so your saying running something like colman camp fuel would be worst then running high octane fuel?
Concerned About My Boat Gas
- Thread starter eaglemaniac
- Start date
so your saying running something like colman camp fuel would be worst then running high octane fuel?
vetteman
Active Member
No answer Charlie?
Charlie
Well-Known Member
Sorry, I didn't realize you seriously even needed an answer. Plus, I didn't state anything or write that article - The link is posted? Just curious, why are you even asking that question? Why would you even want to run any "white gas" with an octane rating of 53 in your outboard that I am sure has a higher minimum octance rating? Your choice; however, I would suggest contacting the manufacturer and asking if that would VOID the warranty.
Busterbrown
Active Member
I operate three marinas for a major oil company here in the lower mainland. I DO NOT recommend running any grade of gasoline that is over a year old . It does not mean it will not burn, however after a year the fuel has begun to break down with exposure to the elements, namely oxygen and moisture . As Charlie stated , a completely sealed container may be different, however any fixed onboard tank will have to be vented and will have moisture. Every year in the spring we go through the same issues with our customers. Those who did NOT fill their tanks up before tying their boats up for the winter come in for fuel in the spring and fill their tanks up. The walls of their empty tanks have been covered in moisture due to temp changes over the winter. When the tank is filled, the moisture is drawn off of the walls and into the tank.Guess what happens next
When storeing fuel for the winter, either diesel or gasoline we always recommend to fill your tanks before tying up for the winter. In addition a good fuel conditioner or stabilizer should be added BEFORE storage
Ethenol in gasoline presents many problems in a marine environment relating to moisture . All service stations in the lower mainland have ethenol in all grades of gasoline exept premium . The marinas do not have any ethenol in the gasoline and there are currently no plans to have it. With the investment we all have in our boats slopping 75 liters of fuel is cheap insurance.
When storeing fuel for the winter, either diesel or gasoline we always recommend to fill your tanks before tying up for the winter. In addition a good fuel conditioner or stabilizer should be added BEFORE storage
Ethenol in gasoline presents many problems in a marine environment relating to moisture . All service stations in the lower mainland have ethenol in all grades of gasoline exept premium . The marinas do not have any ethenol in the gasoline and there are currently no plans to have it. With the investment we all have in our boats slopping 75 liters of fuel is cheap insurance.
Charlie
Well-Known Member
Good post... Thanks!
FYI... seems to be a recent trend lately, if somone jumps on you for not having "their "1000+ posts" before giving good advice - just ignore them.
As they say... You haven't seen NOTHING yet, baby!
Everyone keeps running around yelling how the U.S. is in this country or that; is doing this and that; just to proctect our “oil” interest! In reality what comes to mind is, ‘frankly my dear, the U.S. government don’t give adamn.’ If anyone isn't noticing, all vehicles in theU.S. are currently being designed to burn "flex-fuel". The reason is the U.S. is quickly getting to the point the government doesn’t really care about anyone’s “oil,” including Canada's.
There is a Federal mandate requirement all states use “ethanol”! The reason for all theflex-fuel vehicles starting to show up in the U.S., just Google ‘Renewable FuelStandard (RFS)’. You will find it has also already been mandated the U.S. produce 36 billion gallons of biofuel by 2022. That only be 10 years from now. Next step will be E100 mandated and required in the U.S. Don’t think that can be done - It already has BEEN done and it happens to be the model the U.S. is using! Youcan Google “Brazils ethanol mandate” and find that.
Why... easy answer - Ethanol has allowed Brazil to eliminate the importation of foreignoil and is essentially energy independent. I am hear to tell boys and girls I grew up on a dairy farm in the Midwest and if Brazil can do based on their “sugar cane” I guarantee the U.S. can do it. We be able to grow a hella of a lot of grass, hay, cane, corn and anythingelse it takes to make biofuel! And most of YOU (and maybe even me) will see the U.S. become 100% independent of "foreign oil"! That and those 12,000-13,000 "protesters" just might be why Obama put a hold on that Canadian pipeline? ye, think! The ethanol "federal" reguirement as we speak is a MINIMUM of E10, it actually varies from state to state. You can find states already using E85.
Yep - blew that one for sure very "disasterous" results. Problem was NO ONE bothered explain or even tell anyone that all of those "older" marine components were NOT and ARE NOT designed for the use of ethanol. That is actually why I even got involved reasearching in the first place. Have to admit, I did learn a lot about gas, meaning fuel and not the type some seem to be passing on here lately!
If you burn ethanol - CHECK THAT FUEL! If you do have fuel sparation, I assure you will notice it! It is very hard to miss! A friend of mine recently bought a boat that had been setting for four years - with fuel in it! As soon as I learned that I advised not to even start those engines without changing that gas - it could be ethanol! He stated that would probably be a good idea and I never even mentioned it again. Well, guess what his "marine mechanic" (no offense to anyone - I don't think his mechanic is very good anyway) comes in right behind and says it will be fine if fresh gas is added - WRONG ANSWER, if that is ethanol. Guess there is still a learning curve! Last time I ask about his boat and why it still isn't the water. Having some kind of problem with the engines running. "Well, the both seem to be starting hard, runs for a minute and dies! Funny think is all the water, I get having to drain out of the seperators. I've never seen anthing like it before." Moral of that story - DO NOT MIX OLD ethanol with anything, you will just end up with "twice" the amount of "bad" gas!
FYI.. he also has "two" optimax hanging off that boat. I highly suggest Googling ethanol use in 2 stroke engine. Ethanol is a very good cleaner! It even just might be cleaning the oil right off those cylinder walls.
Forgive any spelling - didn't realize this was going to end up this long!
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ratherbefishing
Well-Known Member
Time to put things in perspective here fellas: 25L @ 1.35 is $33.75.
Really not much more than a decent lunch and a couple pints. A marine mechanic is going to run you $60-100/hr and they'd love to clean out your carbs.
As far as how I manage old fuel, I would not use it if it was that old. Even if it smelled OK - and I am a fan of the smell test. I would, and have, diluted in a 100L of good fuel and thrown in my truck (assuming it smelled OK). If it doesn't smell right then it is fire starter.
Really not much more than a decent lunch and a couple pints. A marine mechanic is going to run you $60-100/hr and they'd love to clean out your carbs.
As far as how I manage old fuel, I would not use it if it was that old. Even if it smelled OK - and I am a fan of the smell test. I would, and have, diluted in a 100L of good fuel and thrown in my truck (assuming it smelled OK). If it doesn't smell right then it is fire starter.
eaglemaniac
Well-Known Member
Based on all of the excellent info provided of which I am grateful. I have decided to completely drain every last drop of fuel from all three of my boat tanks into clean plastic jerry cans. It seems to smell fine to me so I will add it 25 ltrs. at a time to my truck gas with some fuel injector cleaner. Hoping all goes well. Thanks again everyone. eman
emanBusterbrown
Active Member
The info above reguarding ethenol is so true. It acts as a GREAT cleaner and will do a wonderfull job of cleaning out old fuel systems including lines,tanks and fuel delivery systems. The problem is when all of this crap gets loosened up and is absorbed by the ethenol in the fuel. Plugged filters, contaminated carbs and injectors and if there is any water, faze seperation of the fuel . In addition , many older components in the fuel delivery systems are NOT ethenol compatable , which will cause failure or leaks down the road.
When we converted to B-5 Diesel we saw many older boats having trouble with primary and secondary filter issues because of the cleaning component of the B-5. the issue was short lived as most boats had the problem resolved after a couple of filter changes. The other issue with B-5 will be the long term effect on older fiberglass tanks that are in some very old boats. When the government mandates these BIO fuel requirements they do not consider the effects on the end users. Boats tend to remain in service much longer that on-road vehicles and were built long before anyone had heard of ethenol in gasoline or Bio -Diesel .
When we converted to B-5 Diesel we saw many older boats having trouble with primary and secondary filter issues because of the cleaning component of the B-5. the issue was short lived as most boats had the problem resolved after a couple of filter changes. The other issue with B-5 will be the long term effect on older fiberglass tanks that are in some very old boats. When the government mandates these BIO fuel requirements they do not consider the effects on the end users. Boats tend to remain in service much longer that on-road vehicles and were built long before anyone had heard of ethenol in gasoline or Bio -Diesel .
Foxsea
Well-Known Member
I always enjoy your posts too, Charlie - please keep 'em coming! I learn lots from your research. Do I always agree 100% with your opinion? No - but I certainly accept, appreciate and respect it.
Lots of passionate opinion on this thread!!! Who's right; who's wrong? Not over religion, politics or even fishing - but gas???
Experience is doing something and taking the risk of a mistake; wisdom is learning from mistakes - preferably those of others because we just don't live long enough to make them all ourselves.
Just my experience: you may have a different experience and that's just dandy. I'll accept that.
As a "challenged" learner it took me quite a while to figure out that old gas is bad gas. 10 micron filters take out almost everything except scrupulously clean fuel so using old gas means going through lots of filters, as they take out the moisture and crud. My personal experience supports those that have learned to fill up in the fall, use fuel stabilizer, and if the gas is approaching one year old, dispose of it. Professionals generally agree with this advice. It can be very expensive; always needing to be "right." - filters, carb rebuilds, injectors, tows, even just the aggravation of an engine that doesn't run right, or at all.
For the folks that have a filter for the cred of others: 1000+ posts is not ALWAYS indicative of intelligent or informed opinion.
- sitting at a keyboard all day doesn't equate to valuable experience or expertise. Sometimes the smartest guy in the room IS the new guy - with the valuable experience and expertise! Trolls: Appreciate that and the opinion of others, instead of revealing your insecurities - or that you are off your meds - again!
Sorry - just sayin'. Keep smilin' - keep fishing! Above all, keep a sense of humour.
This forum should be fun - and thankfully, it generally IS!!! Peace, brothers!
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