Downrigger Cable Voltage
- Thread starter lure-washer
- Start date
I like the wire and will stick with it. Braid is too abrasion prone IMO and I have seen braid break during a line tangle when the lines rub on each other. In this regard wire is much tougher. I just hate that no one seems to sell the good 316 stainless steel wire anymore. Used to get 4-5 years out of it. The crap they sell now is 304 SS and only lasts a couple of years - maybe 3.
Englishman: turn on your black box and you might have more luck with large salmon. 0.35 is too low!
Englishman: turn on your black box and you might have more luck with large salmon. 0.35 is too low!
Seafever
Well-Known Member
The Scotty black boxes had a "pulse" feature on them.......It could pulse between nothing and whatever voltage you had it set at. (At least on the digital versions).
Th entire time I used mine, I never tried that feature......so I can't say whether it would have made any difference or not.....
As I recall the Scotty black box also had a feature where:- if it was turned on and set at a certain point on the dial.....it would show you what your natural voltage was (both lines in the water) and then you could dial it in from there....
Still have my black box and all the stuff in the basement......you never know......one of these days.......
A prime point to check with the black box is where the wire connects to those stainless sleeves on the downrigger arm.
I found that point was highly subject to corrosion.
Also the sleeve itself.....it's just a sliding contact on the downrigger wire and i found i had to play around with mine for setup so that the sleeve was ALWAYS in contact with the wire no matter what was going on.....and you need the sleeve level on the wire so that you get maximum contact .
The sleeve itself needs to be "electrically clean" all the time.
I used that brake/electrical spray to get any film,glaze or dirt off the inside of the sleeves......
Th entire time I used mine, I never tried that feature......so I can't say whether it would have made any difference or not.....
As I recall the Scotty black box also had a feature where:- if it was turned on and set at a certain point on the dial.....it would show you what your natural voltage was (both lines in the water) and then you could dial it in from there....
Still have my black box and all the stuff in the basement......you never know......one of these days.......
A prime point to check with the black box is where the wire connects to those stainless sleeves on the downrigger arm.
I found that point was highly subject to corrosion.
Also the sleeve itself.....it's just a sliding contact on the downrigger wire and i found i had to play around with mine for setup so that the sleeve was ALWAYS in contact with the wire no matter what was going on.....and you need the sleeve level on the wire so that you get maximum contact .
The sleeve itself needs to be "electrically clean" all the time.
I used that brake/electrical spray to get any film,glaze or dirt off the inside of the sleeves......
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Charlie
Well-Known Member
Cannon still has - 200' and 400' lengths of 7-strand, 316-grade stainless steel cable. Each cable is 150-lb test.
| MSRP $46.99 |
Seafever
Well-Known Member
There is mention here of the wire voltage effect not being very effective at distance.
Some claim that the flasher/lure is too far back to gain any advantage of voltage.
Commies originally used the black box to correct electrical problems but a big part of it was was also to attact or repel certain species of fish at certain voltages.
If the voltage field/circle is less than 25 feet in diameter from the wire......what would be the point?
You wouldn't be attacting a hell of a lot with a force field that small.....
Your flasher has more sonic attracting power distance-wise than that.
Sharks can detect the smallest of electrical fields from hundreds of feet away.....
So can many other species of fish.
I think salmon and other salmonid species are actually capable of detecting wire voltage from much further away than the distance of ball to flasher......
Some claim that the flasher/lure is too far back to gain any advantage of voltage.
Commies originally used the black box to correct electrical problems but a big part of it was was also to attact or repel certain species of fish at certain voltages.
If the voltage field/circle is less than 25 feet in diameter from the wire......what would be the point?
You wouldn't be attacting a hell of a lot with a force field that small.....
Your flasher has more sonic attracting power distance-wise than that.
Sharks can detect the smallest of electrical fields from hundreds of feet away.....
So can many other species of fish.
I think salmon and other salmonid species are actually capable of detecting wire voltage from much further away than the distance of ball to flasher......
wolf
Well-Known Member
I hook it up like this wire then a 250 lb SAMPO swivel then a 150 lb split ring then my clip which isnt plastic . you have to understand how voltage works and the properties OF what it does use any other clip than plastic is the clue. the split ring is so if I do hang up I lose the ball and clip and save the wire.
Voltage on a boat has to be check and wires and crimps have to be good if you have voltage leak you have bigger issues than deciding between wire or braid . there are certain ways of lower voltages and highering its really not that hard.
BTW totally agree with you seafever
good luck wolf
Voltage on a boat has to be check and wires and crimps have to be good if you have voltage leak you have bigger issues than deciding between wire or braid . there are certain ways of lower voltages and highering its really not that hard.
BTW totally agree with you seafever
good luck wolf
jeffywestcoast
Well-Known Member
Thank's wolf i get the idea you are not isolating your cannonballs at all, i don't know why i was told to isolate them if i have the desired voltage on my line already at .07 volts does it make more sense to run a scotty clip style like you attach your quick release with then, or is it only advisable to have voltage reaching your cannonballs if i have a black box . I can see some people can easily get flusterd and turn to braid after messing with the voltage issue for to long, would like to think i have a little understanding of voltage after building powerlines for three years and being an apprentice HD mechanic.
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Aces
Well-Known Member
Depends on the time of year. We get lots of springs at 50 to 90 ft for almost half the summer
Seafever
Well-Known Member
The reason you isolate the ball is so that all the electrical interaction occurs between the line itself and the boat hull.
The boat hull and engines are already connected by bonding wires and the zincs on the engines and/or hull act as balanced annodes.
When you connect directly to the lead ball you upset the equation because now you have two more interacting annode "hotspots " on the wire........and less control over the actual voltage on the line by the blackbox.
The boat hull and engines are already connected by bonding wires and the zincs on the engines and/or hull act as balanced annodes.
When you connect directly to the lead ball you upset the equation because now you have two more interacting annode "hotspots " on the wire........and less control over the actual voltage on the line by the blackbox.
wolf
Well-Known Member
Jeff your getting close as soon as you use a plastic clip your breaking the chain of current, there are 2 types of metals that work very well with SS wire give you a hint SS is one of them. the other well think of old commercial days and what crimping material is made of.
Good luck Wolf
Good luck Wolf
Seafever
Well-Known Member
From page 16 of the Black Box technology Book:-
(1) Do NOT use a metal snap to connect the downrigger cable to the downrigger weight. If the lead weight is hooked directly to the steel downrigger wire, a seperate and often harmful electrolysis field will be set up.
From page 44 of same book:-
(1) When the voltage on the downrigger wire is tested with a seperate volt meter,the reading is not the same as the natural electrolysysis reading shown on the black box......??
answer:- This usually indicates there is too much load on the negative ground wire where the negative lead of the black box is connected. If several devices like radios,radar,electric downriggers,blowers and fishfinders are all attached to the same ground terminal strip,often there is not enough capacity in the wire going back to the battery.
This throws the black box off. A seperate negative lead should be run from the black box black wire back to the engine or battery ground.
Page 4:- test results have shown that fish can be attracted to the wire from up to 300ft away.
On the other hand according to the book......if your black box is working the way it should and everything is in order and you have the correct "voltage" dialed in:-
then you shouldn't need a flasher if you are running bait or spoons......you'd only need to set these lures about 6 feet behind the wire..........
(1) Do NOT use a metal snap to connect the downrigger cable to the downrigger weight. If the lead weight is hooked directly to the steel downrigger wire, a seperate and often harmful electrolysis field will be set up.
From page 44 of same book:-
(1) When the voltage on the downrigger wire is tested with a seperate volt meter,the reading is not the same as the natural electrolysysis reading shown on the black box......??
answer:- This usually indicates there is too much load on the negative ground wire where the negative lead of the black box is connected. If several devices like radios,radar,electric downriggers,blowers and fishfinders are all attached to the same ground terminal strip,often there is not enough capacity in the wire going back to the battery.
This throws the black box off. A seperate negative lead should be run from the black box black wire back to the engine or battery ground.
Page 4:- test results have shown that fish can be attracted to the wire from up to 300ft away.
On the other hand according to the book......if your black box is working the way it should and everything is in order and you have the correct "voltage" dialed in:-
then you shouldn't need a flasher if you are running bait or spoons......you'd only need to set these lures about 6 feet behind the wire..........
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jeffywestcoast
Well-Known Member
Gotcha! im onto it now..Thanks Wolf ! I purchased a new 1101 depthpower that came stock with the SS clip..Pretty sure Seafever turned me on to the correct material earlier on..aswell. Thanks folks..
jeffywestcoast
Well-Known Member
Thanks Seafever when i purchased my POS boat i questioned the wiring as i have 90% of the wiring on my boat each having a power n ground wire direct to the battery.
Seafever
Well-Known Member
Aaaaaaaahhhhh......forums......the gift that keeps on giving.........
From page 12 of B.B. Tech book:-
"Many years ago the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service learned that they have to be very careful with galvanic reactions (electrolysis) around salmon hatcheries. In many instances salmon must swim through culverts or other metal structures in their upstream migration. If the dissimilar metals are used such that a negative galvanic reaction is present,the salmon will refuse to enter the culvert or structure. The USFWS carefully neutralizes these structures.
From page 12 of B.B. Tech book:-
"Many years ago the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service learned that they have to be very careful with galvanic reactions (electrolysis) around salmon hatcheries. In many instances salmon must swim through culverts or other metal structures in their upstream migration. If the dissimilar metals are used such that a negative galvanic reaction is present,the salmon will refuse to enter the culvert or structure. The USFWS carefully neutralizes these structures.
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jeffywestcoast
Well-Known Member
i guess i dredged up an oldie again didn't i, i think the best way to settle it is with a derby Wire team versus Braid team. losing team pays for big ole BBQ N BEERS..
thanks for the old thread link High five..was an interesting read for sure
losing team pays for big ole BBQ N BEERS..thanks for the old thread link High five..was an interesting read for sure
Seafever
Well-Known Member
They never really had to 'market' the Black Box.
As soon as it caught on from the commie fleet, sporties were lining up to buy one.
They were lining up for a reason.......
Malcolm Russell was the guy behind the Black Box......Scotty was just his builder.
The boat hull itself will be negative charge......the wire will be positive charge.......
From page 50 of the Tech book:-
(Q) How does the black box actually increase or decrease the voltage all the way up and down the wire?
(a) The Black Box is NOT actually adding or subtracting volatge from the wire.
The Black Box works by altering the rate or level of natural electrolysis that your boat and downrigger wires generate.
Since the hull is a negative charge and the wire is a positive charge......the addition of any other annodes on the line itself, such as connecting to a lead ball via metal clip, will create a disruption in the charge field.
Ideally you would want a fully insulated ball when using a black box.
As soon as it caught on from the commie fleet, sporties were lining up to buy one.
They were lining up for a reason.......
Malcolm Russell was the guy behind the Black Box......Scotty was just his builder.
The boat hull itself will be negative charge......the wire will be positive charge.......
From page 50 of the Tech book:-
(Q) How does the black box actually increase or decrease the voltage all the way up and down the wire?
(a) The Black Box is NOT actually adding or subtracting volatge from the wire.
The Black Box works by altering the rate or level of natural electrolysis that your boat and downrigger wires generate.
Since the hull is a negative charge and the wire is a positive charge......the addition of any other annodes on the line itself, such as connecting to a lead ball via metal clip, will create a disruption in the charge field.
Ideally you would want a fully insulated ball when using a black box.
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lure-washer
Member
All I asked in the first place was what kind of a voltage can a person expect without a black box, and I guess an ungrounded kicker????
It had nothing to do with braid, and or if a black box is required.
Lure-washer
It had nothing to do with braid, and or if a black box is required.
Lure-washer
scar tissue
Active Member
iv'e always used wire now have one of each and find theres way more drag on the braid will be going back to wire on both . catch equal amounts of fish on both
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