New Year ling/hali opening???

[Doug]

Tailspin

Your comment (Dont insinuate! Saying more charters should have showed, is negativly discouraging) I don't understand because it is negative and discouraging for the people who showed up to find few of the people who fish 100+ days each year not showed up. It's becoming discouraging to attend and maybe I'm wasting my time attending and should jump on the no show boat.

Insinuate?? I'm just stating facts. Out of all the people (maybe 60) attending the meeting maybe 10% of the entire south coast charter operators fleet showed up.

Flu, hunting, snow are all good reasons but %90 no show???

We really need everyone to get involved or the next few years will be the death of us all.

 

[chris73]

"...I do believe DFO would actually pay attention then..." (how do you do a quote?)

Greater attendance would be awesome however I do not think DFO would be directly much influenced by that. If the DFO guy is intimidated enough then they will just send a new fresh guy - as we have just seen. What is of much more importance is that our leaders (Chris Bos, Gerry Kristiansen and more) feel that an overwhelming majority of us wants and stands for reform and then they can feel encouraged to carry on and intensify their ongoing battle with the evil forces. They can make it happen as they can negotiate with DFO and others. DFO does not negotiate with you all - as you have probably noticed throughout your letter campaigns. But if our various leaders feel the urge of the masses then they can and will apply appropriate pressure at the right places. Just my 2 cents.

 

[Deewar25]

Greater attendance would be awesome however I do not think DFO would be directly much influenced by that. If the DFO guy is intimidated enough then they will just send a new fresh guy - as we have just seen. What is of much more importance is that our leaders (Chris Bos, Gerry Kristiansen and more) feel that an overwhelming majority of us wants and stands for reform and then they can feel encouraged to carry on and intensify their ongoing battle with the evil forces. They can make it happen as they can negotiate with DFO and others. DFO does not negotiate with you all - as you have probably noticed throughout your letter campaigns. But if our various leaders feel the urge of the masses then they can and will apply appropriate pressure at the right places. Just my 2 cents.

Don't know if it would have much influence, but you know...the ol strength in numbers. If there are 5-10 people every time, they feel they can basically do what they want against the minority, but if you are talking 100's, there has to be some recognition of how important we feel the issues are. Obviously the whipping boy they send each time report back to the seniors. Means much more for him to come back and say, "crap, they are getting real pissed over there in Victoria, and they are coming in forces, we perhaps should start listening before it gets ugly!" Is it really that much effort to do that twice a year? At the very least, we are showing support for the great work done by Chris and Gerry as you say.

The letter writing is crap in my books...seen enough of the word for word form letters in reply and Shea's servants coming back with 'yeah, that's concerning, I'll look into that, wink wink' comments.

 

[chris73]

I'll look into that, wink wink' comments.

Wow, they promised you way more than they ever did to me. I only ever hear: "Don't worry. We got it all under control."

Lol

 

[Deewar25]

FYI...got word back from the TC contact I deal with and 1/4 page ads run $950, 1/8 page run $475..these can be anywhere in the paper (I'd say local news page best or maybe sports). 1/8 page - 48 people at $10, or 24 people at $20? I'd certainly be willing to make all the arrangements assuming Chris B was ok with it. There definitely hasn't been the advertising for these meetings and I think the whole City should really get a good heads up and once they are on the email list, it can only grow from there. If there are way more people than the room can hold, all the better for effect. Food for thought for spring when I'm sure we will all be screaming about when the openings will be.

 

[Tailspin]

I hear you Doug...maybe a keg or two would assist with numbers?

 

[the fog ducker]

Doug , % 80 outta Country , is this the norm for all Charter establishments ?
how many Halibut do your clients take home with them ? Who benefits this ?

FD

I agree with Deewar we need more people to attend. Local fisherman and specially charter operators.

80% of my clients come from outside of Canada and 90% of them have never fished for salmon or halis before and will never fish for them again, so they don't care. The other 20% of my clients are Canadians and 50% of them have never fished for salmon or halis so do you think they care. They all buy their fish from the store and will the store fish supplies be effected, NO.

Where do I send my $10 to start the process.

 

[Sushihunter]

FYI...got word back from the TC contact I deal with and 1/4 page ads run $950, 1/8 page run $475..these can be anywhere in the paper (I'd say local news page best or maybe sports). 1/8 page - 48 people at $10, or 24 people at $20? I'd certainly be willing to make all the arrangements assuming Chris B was ok with it. There definitely hasn't been the advertising for these meetings and I think the whole City should really get a good heads up and once they are on the email list, it can only grow from there. If there are way more people than the room can hold, all the better for effect. Food for thought for spring when I'm sure we will all be screaming about when the openings will be.

If you are thinking of paid advertising, then consider this option:

Instead of a display ad in the paper, print up a double sided 8.5" X 11" flyer on regular paper, nothing fancy, but print on one of the bright color papers with black ink and then have the flyer inserted into the newspaper on the day you want it out.

Cost is much less than if you pay for column inches in the paper.

Also, explain to the newspaper that it is being paid for with volunteer donations and see if you can get some type of discount. Also ask them to print an equal amount of editorial on the subject, and give them access to experts they can interview.

This could help in getting the biggest bang for the buck.

Also, might want to have some sort of inducement to get people to the meeting - a draw for a Halibut fishing trip would be ideal. Give them a reason to come to the meeting other than to listen to a bunch of angry old white men screaming about the gubermint.

 

[Mi Chica]

DFo claims rec fishery over TAC, but their method of determining catch is absolutely not believable. They use creel checks (?) and flyovers to determine numbers caught, then guess. Being that most rec caught hali have not been "checked" by creel check or any other reporting system, and flyovers only tell them how many boats on the water (not what is being targeted or caught). In other words they have no system and they are making wild guesses. Even going by the number of rec guide/guest hali reported will demonstrate that the DFO numbers are simply not believable. It will probably need a court challenge to force this issue, as the gov't does not seem to want to deal with the issue in a constructive fashion.

 

[Deewar25]

Right track sushi...perhaps getting DC Reid in the loop for a blurb about it to coincide with announcement?
Those prices are actually current 'special' prices that are same or cheaper than charitable rates (not just a marketing ploy they are pulling over me as I take out ads each year for our derby, so I know the true prices). Regular 1/4 page runs $1800+ last I checked. They will be running these prices for a year so would apply in spring. I am not really sure if its worthwhile to use inserts as I personally rarely look through them and just chuck them away (except for boxing day maybe). I'd expect that to be the norm for most readers. I do, however, always read A3 (local) and of course sports. Obviously if we go ahead with something like this, we can discuss best route when the time comes.

As for inducement...hard to say. Would be unfortunate if we had to bribe people to come out to defend THEIR resource. I think it's a better fight if we are all there for the right reasons and willing to listen and support the angry white men (just as many under 50 if not more have been vocal at the last two though - this isn't like I assume it is up island!).

If one of the local guides felt this was a good idea though and wanted to offer up a trip for the cause, that's fine with me! ha

 

[fish4all]

has there not been a letter writing campaign going? We missed the meeting because we got stuck in Uclulet? If there is, is there a draft or outline? I am the ***** at composing.

 

[Rum Buddies]

Save the money for the ad and hire someone to write an article for you and pitch it to the TC instead.

Print advertising is not a one off thing, placing one ad never works. Print ads need to be placed over and over and over again until they have any impact on the reader.

However if you can write and pitch an article to the TC they will most likely print the article. A good portion of the articles you read in newspapers are recycled/reworded press releases.

I'm all for getting involved and Chris, anybody else involved with SFAB does amazing thankless work and has my utmost respect. But, I've been to many meetings and every one turns into a ***** fest at the end. Chris Bos and those guys are the ones making things happen and they need our support but is another butt in a seat going to do anything?

I'd say that 100 mailed letters with a single coherent message to DFO/newspapers would have more impact then 100 bodies in a room listening to an update on whats going on. A lot of guys aren't going to be involved with everything, so pick what is really effective and important and focus on getting joe angler doing that AND KEEP THE MESSAGE CONSISTENT!

Right track sushi...perhaps getting DC Reid in the loop for a blurb about it to coincide with announcement?

This is where PR comes into play! Write a press release, have someone call DC reid up and pitch the story and have him run the info for "free".

FYI to hire a publicist to write a press release and pitch it directly to relevant members of the media (dc reid, a-channel, check 6 etc.) would cost well under $900. When done right PR is the most cost effective method of marketing there is.

 

[sammyslabber]

Let's see re;sfab meeting 886 viewed 13 replied 52 showed Most Canadians are apathetic like to complain but do very little else or maybe just feel the govt. is is what govt. does . Like doug says offer a door prize maybe get the marinas or Oak bay marine group involved after all they benfit from our patronage.

 

[scott craven]

The general public(non fisher-people) probably couldn't care less about our right to fish.
Quite the contrary actually, in fact the whales,first nations etc. will always be first and foremost.
let's not forget, when most people want fish for dinner they go to the grocery store.
Given that, how would you put an ad to press that would advocate our position?

 

[Deewar25]

poppa, fish4all...letters, that was the angle we took 3 meetings ago - no idea how many sent letters, but everyone that did, got the same form letter reply from them, and alas, not a SINGLE thing has come out of that route. Sammy, yep, truth in that...whole lot of people will *****, but only a small % actually try to be proactive. That is what needs to change before it comes to the point of having no fishery left. If we gotta get nude calendar models offering massages to these meetings to bring people out, maybe thats the way to go!?!? OBMG, they are involved and have represented at the meeting.

Craven...wasn't my point on the paper ad, its not to bring exposure to the issue, but to alert everyone that SFAB actually exists and if you want to fight for your right to fish, you should attend the meeting and voice opinion. As far as I know, besides this forum, email lists compiled of past attendees, and the occasional note in a fishing blog or such, there is no other advertising about it. I am looking for at least the opportunity to get the word out to every fisher in Victoria so they can attend the meetings. Show some real numbers, show people care...sure 500 is ambitious and unlikely, but hey, even 200 would send a better message.

It's something...or perhaps I should just go back, sit on the couch and watch tv, and count the days until we can't fish any more.

 

[scott craven]

I wouldn't suggest that, but there has to be a directive in order to get the general public onside.
Otherwise, you are just spinning your wheels.
Don't get me wrong, i am just as passionate about this as anyone on the forum.
my point is that unless you have a huge majority demanding change it won't happen
you can call it pessimism, but in fact it is realism.

The only way to create change is to vote the current gov't out
and elect officials that understand what the public want.

 

[profisher]

The best way to get a politicians attention, make them squirm and have a change of heart is to embarrass them. The best hope for a quick change of the 88-12 split is to mount a media campaign showing videos like the one on this site with thousands of dead halibut being thrown off the side of the Alaskan trawler. Its a simple message that is simple and the public will take to heart. The message is " governments are supporting a morally, environmentally and economically destructive commercial fishery that makes a few individuals wealthy and all the while tell sport fishermen they aren't entitled to enough fish to support their traditional halibut fishery". Once you have the publics attention on the issue then feed them more info and dirt to keep the pressure on.

 

[Fish-Hunter]

Some very good points have been discussed in this thread, and lots of great ideas. But what I see is a lack of organization on a united front, and that is what governments and bodies of power rely upon to maintain their own "control".

Forgive my ignorance on this one, What is SFAB?? I do not know what this is, and what do they do for the disconnected sport fisherpeople? It sounds, by reference as though it is a (volunteer?) fishing council?? It is my ignorance on this in itself, that brought this thought to mind.

What we need is a Salt-Water Sport Fishing Council (since we like acronyms) SWSFC to represent the Salt Water Sport Fishing group. Again, frogive my ignorance if something like this already exists, but if it does then we need to make it a commonplace name to ALL fishermen. We All know that we need boat licences, fishing licences etc... we also all need to know if there is a council that collectively stands up for our rights and priveledges to fish. To do this we need to organize!!!

We could all become members of the said council for a yearly fee ( I don't think that $20-30 per license holder is out of the question). This would get us all together into a group so that the council could educate us as to what they actually fight for on our behalf, keep us up to date on current fishing conservation issues, where and when meetings are and what they are concerning (and how the outcomes could affect us), when and where volunteer work is needed. In general it would put all of the information that we all need to pay attention to in order to maintain our fisheries and have real input in make proactive change, instead of just letting the DFO do it for us. (WE ALL CAN SEE WHAT THAT IS GOING TO DO FOR US). So let's all get involved in any way that we can.

I don't think that it would be all that hard to organize with all of the retailers that sell products to the Sport Fishing Market, to get involved in selling the memberships and signing up all the sport fishing liscense holders that come into thier stores to purchase liscences and gear. It would after all be in their best intrest to have the Sport fishing industry last so that they can keep selling products to all of us. I am sure that most of them would also be willing to contribute to a well run and organized council that fights to maintain the sport fishing industry.

As for the people that would run the council, it does sound like there is already a lot of very "fishing smart people" that are currently working at the issues we need addressed, but it sounds like they need SUPPORT from the individuals like you and me. So let's get united, get involved, and make the changes necessary to keep our sport fishing going. I've got $40 bucks in my pocket that I would put toward something like this.

(How much do we spend on coffee, cigs, booze, lotto tickets, FISHING, etc... in a year? We ALL can afford to support an organization like this, we need to!).

That's my two cents.
Jay.

 

[Derby]

Something is in the works to get everyone on the same page in the next couple weeks.
For those of you that have not taken a look -Please go to the SFI -Sport fishing Institute of British Columbia
web page-www.sportfishing.bc.ca

Take a look- become a member- ask them what you can do-These people have been working very hard on your behalf and more than ever need your support.

 

[chris73]

my point is that unless you have a huge majority demanding change it won't happen
you can call it pessimism, but in fact it is realism.

The only way to create change is to vote the current gov't out
and elect officials that understand what the public want. QUOTE]

Correct and the best example is the HST recall. Look how much effort and support it took to appeal this decision andhow long they are able to drag it out. Change does not come easy against the governments will. Either the government is replaced with people in favour of your fancies or you better start a near revolution before you can change an existing governments decision. Our current efforts are not nearly enough I think.

Fish Hunter: No need to create another entity and collect new fees. If you want to make a contribution then utilize existing tools and get involved. The infrastructure is all there. What's needed desperately are leaders, doers, makers - most people are unfortunately lookers, talkers and wonderers. Not just with this topic - everywhere. Very few gifted leaders amongst people. Look at your work, team sport or volunteer group - always a few that do 90% of the work and many that will come and harvest and brag and talk while doing 10% of the work.