Knot on call
Member
I have a 2010 verado 200 with 67 hours, I just took it out and the water in fuel alarm went off a couple times over 4 hours on the water. Anyone had this issue? Any suggestions on how to fix it aside from, 'go buy a Yamaha'?
Water in fuel alarm verado 200
- Thread starter Knot on call
- Start date
Like most , I am assuming that besides the fuel filter/separator on your motor that you also have a separate racor type large combined fuel filter and water separator unit and because you have an outboard board, the separator is not the all metal type (fire prevention) for onboard motors designed for placment in the onboard motor compartment.
Yours should have a clear lower plastic lower section that will allow you to see how much water is in the separator. Get down and have a look and bleed off any water from the separator into a container. If there is none that may indicate the problem is elsewhere. This is basis boat maintenance and should be checked frequently and bled off as necessary. If it was full of water that may be the problem. If you have not done it recently I would buy and change out fuel filter, filter elements. This should be done as part of maintenance - some say once a year.
If there was water in your separator and possibly even if not I would check for the level of water in the fuel tank. Water in the fuel tank is more likely to occur in metal (aluminum tanks like mine than non metal tank because of condensation forming on the sides of the metal), especially if you don’t keep the tank full or near full during winter storage or periods of non use but can form in the plastic type tanks also. We always keep our tank filled up as much as possible and top up even if it was almost full to control condensation, provide the max fuel safety reserve for a unexpected turn of events out on the water, and use the fuel as ballast as my boat is poded, with the onboard heavy motor gone and some added air floatation in the pod. The long fuel tank is 80 gal of added weight low right on the keel line which provides a little added stability to my boat in heavy seas but decreases fuel economy a very small amount – more than a fair trade off. A full tank also help the fuel tank baffles control sloshing in the tank to prevent water and fuel in the tank from emulsifying or at least keep it out of the fuel tank pickup tube which is usually up a little bit from the bottom of the tank where it picks up less water and crap that will clog up you fuel filters and water separator.
On my boat I would remove the small hatch covering access to the main fuel tank pick ups or even the large hatch (screwed down floor board used to access and replace the entire tank) after ensuring the angle of the boat is good on the trailer. You want it as flat as possible for testing and to keep the gas in the tank when you open the top of the tank. Make sure the current fuel level is low enough, say only about 60% full to keep the fuel in the tank when you open the tank or you will have another big problem on your hands.
A complete inspection of your tank and all fittings and fuel line clamps etc. and replacement as necessary, is also part of basic periodic boat maintenance. Fuel lines are cheap; swap them out as necessary but buy the expensive high end stainless marine hose clamps.
Since gas floats on water, get a clear dip tube and put it straight into the tank to the bottom and place your finger over it and remove and hold it straight up, then put another finger over the bottom of the dip tube. You should be able to see how much gas you have floating on how much water and possibly even how much little bits of crap are in the bottom of the fuel tank. Use a siphon tube connected to a dip tube and siphon/pump out as much of the water in the tank as you can while not removing the gas, you may also get some dirt which is a good thing. I have not had to do this but have looked at our tank and think it is possible. Don't know about your tank design and there may be other water drain access/options on your tank.
I would taste a tiny bit of the water removed from both the tank and fuel/water separator to see if it is fresh, salt or brackish water. You can probably even have it tested. If it is fresh or mostly fresh (which it should be) it is likely condensation but if there is a lot of it that could indicate rain water and perhaps a little sea water spray getting passed a bad seal on you gas filler cap assembly. I had this happen a little once with a very old filler cap assembly, replace it with a new assembly or at least replace the seal to be sure, especially if it is old or shows signs of leaking and they also are cheap. In my case the whole assembly was replaced. Don’t forget to hook up the static discharge wire to a metal fuel cap assembly.
If this does not solve your problem you are now past my level of experience and need the advice of marine mechanics, for things like bad water sensors, computer problems and possible issues with tank overfill line one way valves (very unlikely) and other causes I have no clue about.
PS - if your Merc Motor is designed the same as the big older Opti, the lower motor assembly has two drain tubes with one way check valves (little balls) in them that goes through the motor plate the lower cowling joins up to. These tubes and valves are designed to drain any rain/more likely sea water that gets inside your upper cowling assembly out of your motor. They get clogged up with dirt, grease and paint chips etc very easily and then the cowling can hold lots of sea water in for long periods of time. It drips out slowly but may stay their too long. This can cause a lot of preventable corrosion on a warm motor and lead to things like lower motor cooling fittings failing. Don’t know if this could somehow cause your problem and think it unlikely, but in my view it is critical maintenance item to add to your list to prevent other serious problem from occurring. To check and clean them on our Merc OPTI you remove the upper cowling and the two sides of the lower cowling and pull out the two drain tubes and check and clean them. You should be able to blow air through them and the check valve balls inside the tubes should move freely. If not keep cleaning them until they do or buy new ones. I did have a dealer Merc mechanic tell me that they sometimes pop out the check balls especially if the motor is mounted very low to the water. This means that salt water can get splashed or forced up the drain tubes into the motor compartment but also drains out quickly. I think they are there for a reason and it is best to leave them but also to check them frequently and keep the tubes and the check valve balls working freely. As I said that is on an older OPTI and on your 4stroke It may be different but worth checking out. Look up a parts diagram of your motor on line to see how you’re motor is designed to drain off water that gets inside the cowling, if it does at all.
Hope this helps and is not a lot of things you have already done.
Yours should have a clear lower plastic lower section that will allow you to see how much water is in the separator. Get down and have a look and bleed off any water from the separator into a container. If there is none that may indicate the problem is elsewhere. This is basis boat maintenance and should be checked frequently and bled off as necessary. If it was full of water that may be the problem. If you have not done it recently I would buy and change out fuel filter, filter elements. This should be done as part of maintenance - some say once a year.
If there was water in your separator and possibly even if not I would check for the level of water in the fuel tank. Water in the fuel tank is more likely to occur in metal (aluminum tanks like mine than non metal tank because of condensation forming on the sides of the metal), especially if you don’t keep the tank full or near full during winter storage or periods of non use but can form in the plastic type tanks also. We always keep our tank filled up as much as possible and top up even if it was almost full to control condensation, provide the max fuel safety reserve for a unexpected turn of events out on the water, and use the fuel as ballast as my boat is poded, with the onboard heavy motor gone and some added air floatation in the pod. The long fuel tank is 80 gal of added weight low right on the keel line which provides a little added stability to my boat in heavy seas but decreases fuel economy a very small amount – more than a fair trade off. A full tank also help the fuel tank baffles control sloshing in the tank to prevent water and fuel in the tank from emulsifying or at least keep it out of the fuel tank pickup tube which is usually up a little bit from the bottom of the tank where it picks up less water and crap that will clog up you fuel filters and water separator.
On my boat I would remove the small hatch covering access to the main fuel tank pick ups or even the large hatch (screwed down floor board used to access and replace the entire tank) after ensuring the angle of the boat is good on the trailer. You want it as flat as possible for testing and to keep the gas in the tank when you open the top of the tank. Make sure the current fuel level is low enough, say only about 60% full to keep the fuel in the tank when you open the tank or you will have another big problem on your hands.
A complete inspection of your tank and all fittings and fuel line clamps etc. and replacement as necessary, is also part of basic periodic boat maintenance. Fuel lines are cheap; swap them out as necessary but buy the expensive high end stainless marine hose clamps.
Since gas floats on water, get a clear dip tube and put it straight into the tank to the bottom and place your finger over it and remove and hold it straight up, then put another finger over the bottom of the dip tube. You should be able to see how much gas you have floating on how much water and possibly even how much little bits of crap are in the bottom of the fuel tank. Use a siphon tube connected to a dip tube and siphon/pump out as much of the water in the tank as you can while not removing the gas, you may also get some dirt which is a good thing. I have not had to do this but have looked at our tank and think it is possible. Don't know about your tank design and there may be other water drain access/options on your tank.
I would taste a tiny bit of the water removed from both the tank and fuel/water separator to see if it is fresh, salt or brackish water. You can probably even have it tested. If it is fresh or mostly fresh (which it should be) it is likely condensation but if there is a lot of it that could indicate rain water and perhaps a little sea water spray getting passed a bad seal on you gas filler cap assembly. I had this happen a little once with a very old filler cap assembly, replace it with a new assembly or at least replace the seal to be sure, especially if it is old or shows signs of leaking and they also are cheap. In my case the whole assembly was replaced. Don’t forget to hook up the static discharge wire to a metal fuel cap assembly.
If this does not solve your problem you are now past my level of experience and need the advice of marine mechanics, for things like bad water sensors, computer problems and possible issues with tank overfill line one way valves (very unlikely) and other causes I have no clue about.
PS - if your Merc Motor is designed the same as the big older Opti, the lower motor assembly has two drain tubes with one way check valves (little balls) in them that goes through the motor plate the lower cowling joins up to. These tubes and valves are designed to drain any rain/more likely sea water that gets inside your upper cowling assembly out of your motor. They get clogged up with dirt, grease and paint chips etc very easily and then the cowling can hold lots of sea water in for long periods of time. It drips out slowly but may stay their too long. This can cause a lot of preventable corrosion on a warm motor and lead to things like lower motor cooling fittings failing. Don’t know if this could somehow cause your problem and think it unlikely, but in my view it is critical maintenance item to add to your list to prevent other serious problem from occurring. To check and clean them on our Merc OPTI you remove the upper cowling and the two sides of the lower cowling and pull out the two drain tubes and check and clean them. You should be able to blow air through them and the check valve balls inside the tubes should move freely. If not keep cleaning them until they do or buy new ones. I did have a dealer Merc mechanic tell me that they sometimes pop out the check balls especially if the motor is mounted very low to the water. This means that salt water can get splashed or forced up the drain tubes into the motor compartment but also drains out quickly. I think they are there for a reason and it is best to leave them but also to check them frequently and keep the tubes and the check valve balls working freely. As I said that is on an older OPTI and on your 4stroke It may be different but worth checking out. Look up a parts diagram of your motor on line to see how you’re motor is designed to drain off water that gets inside the cowling, if it does at all.
Hope this helps and is not a lot of things you have already done.
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Tidal Chaos
Active Member
Good motor don't trade it in because your water in fuel alarm went off. Your guardian system for the motor will go off if there is a half a teaspoon in your castle filter. Remove the fuel lines and take the castle off and dump it out into a clean jar and see how much was actually in there. Once drained put it back together and check your racor, if you don't have one, get one, it will save you having these alarms if you drain it periodically.
You probably have condensation building up in your tank or your sending unit gasket needs to be checked or replaced and hopefully nothing major is wrong with your tank. Don't over think a little problem remove the sending unit from your tank and look inside you will be able to see the water in the bottom of your tank if there is a lot, lift the bow of your boat and let the water pool to the back of the tank a siphon it out with some clear tubeing it is quicker than having to drain racor or the castle multiple times. That is a good motor and the guardian system will save you money in the long run alarms go off before damage can occur rather than when it is too late. Good luck if you have any other questions PM me, I ran a verado for 8 years and loved it, I also had to learn to maintain the motor to stop the alarms if you don't do your trip checks you will have to listen to the alarm a couple times a year as it is there to save you money or major damage.
Birdsnest
Well-Known Member
Ive had some water issues in the past and it was always in rough weather where water was getting into the fuel vents. Not cool 30 miles offshore or anywhere for that matter. And the final straw for me was I left the gas cap off(embarrassing) and flooded the fuel tank with salt water on a rough day and that disabled me completely for the water flooded the system so fast that the alarm did not go off until it was too late. I even know how to drain the bowl to stop the alarms to keep operating but it was still too late the motor died at the same time the alarm went off. Ran the kicker till the gas in the line changed to water and that was that. Pan Pan. Dead in the water had to get a tow and it gladly cost me a flat of beer and some tuna splash boats, no prob.
For what I do the risk and down time just isnt worth it. My solution was to move the alarm out of the motor to the bottom of the raycor. Now I get ample warning before any water enters the system. I would still like to have that alarm in the motor tho as a double but I have to pass it by a merc rep and then splice the alarms together. No biggie.
Dangit I wish I never left that fuel cap off that day but it did lead to improvements in reliability. My fuel vent issue is resolved as well but I still feel that water is a looming issue in any marine environment especially out here with the high humidity. This was on an optimax. I will be getting a verodo in the spring with the same configuration.
For what I do the risk and down time just isnt worth it. My solution was to move the alarm out of the motor to the bottom of the raycor. Now I get ample warning before any water enters the system. I would still like to have that alarm in the motor tho as a double but I have to pass it by a merc rep and then splice the alarms together. No biggie.
Dangit I wish I never left that fuel cap off that day but it did lead to improvements in reliability. My fuel vent issue is resolved as well but I still feel that water is a looming issue in any marine environment especially out here with the high humidity. This was on an optimax. I will be getting a verodo in the spring with the same configuration.
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PS - my boat is old and some of what I told you is not that relevant if your boat is newer or also only has 67 hours on it. Having to do things like change out a filler cap or other tank work may be many years down the road for you. With only 67 hours on the motor you likely have full warranty, - mine is 2001.
Sounds like Tidal Chaos has some direct experience with your motor and great advice. I Like the Mercs and with good maintenance, the only alarm that has ever gone off on our 225 Opti is overheating caused by kelp blocking the cooling intakes. So far it has also never failed to start, touch wood.
Birds nest - I have always understood (could be wrong) that the hose connected to the through hull well above water line air/fuel fill overflow vents normally have a one way valve that is supposed to prevent sea water getting back into the tank in heavy seas.
Sounds like Tidal Chaos has some direct experience with your motor and great advice. I Like the Mercs and with good maintenance, the only alarm that has ever gone off on our 225 Opti is overheating caused by kelp blocking the cooling intakes. So far it has also never failed to start, touch wood.
Birds nest - I have always understood (could be wrong) that the hose connected to the through hull well above water line air/fuel fill overflow vents normally have a one way valve that is supposed to prevent sea water getting back into the tank in heavy seas.
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Birdsnest
Well-Known Member
Bit of a story to these vents. The original ones never took on water but I had to replace them due to corrosion. The new vents took on water big time so I had to find the old style and replace the new ones with new old style ones. Yes, I do have those valves and for some reason they are not working. I should look into that just for curiosity but the final solution will be to move the vents from each side up by the driver to the back wall of the stern.
I get a new motor every 3 years and when I chose this motor(opti200) verado's were fairly new and not proven reliable but it is clear now they are great motors. I soooo look forward to wireless controls!
If the valves are the floating ball type it may be that the valve needs to be mounted vertically straight up and down to work correctly and of course installed in the right director when filling or to allow air heating/fuel expansion. One can imagine a valve installed incorrectly facing the wrong direction but flat so the ball is not sealing letting some air and even a little fuel out of the tank in an overflow situation before autostop clicks in when pumping gas if you have not slowed down the fueling rate when you hear the fuel making the sound when it is close to full, so in that sense sort of working, but also letting sea water in on the ocean in heavy seas.
I assume they don't work under the same fuel pressure (fuel pump sucking) like the valves in the hand pump on fuel lines to prime the line but even with those I understand you are supposed to hold them facing the correct direction vertically up when hand pumping. The tank vent line valve would only seal from the sea water pressure and gravity even if mounted correctly. The vent hose valve could need testing and replacing if not sealing; a much simpler solution than trying to relocate them to the stern.
There may be safety reasons they don't want explosive gas vapor and gas spay out the stern near exhaust and motors and closer to electrics (sparks) or blowing in into the hull and being heavier than air sinking and staying in the hull building up over time. With an Outboard Motor you usually do not have a fan blowing out the hull gas vapor that you run before starting an inboard. Also a good reason for checking your tank and fuel lines once in a while for very small leaks/sweating at hose clamps etc. even if you don't smell gas and don't have an inboard, - helps avoid one would assume a very rare big bang. I would assume that boat manufactures spent lots of money determining where the optimal position on the hull was to install gas tank vent through hulls to protect themselves. There lawyers would tell them boats blowing up is a liability issue and their sales and advertising staff would tell them most people don't like the gas fumes although I have noticed a lot of sports fishermen don't see to mind the smell of kicker flooded carbs and old 2stroke exhaust.
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