This the "Year Of The Spoon"?

[Karlo]

For me, fishing all season on Haida Gwaii, it's been a lure-of-the-year revolving door the last few seasons. Five years ago, one of my charter-operator buddies was hooking up as fast as he could get the gear down while everyone else was scratching, and when I complimented him on being a great fisherman and wonderful human being as he went by, he asked if I had any 5.5" 50/50 Clendon Stewarts. I did because three years before, another friend who was guiding up at Langara had convinced me that they were great, but I'd never has any luck with them. Sure enough, that's what the springs wanted, and they wanted them all summer. The next year, and every year since, they didn't want them at all.

What they wanted the next year was an Army Truck hoochie, and they really wanted it. But though I still give them an early try if I need to try something besides what I started with, the fish have never wanted them quite as desperately since.

That's because they decided they wanted True Rolls, especially the blue ones. They were expensive, but we all raided the piggy bank and stocked up. But by the next year, salmon fashion dictated that you needed a 3.5" Green Glow Coyote spoon, and the True Roll hasn't done anything for me lately. I'm willing to sell...

On the other hand, a 4" Cop Car spoon ....

Going through my tackle box is like descending into the Grand Canyon, with each layer revealing the fossilized remains of various Usedtowork epochs . I know that If I were to dig deep enough, I'd hit a layer of Apexes, then one of Superior spoons, etc.

I'm going out in the morning, and I'll have an anchovy on one side, and a Coyote on the other to start. After that, who knows?

 

[SpringVelocity]

Everybody should have the Silver Horde "Irish Crème" spoon (in a few different sizes) in their artillery......

That spoon is one of the very good ones out there....works in a lot of places.

I tried that one in Sooke quite a bit...doesn't seem to do as good as nanaimo for big guys. It worked well for coho and the teen springs...

One other that surprised me was the green kitchen sink in any size. Had a number of fairly large springs take that one...

 

[onefish]

yes.....but always made me wonder about the infamous "commy" spoons......


Never heard a bad word about commy spoons...........they are the commy's bread and butter I'm told.

But yet........I would bet that the average sporty has maybe 2 or 3 commy spoons in the tackle box.......that are never fished. They were procured from Grand-dad...and are taken out and looked at from time to time.

If commy spoons are that good....then why are people buying every other spoon but those?

I've been to PNT countless times for example.....and no-one ever goes to the commy spoon section and pick out a few and plunk them on the counter.

You will see them plunk TKO's, Silver Hordes, Coho-killers, hoochys and Coyotes on the counter...but never commy spoons.

You see the odd post here where a guy will fish one.........the other 99% of spoons posts they are fishing something else.

Now they know, I know, and you know that we should be buying commy spoons......because commies use them and they work...

So why do we punish and deny ourselves by buying something else?

Commy spoons as you call them are NOT fished behind flashers. Glendon stewarts, Super diamond, Diamond Lance and the like are used in various metal finishes and are fished on there own. Most sport fishermen use spoons behind a flasher. Commercial trollers use hoochies behind flashers.
In my years as a troller hoochies and flashers were far and away the most productive. Spoons and plugs accounted for the rest of the chinook catch. Sometimes when you get certain plugs working they are hard to beat but when push comes the shove flashers and hoochies rule the day.
Of course commercial fishing you have an added benefit of using enough gear to actually experiment with various colours to try and dial in what is working the best.
Try running a short flasher with no hook on the lead and then a naked spoon off the rigger above the flasher. In this case those commie spoons might surprise you in how effective they can be : )

 

[Seafever]

hhmm....well I've fished PAL "commy" spoons behind a flasher.......and they work for me.....


Anyhow...there's virtually no set rules for fishing

You experiment.......if it works you're good to go.....

Insanity is fishing the same the same stuff over and over with no results.......

 

[SteelyDan]

I have a whack loadbof clendon stewerds that I admit I have never fished. Had one of those weak I wish I was fishing moments when I picked them up. But on a side note my source for made in USA coyotes has dried up! Argggg

 

[SteelyDan]

Commy spoons as you call them are NOT fished behind flashers. Glendon stewarts, Super diamond, Diamond Lance and the like are used in various metal finishes and are fished on there own. Most sport fishermen use spoons behind a flasher. Commercial trollers use hoochies behind flashers.
In my years as a troller hoochies and flashers were far and away the most productive. Spoons and plugs accounted for the rest of the chinook catch. Sometimes when you get certain plugs working they are hard to beat but when push comes the shove flashers and hoochies rule the day.
Of course commercial fishing you have an added benefit of using enough gear to actually experiment with various colours to try and dial in what is working the best.
Try running a short flasher with no hook on the lead and then a naked spoon off the rigger above the flasher. In this case those commie spoons might surprise you in how effective they can be : )

how fast were you guys trollinh your hoochies and what length of leader? Always like to hear what the commercial guys are doing.

 

[Karma-Kazi]

I have a whack loadbof clendon stewerds that I admit I have never fished. Had one of those weak I wish I was fishing moments when I picked them up. But on a side note my source for made in USA coyotes has dried up! Argggg

Im down to about a dozen USA coyotes and god danm do they fish. 5-1 to the new ones! I guard the old ones with my life! Especially the Yellowtail.

-KK

 

[Karma-Kazi]

Haven't run a flasher on my line in 10 months. I would say my success is virtually the same if not better. Maybe those commies know a thing or two about catching chinooks.

Commy spoons as you call them are NOT fished behind flashers. Glendon stewarts, Super diamond, Diamond Lance and the like are used in various metal finishes and are fished on there own. Most sport fishermen use spoons behind a flasher. Commercial trollers use hoochies behind flashers.
In my years as a troller hoochies and flashers were far and away the most productive. Spoons and plugs accounted for the rest of the chinook catch. Sometimes when you get certain plugs working they are hard to beat but when push comes the shove flashers and hoochies rule the day.
Of course commercial fishing you have an added benefit of using enough gear to actually experiment with various colours to try and dial in what is working the best.
Try running a short flasher with no hook on the lead and then a naked spoon off the rigger above the flasher. In this case those commie spoons might surprise you in how effective they can be : )

 

[fishin_magician]

how fast were you guys trollinh your hoochies and what length of leader? Always like to hear what the commercial guys are doing.

The classic 18 foot off the wire on 42" leaders with 60-70 pound test leaders is standard....7/0 to 9/0 hooks on a single barrel swivel... Classic.

 

[wishiniwasfishin1]

I guess there are a couple glaring differences between commy and sportie spoons -

Commy spoons tend to be plated brass - usually a solid or combo of copper, brass, nickel, chrome, gold, etc. They are heavier gauge metal. The metal is stamped in some pretty intricate and detailed patterns, and the level of polish involved before the plating stage is notable - as they will be polished to at least 400 grit before plating (the plating job is only as good as the pre polish).

Sportie spoons tend to be painted - usually with some element of glow or UV. They all tend to be the same basic punched shape (coyote, silver horde, etc.) Is this because this shape is the most effective? Perhaps, or perhaps the dies are the simplest and these shapes are the cheapest to make. Also, a painted spoon does not need to be polished at all, in fact the opposite is true - they need to be roughed up for the paint to stick. Paint is cheap. The metal is lighter gauge, some so light they can be bent easily with two fingers.

So, one spoon is heavy, plated metal and the other is light gauge painted metal. They both seem to work.

SPorties don't really fish commy spoons, and commies don't fish sporties. I guess we could ask the opposite of Seafevers original question... Why don't commies use sporty spoons? - Maybe they do but from what I have read they stick to the plated metal spoons...

 

[fishin_magician]

I guess there are a couple glaring differences between commy and sportie spoons -

Commy spoons tend to be plated brass - usually a solid or combo of copper, brass, nickel, chrome, gold, etc. They are heavier gauge metal. The metal is stamped in some pretty intricate and detailed patterns, and the level of polish involved before the plating stage is notable - as they will be polished to at least 400 grit before plating (the plating job is only as good as the pre polish).

Sportie spoons tend to be painted - usually with some element of glow or UV. They all tend to be the same basic punched shape (coyote, silver horde, etc.) Is this because this shape is the most effective? Perhaps, or perhaps the dies are the simplest and these shapes are the cheapest to make. Also, a painted spoon does not need to be polished at all, in fact the opposite is true - they need to be roughed up for the paint to stick. Paint is cheap. The metal is lighter gauge, some so light they can be bent easily with two fingers.

So, one spoon is heavy, plated metal and the other is light gauge painted metal. They both seem to work.

SPorties don't really fish commy spoons, and commies don't fish sporties. I guess we could ask the opposite of Seafevers original question... Why don't commies use sporty spoons? - Maybe they do but from what I have read they stick to the plated metal spoons...

Trollers do...on occasion for good reason, use painted commercial spoons and/or traditional finished spoons and/or sport tackle. I can tell you I have seen commercial trollers trolling Coyotes or thin bladed throw aways..for good reason!!!

WishinIwasfishin, commercial spoons aren't all they are cracked up to be in all situations. From my experience, in south coast inside waters right now sport tackle will out produce commercial tackle by far....

Try it, buy some Clendon Stewarts in 5.5 or 6, run them on all your lines with no flashers, and watch the guy next boat over limit on his flashers with Irish Creams and G Force spoons behind them while you're half way to your limit...if that. Flashers are a must right now at this time of year.


Have fun!

 

[onefish]

Most commercial guys tune up their own gear, leader lengths, hook sizes, spoon or plug sizes and finishes, flasher tow lengths, wire types, size of leads etc etc etc and then get their gear working for them.

Sport fishing is no different. Everybody uses different stuff and then tries to get it working on their boat. That is half the fun.

 

[Seafever]

Coyote and "KingFisher Lite" spoons......(and most of the light-gauge spoons) aren't necessarily designed to be run behind flashers........

They make them that way so they have good action at multi-speeds.

Flashers are simply an option.....as far as spoons go.

You can use a spoon by itself without flashers....with dummy flashers.......or with a regular flasher.......it's your call.

This time of year I prefer spoons in the 2 1/2 inch to 4 inch length .

The 50/50 metal spoons such as Brass/Chrome etc etc.......have another thing going for them....they produce voltage......I've talked to guys who complain about using S/S hooks with these 50/50's .....the combo of Brass/Chrome/SS starts the galvanic action........some say this good as a fish attractor...some not somuch.

This galvanic action produces noticeable deterioration on spoons like a big 50/50 Wonderspoon.

Which is why you often see brownish discolored eroded Wonder spoons in Gramp's tacklebox. Then you think he was too lazy to polish them. Actually he wasn't,he was deliberately fishing them that way.

Because they work......like that.

 

[Karma-Kazi]

Coyote and "KingFisher Lite" spoons......(and most of the light-gauge spoons) aren't necessarily designed to be run behind flashers........

They make them that way so they have good action at multi-speeds.

Flashers are simply an option.....as far as spoons go.

You can use a spoon by itself without flashers....with dummy flashers.......or with a regular flasher.......it's your call.

This time of year I prefer spoons in the 2 1/2 inch to 4 inch length .

The 50/50 metal spoons such as Brass/Chrome etc etc.......have another thing going for them....they produce voltage......I've talked to guys who complain about using S/S hooks with these 50/50's .....the combo of Brass/Chrome/SS starts the galvanic action........some say this good as a fish attractor...some not somuch.

This galvanic action produces noticeable deterioration on spoons like a big 50/50 Wonderspoon.

Which is why you often see brownish discolored eroded Wonder spoons in Gramp's tacklebox. Then you think he was too lazy to polish them. Actually he wasn't,he was deliberately fishing them that way.

Because they work......like that.

I think you might be giving all the secrets away now. SHHHHHH

 

[fishin_magician]

If I was commercial fishing in the gulf for springs I would be running flashers and hoochies. If I did run spoons I would be using spoons on the small side, probably diamond lances certainly not 5.5 or 6 Glendon Stewarts.

The commercial trollers don't run naked coyote type spoons because they are too lightly built and are designed to be run behind a flasher while the commercial spoons are designed to not need a flasher. As in all fishing you can change the intended uses and catch fish.

Because of the cost of having a set of all the different types of flashers would be outrageous most commercial trollers stick to one or two types of flashers. The most popular flasher by far is a good old silver hot spot flasher, red or green for springs and coho and green or blue for sockeye, pinks and chum.

I used 36 inch leaders for octopus and cuddlefish, 42 inchs for needlefish. On the west coast leaders I never went heavier than 60lb and I prefered 5/0 hooks. The guys up north use heavier on everything as the fish tend to be bigger and shallower.

As far as speed goes, there is no set speed. The worst thing you can do is use SOG as your measure as the SOG changes dramatically depending if you are going with or against the tide/current. Once you find a speed that is working, then use SOG. I always used the angle of my line as an indicator to speed because it is the speed in the water that counts. If the lines start to hang too vertical, speed up. If they are hanging way back, slow down. Find a range that usually works for YOUR gear and start there, then adjust according to what is working on that day.

Most commercial guys tune up their own gear, leader lengths, hook sizes, spoon or plug sizes and finishes, flasher tow lengths, wire types, size of leads etc etc etc and then get their gear working for them.

Sport fishing is no different. Everybody uses different stuff and then tries to get it working on their boat. That is half the fun.

Ok, I'll tell those guys who were fishing WCVI in April that their score was a fluke using 5.0 Coyotes with a 9510 Mustad. (The Coyote started life in the 70's and was then known as the Westport Wobbler and was stamped out of Brass and a commercial trolling spoon) and was likely 40% stronger than the Made in USA stuff which was sport targeted) and the fact they were putting the second most chinooks in the box through the opening must have been some kind of intervention. They were towing them behind Blue Hot Spots.

Diamond Lances work well at times. I had a 232 and a 700 painted Diamond Lance which wouldn't catch a cold at a Thrasher one afternoon, while the other sport junk kept getting all the action--double digits. I have a few in 212 and 500 too, but Chinooks are fussy on colour sometimes.

The Clendon Stewarts should work off ECVI for 15-25 pounders...The Chinooks are chowing on 5-6" Herring right now.

 

[mhbradley]

I think you might be giving all the secrets away now. SHHHHHH

He's passing on secrets to those that didn't get to fish with Granpa.....

 

[Seafever]

Strange when you think about it.....

A spoon is just a piece of metal.

Fishing should not be complicated. You pick a lure that resembles what they're eating and you fish it. In a place and depth where the fish are.

"resembles what they're eating'.........

No fish down there looks like

an Irish Crème spoon
a No Bananas spoon
A Wonder spoon
A 50/50 Clendon Stewart
A Cop car spoon
A Mongoose spoon
An Army Truck spoon

or any one of a boatload of other spoons............but they all catch fish.


An Apex doesn't look like anything.....

A Buzzbomb doesn't look like a fish.

A lot of times the artificials (that don't look like a fish) will outfish real bait.

Fish are pretty stupid if they can't tell the difference between a piece of pressed metal or rubber and real food.

The fact that we're dealing with a life-form that is on the absolute low end of the intellect scale gets pretty complicated it seems.



Most plugs look more like a squid than a baitfish.

 

[wishiniwasfishin1]

Fish are pretty stupid if they can't tell the difference between a piece of pressed metal or rubber and real food.

The fact that we're dealing with a life-form that is on the absolute low end of the intellect scale ......

Yet, they hatch and swim for four years covering thousands of miles in the unforgiving pacific only to return and spawn within feet of where they born in their native stream...

 

[Seafever]

Yep....just like all the birds that know where to fly on migration.

It would seem that a lot of animals don't "think"...they just "respond"........ to stimuli.

Like if you bundle up a ragtag piece of fur and pull it along the ground...you can get dogs (and cougars that I've seen on video docs) as well as other animals to attack it.

In bullfights the bull is responding to the movement of the material...not the color red. Obviously the bull isn't thinking "hey wait...what the hell am I doing in this ring chasing a piece of cloth?"

So if lures match any of the "response triggers" necessary for an attack...the fish will hit it, even though they don't consciously think about it.

 

[Pippen]

Flashers are a must right now at this time of year.


Have fun!

I agree but a buddy proved that theory not 100% true as he ran a small 3.5 spoon at Thrasher down about 120'.....hooked 6 and 5 were on the naked spoon. Bonked I think 4 of them on Easter weekend.


Same buddy was out at the Hump last night....hooked a couple but a pain in the arse seal that followed them all night took them both...and a gaff went overboard trying to 'discourage' the seal right by the boat.