WAY offshore safety

Mighty Sylvan

Active Member
I am really enjoying reading the Tuna threads and I don't want to derail them. I do have some questions. What would you do in case of engine failure? Obviously you would try to fix the problem, but what if it was not something that could be fixed on the water. Come home on the kicker?(15-20hrs would be my guess) Be towed by another member of the fleet? Would the Coast Guard be any help?:eek:
 
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The key to safety out there is good weather, and if you don't push the weather you won't die. If my main was to go down I would fire up the kicker and head for home. Maybe a little late for dinner though. I would alert Coast Gaurd and traffic services if possible so I don't get run over by a freighter. Remember your vhf radio won't reach land and cell dosen't work. I don't worry about being alone but traveling with a buddy is a good thing, and this weekend was a good example. Always could see someone on the horizon and were in radio contact as well.
If it was a life threatening situation, call mayday, and another boat may hear you and respond. Set off the epirb and wait.
 
Twin motors. To go with out is silly. I can make 13 knots on 1 and have had to do it before from 31 miles out and was still home for supper.

Also have a epirb for emergencies
 
Twin motors. To go with out is silly. I can make 13 knots on 1 and have had to do it before from 31 miles out and was still home for supper.

Also have a epirb for emergencies


And crew that can swim.....I was ready to go if we got into trouble...hahaha. ;) I was looking for a deadhead or some sort of debris to latch on to if we were goin' down! :rolleyes:



Hey Sylvan...

In all seriousness having only been out once but it is quite reassuring the way all the boats/guys are looking out for one another. I think the day we were out we were the second last to leave and we let the last boat out there know we were packing up and heading in but would monitor the radio "just in case".

As for engine troubles.....I sure don't think you would catch me out there without twin engines. Even with a single and a kicker I don't know that I would want to be under power with just a kicker racing encroaching weather for 50 miles. :eek:
 
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Fleet fishing makes a lot of sense. This Tuna fishing is going to get big.
I think you're right about that-seems to me that our waters are warming up-I've fished off WCVI for many years and it is only recently we have started to see H'bldt squid-the guys used to get Tuna maybe once or twice in Sept-never much closer than 50 miles-now we have guys getting them in early aug and from this thread I've seen 30 miles. Of course this may be due to increased excitment and knowledge but I suspect the Tuna opportunities will continue to grow and also I suspect sadly our salmon chances diminish as well
 
I have one suggestioon for all with single main and a kicker... change prop on kicker to a conventional style blade and get a prop shop to add some cup. Dunno how this would work on every boat, but my max speed on kicker was 5- 5.5mph - changed to a Solas 11p prop and WOT speed went to 8mph ( couldn't troll w the 11p prop tho, you'd need half trottle and the noise would drive you crazy ) So while it wouldn't be fun, you'd get back to the dock 40% faster.
 
Never had to do it or have it done-How fast can a 24 ft boat be safely towed in reasonable seas? I realize a longer rope is preferable-would or could it be any faster than a reasonable kicker speed say 6 to 7 knots? If the towed boat could have his kicker going for directional stability would that increase the speed and help with the safety of the tow?
 
In the Auxiliary Operations course AUXSAR (Auxiliary Search and Rescue); a sizeable portion of this course is about towing. This course provides all the theoretical information about towing. The course material states "Almost everything done during a tow is potentially hazardous; a successful tow is one during which no damage is done to the engine(s) of the towing vessel, no damage is sustained by either vessel, and no one sustains an injury."

Essentially, there are four factors that impact a towing situation: the hull characteristics of boat doing the towing, the hull characteristics of the boat being towed, the construction and diameter of the line used to tow the disabled vessel, and the sea state (waves, wind, and current). With all the different makes and models of vessels, as well as different line types, you can see that every tow is unique, making towing as much an art as it is a science.

I mentioned stress before, as one of the many reasons why you really need to learn how to tow a vessel before you actually just do it. There are three types of forces that a tow boat, the towed boat and the lines that connect them, undergo. These are: acceleration forces, steady forces and shock forces.

A brief definition will help you understand the dangers involved.

Acceleration Forces is the stress placed on the vessels and the towline during the time the towed and towing vessels are dead-in-the-water, to the time they reach their maximum (constant) towing speed.

Steady Forces is the stress placed on the vessels and the towline during the phase after maximum (constant) speed is reached. These forces are just involved in pulling the towed vessel through smooth water at a constant speed.

Shock Forces occur because of the sea state. Towing in calm, smooth water would produce little or no shock forces. Towing a vessel where there are five foot waves, at 30 second intervals would produce considerable shock forces. Just picture your boat slowing down and speeding up as it goes up and down waves. The towed boat is doing the exact same thing. But, they probably are not in synch, so the towline is being stretched and then goes slack, and then get pulled tightly again and stretches.

An average size vessel towing a vessel of equal size will, at a minimum, incur several hundred pounds of force, depending on the type of line used, sea state, etc. While many lines may contain ratings for several thousand pounds of force, those statistics are for brand new line. Lines that are well used, or that are weathered, are probably capable of sustaining loads much smaller that what they are rated for.

Deal Breakers - What Can Go Wrong, Usually Will

So great, now you know the factors that influence a tow and some basics on what the forces are - so what? Without doing all the math and physics involved, all you need to understand is this: Recreational vessels are often ill equipped to handle the stresses of towing for a variety of reasons:

While every piece of equipment has different breaking characteristics, given enough stress, any part of this towing system could break, and often with catastrophic results. If you must tow another vessel, examine its hardware (cleats, bits, etc) as well as your own to make sure it is bolted through.. Never attempt to tow another vessel using a "ski rope" or other lightweight line incapable of sustaining the stresses outlined above. Under no circumstance should anyone stand directly in line with the tow line, because if it were to break, it would "snap back" like a rubber band, wreaking havoc with everything in its path.
The cleats and deck fittings on most boats can only accommodate smaller lines; which limits the amount of force they can take, and thus the size of the vessel you an tow. How fast you tow another vessel can impact the forces exerted.
The pitch of most propellers on your average recreational vessel is geared towards maximizing speed of the vessel, not torque. Using the average propeller with a pitch of 19" or 21" results in a great deal of slip (inefficient movement of water through the propeller), making towing inefficient and stressful on an engine.
The amount of power it takes to tow a vessel, if done improperly could cause serious damage to one of the most expensive pieces of equipment in your vessel - your engine(s)
The average recreational vessel does not carry lines of the length that may be necessary to minimize the shock forces by keeping the vessels "in step" with one another. It is important to adjust the length of the tow line to minimize the shock forces caused by wind, waves, and/or current.
If the boat doing the towing is an outboard or an inboard/outboard, you have another potential disaster - getting the towline caught in the prop of the tow vessel. At the very least, this usually means cutting the tow line free from the prop, to totally disabling the tow boat, resulting in the need for another potential tow.
Given the information above, I hope you can see that there are a myriad number of things that can go wrong when towing another vessel. In any case, if I was a professional gambler who was asked to bet on whether the average recreational boater could tow another boat without incident, I would pass, as the odds favor the house. The "house" here is the fact that you'll likely experience damage to either the towed boat, the towing boat, or that someone on either vessel would sustain an injury.
 
I could not afford twin motors. I go with a main and a kicker. The kicker will do 6kn. I have already run in on a kicker 30 miles. That took a long time, 5 hours and it wasn't really nice that day but only doing 6 kn only made the long ride far nicer. I carry a PLB around my neck the whole trip. And now I take 2 radio's. Radar, GPS, Compass, and my Iphone...mandatory for me. My iphone has a backup marine gps and a compass in it and the app shipfinder. I would not ask to be towed in unless I had an emergency such as loosing both motors but when the first motor is gone I would certainly register with the coastguard(tofino trafic VHF ch 77) to monitor my progress. A thourough understanding of ocean weather is fairly important, no, its very very important. The more one understands the weather the more opportunity will present itself. Basicaly you need less than k10 knots of wind with the smallest posibility of it blowing greater than 15 kn. But before one settles on wind conditions alone it is important to understand sea state and that can be a bit complicated. Swell hight and period are two different facters that really need to be understood well.
Back to wind, It is not uncomon for it to be glass on shore and blowing on the grounds and the opposite. I have gone out and fished glassy water all day out there only to find that the closer we come to shore on the run in the harder it is blowing. One time it was glass out there and by the time we reached 12 miles in, it was blowing 20 gusting 25! What a rash that was. We are lucky here in Tofino for we have for the most part 2 common wind directions. NW and SE and when we run to the grounds we run SW and run NE back to town. The bottom line is there are no garentees. This year I have made about 16 trips. Half of the time I was skunked and half of the time, weather we caught fish or not, I had my butt handed to me even though the weather was nice. All that grindy pounding really aids digestion though. I usualy go in a 24 foot aluminum boat. It is the smallest boat I have seen out there and it is not the ideal boat for it but it is the one I know and can afford. This type of fishing is not for everybody.
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Good post Casper. For the reasons in your post I would avoid a tow until the need was undeniable.
 
Awesome post, Casper. There is some good info for folks to ponder. I have to add some of my experiences that might help others out too. We towed a vessel across Queen Charlotte Strait that was the same size vessel as ours, using two 150 hp outboards. We should have had 1/2 tank (90 gal tank) of fuel after arriving at Port Hardy, but O/B's are designed for top-end use and not bottom-end pulling power. We had to turn the disabled vessel over to a diesel powered boat to finish the tow and made it into harbour on fumes.

We generally tow from the anchor of the disabled vessel as this reduces the snap of the tow line when the following vessel skates down the wave and quite often turns to one side or the other. It helps to hang something like a tire or buoy off the stern to help keep the disabled vessel straight and maintain even pressure on the tow line.

Hopefully no one will need a tow, but it does happen and constant contact with each other will help minimize any problems while under way.
 
I dont have alot to add other then,

If you break down in the ocean and its -8 C in janurary duck hunting and you are in a 16.5 flatbottom welded alum, and rescued by the aux Coast Coard, get in there boat while they tow you in!

Shitshow.jpg
 
Always remember- if you "abandone ship" always step UP ---the coast guard usually finds a hull easier than the victims--stay close! As to towing a disabled vessel in unstable water/wind condition- it is an option to raft up with the disabled boat and come to shore in tandem--as Casper stated in his excellent post--we are not generally equipped to tow either the rope is too weak or the mounting point on your boat will not handle the load accompanied by shock forces. No sense losing your rope or pieces of your boat---tug boats are built for towing- sport fishing boats are not generally up to the task.
Birdsnest- does your i-phone work 30 miles out? Is one of your radios satellite friendly? I have a blackberry and it doesn't work half the time in port-LOL
 
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Birdsnest- does your i-phone work 30 miles out? Is one of your radios satellite friendly? I have a blackberry and it doesn't work half the time in port-LOL

The Marine GPS App on my phone works very well out of service. Ship finder needs service so it really is only good on the way out. None of my radio's are sat friendly. What is a sat friendly radio?

VHF CH 74 Tofino traffic. Thank you for the correction.
 
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