltage attracts fish from far and wide..........

 

[Last Chance]

I used the original Scotty 300LB Dyneema braid for the last 6 years untill I sold my riggers and got new ones. Would drop maybe 1 ball a year on Swiftsure. Easy on the hands, and gear, and would bust a swivel mount before breaking (Hung up on Crab Traps). I found it to be plenty fishy for me, and yes, it would blow back a little bit more, so just stick a bigger ball on. Easy peasy.

This year, I stuck the 250LB Scotty Dynema braid (Grey STuff) on, and we'll see how it goes. I tried the Power Pro 200, was good off Victoria, but the swells in Renfrew were busting it on a regular basis for me, let lots of guys were doing fine with it. Granted, when fishing the bank when the bulk of the action is first thing in the AM, you are dropping balls down as fast as you can, up down up down 150 feet as hard as they will go, so maybe the extra 100LB test over the Power Pro 200 was the ticket.

My $0.02..

 

[the fog ducker]

right now ive got a mismatch of 2 Braids and SS cable on my 3 Scotty riggers
i upgraded all 3 riggers this year , thought id put this to a test
, and this includes sum pretty good hours fishin in 200 feet offshore and feeders in the cold months ,
ive ran 200lb power pro for appx 6 years now , i had some issues or better yet , learning curves
when i switched over , yes , i was free spooling and breaking off ( 15lbers ) now and then
directly tied to the ball hook , way to hard on the rigger , i then switched to the every popular braid to
gagnion , the knot as your stopper , prob could have stayed with that , but again , found it was a rough on the rigger , stopping pully etc,,,
so Rob at PNT sold me some 200lb mono , i use about 6 feet of it , and a couple crimps at my ball connector , a couple at my braid/Mono transition ,
Bobs ur Uncle , acts as a snubber or shock , very forgiving on the gear , NEVER breaks , the transition where the crimps meets the braid is my auto stop ,
the scotty power grips love the thickness of the 200lb mono , never slips , been using this for 3 years flawlessly , again , thx Rob for the idea ,

ive converted a handful of rods to try this , they love it ,

heres what i have on my boat right now , and my results ,

250 Scotty - Smooth and Strong but way to much blow back , ( i recommend for 20 lb balls perhaps )

SS wire - Strong , fishes well , but , brings unwanted voltages perhaps (i think its way over emphasized personally )
it blows back slightly more than the 200 PP Braid - doesnt last as long at deeper intervals , hard on the hands if frayed

My Choice - Power Pro 200lb as mentioned on this site a few times now , it just works !! id rather have zero volts , than thinking im not catching slabs because im pullin a hydro station behind me...
if stacking for sockeye or spoons/plugs/baits above a Dummy Flasher , i use two stacked red beads , solid as a rock , no slipping

i put between 70 -80 days a year on them ,not as many as the big boys here im sure ,

i fish deeper most parts of the year ( Banks - winter feeders )
helps keep my 15's on the deck and not in the mud or rocks

( i change the 200 Mono twice a year , Braid last 3-4 years no prob , no rust , no wrought , SMOOOOOTHHH )


hope this helps

fd

 

[cby]

OK I will chime in on this debate, I have been fishing mostly Oak Bay to Sooke for 36 years, I have log books over the years, what works what doesn't work, depth etc etc. Here is what I believe makes you successful:
1) Luck
2) Wife or Girlfriend that doesn't ***** at you for fishing so much ( More time on water equals more chances at big fish)
3) Knowing the area fishing in, contours, tides, structures, depth
4) Trolling speed
5) Lure / Anchovy, for depth fishing, use Glow if more than 100ft and some thing silvery above 100ft, but it really depends what type of bait fish are around. If fishing bottom needlefish type Lure. Basically match the bait to where you are fishing.
6) Flasher depends how deep, I use Glow for bottom and most times something with silver on it
7) Weight of Cannon ball vs depth fishing. If fishing bottom 12, 15 or 20lb. If fishing high 10 or 12 should be good. Really depends on depth, tide currents.
8) Finally Braid vs Wire: I used Wire for a very long time, caught lots of fish, switch to Braid about 6 years ago. Catching same amount of fish. No difference. Wire I would have to change out yearly for sure, cuts on my hands, tangles, and cuts into pulley. Braid smooth, just changed this year after 6 years only reason got hung up on bottom and broke off lost a lot of braid, so I decided to do both riggers again. Braid much cheaper to maintain and quiet. But Braid or wire is not why you catch fish or big fish, its all the other reasons before this that you don't get them.

The reason all the guides and veterans of this area get the big ones more constantly is because they are on the water, know the area, depth, Lure blah blah.

But most of all LUCK is the key!! Good luck and tell the person that's holding you back from the big one to beat it!!!

 

[Stosh]

According to Scotty, they never offered 300# braid! only 250# braid. So the 250 you now have is the same as the previous braid you had for 6 years. Scotty now offers a 200# black braid and now a 200# high vis yellow. I used the original 250 for years and have switched to the 200# now.
Stosh

 

[Fishalot]

Awesome information, thanks guys

 

[profisher]

Still fishing wire and have no tattoos either....really enjoying being a rebel now!!! LOL

 

[walleyes]

I run wire, no black box, in an aluminum boat,, never had it checked,, catches fish as well as any of them do.. I even enjoy a banana for lunch,, just because.. If it's not broke don't fix it... When she's all set just right and I'm in the zone I can here the wire sing to me in that special tone and I know,, alls good.

Best bet,, get away from the crowd, pay attention to detail,, every little detail,, think like fish and go where they hang out,, in those little spots the others miss and dig them out of there.. Sometimes away from the crowd is just a few hundred feet too the little knolls you find on your finder,, can you not see that big bugger hiding out behind that rock or up against that wall waiting for a meal to get washed by,, or sitting in that kelp bed fighting the tide in his ambush spot just waiting.. Roll it by his nose just at the right speed and he can't resist,, it's his instinct to nail it,, he can't help it..

Ahh I can't wait,, only a few more days and I get to challenge him once again...

 

[Dogbreath]

I run wire..... I even enjoy a banana for lunch...

Hold on there Fella-them's fightin' werds!

 

[Aces]

OK I will chime in on this debate, I have been fishing mostly Oak Bay to Sooke for 36 years, I have log books over the years, what works what doesn't work, depth etc etc. Here is what I believe makes you successful:
1) Luck
2) Wife or Girlfriend that doesn't ***** at you for fishing so much ( More time on water equals more chances at big fish)
3) Knowing the area fishing in, contours, tides, structures, depth
4) Trolling speed
5) Lure / Anchovy, for depth fishing, use Glow if more than 100ft and some thing silvery above 100ft, but it really depends what type of bait fish are around. If fishing bottom needlefish type Lure. Basically match the bait to where you are fishing.
6) Flasher depends how deep, I use Glow for bottom and most times something with silver on it
7) Weight of Cannon ball vs depth fishing. If fishing bottom 12, 15 or 20lb. If fishing high 10 or 12 should be good. Really depends on depth, tide currents.
8) Finally Braid vs Wire: I used Wire for a very long time, caught lots of fish, switch to Braid about 6 years ago. Catching same amount of fish. No difference. Wire I would have to change out yearly for sure, cuts on my hands, tangles, and cuts into pulley. Braid smooth, just changed this year after 6 years only reason got hung up on bottom and broke off lost a lot of braid, so I decided to do both riggers again. Braid much cheaper to maintain and quiet. But Braid or wire is not why you catch fish or big fish, its all the other reasons before this that you don't get them.

The reason all the guides and veterans of this area get the big ones more constantly is because they are on the water, know the area, depth, Lure blah blah.

But most of all LUCK is the key!! Good luck and tell the person that's holding you back from the big one to beat it!!!

I concur with #2

 

[Aces]

Still fishing wire and have no tattoos either....really enjoying being a rebel now!!! LOL

Yeah, me too Rolly!

Too stuck in my ways to change. Too bad us old guys have to much voltage to get the "big ones", lol!

 

[walleyes]

Hold on there Fella-them's fightin' werds!

Lol,, I knew that one would raise some eye brows..

 

[Time]

Ahh, use whatever you got.
Changing based on above describes the lure salesman dream.
Change when you need new wire/cord, to whatever you feel good about.
I doubt that it matters.
Best thing is to spend time on the water, exploring, observing, recording, analyzing what happens.
Agree with CBY.

 

[Seafever]

In the past archives of the "wire vs braid" perennial debates...you had people that connected the wire direct to the ball with no isolation...and these people swore they caught more fish that way.

Both Pro-Troll and Scotty make a point of saying NOT to connect direct to ball but instead isolate it.

Scotty even makes a clip that isolates the ball.

Now if wire fishes better connected direct then why do Scotty, ProTroll and Malcolm Russell all recommend NOT doing that.....?

The wire has a charge on it. When you connect direct to the ball with a metal clip you are now connecting to a dissimilar metal and creating more hot zones and galvanic action that interfere with the system working isolated and as closely balanced as it should.

Whether you connect direct to a covered ball or a non-covered ball you are still introducing voltage into dissimilar metals that weren't part of the original equation and were supposed to be isolated.

When you connect direct you have a total screwup electrically and galvanically with electrical hotspots/mis-matches and uneven voltage......


Yet there are people that fish their wires this way because they swear it works.......

Maybe the whole voltage thing is a colossal myth........and the black box and everything associated with balancing voltage is a "placebo" effect.

If you think it works...then it does........ Or not.

Have you ever noticed that your fish catch increases or decreases in areas where there is known underwater electrical activity/fields near by or numerous underwater electrical cables or any other device that emits an EMF?

How about in a cluster of boats that are all emitting transient electrical voltage into the water?

Do metal hull sport boats catch more or bigger fish than fibreglass or wood? From everything I've seen.......no.

 

[the fog ducker]

its all just about what works for you i suppose , just WAY over thought imho
im in a marina with some pretty high end boats ( over a hundred at times ) and some pretty
dialed in fisherman , a few putting in over 50 days a year on the water ,
%95 of them are on Braid now , even the stubborn Senior Saltys that
know how to put slabs on the deck ,have switched over ,
most agree , it comes down to durability and less annual maintenance ,
i know i personally have enough to deal with every spring ,
id rather be neutral than hot as most , why chance it....

till the next annual repeat debate
all to there own !!

fd

 

[kyjelly44]

All i know is that if you don't run braid, to be more specific Low Drag Microfilament Premium Power Braid you will become impotent!!

 

[Seafever]

I tried using the grey 250lb Scotty braid a long time ago.....

But whenever I went through places that had a thick algae bloom or water with some heavy algae in it, the algae would stick to the braid like a slime coat, adding diameter to it.....

Never got that as much on the Power Pro 200........

The slime is easier to get off wire though......

 

[sir-vivor]

I was seriously thinking of changing my wire over to braid but after the last month or so of using my black box and wire I may have to postpone my decision for another year.
Receintly I fished a local tourney along with several of my buddies buddies and they were not all that successful (fishing in the same area as me).
They used braid and or wire with out the black box .
I used the black box set at 6 and ended up with these, which the 30 lber was the winner of the derby



I have also noticed that my hit and retrieve rate had increased greatly since re attaching the Black Box.

Yes, I did disconnect it because I was a non-believer but now ... I don't know. I know we have had a huge influx of big fish but to out fish my buddies (who are much better fisherman than I and win the tourney) ..... ????

Many might say "It was your lucky day ". I say true but ...... I'M GONNA PUT SOME NEW WIRE ON AND TRY AGAIN NEXT YEAR !

Just my 5 cents !

Clint

PS Since attaching the Black Box my catches have done well just before or after the slack tides consistently

 

[tincan]

Braided 4 life... from now on! - switched over to braided about 4 years ago now and will never go back to wire. Things I've found nice about braid include:
-easier on the hands
-simple to tie (quick palomar knot as opposed to crimps, etc with wire)
-no frays
-runs smoother in and out of the rigger (I have HP's)
-no electrolysis concerns

For me it's a no brainer

 

[Gear'n'beer!]

I run wire on one side and braid on other. Why? Because when I purchased two new ones the dude at harbour chandler talked me into trying braid as they were the same price at the time. I have a third as a top rod which is wire and generally it has a bare plug or bare spoon on it so I won't count it into my observations. The last two years running one of each are.......Catch ratio's are equal. One day wire outfishes and the next braid does or they both get equal action. But they each have non catch ratio plusses and minuses. I do run two HP's as my main riggers and I prefer the wire for the side that isn't my side. Mainly because it is much tougher if mishaps do occur. If my buddy/girlfriend/relative does something wrong wire is more forgiving. For my side I prefer braid for all the reasons already stated. However I do have power pro sitting on the shelf for whichever rigger but I am torn about getting rid of the wire I have used since guiding 25 years ago.

GnB