Salmon Meat Color
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wolf
Well-Known Member
UMMMM not that ive seen there is weird things that go on with salmon and I assure you I have got many a marbled salmon it just the way it is and have bleed them very well.
Up in Knight where I used to guide the red ones were the rare one it was mostly white or half whites if you dont want to refer them as marbled LOL...
Wolf
Up in Knight where I used to guide the red ones were the rare one it was mostly white or half whites if you dont want to refer them as marbled LOL...
Wolf
I don't have much preferrence for meat color as far as eating goes, but if it's a salmon, i sure like looking at the darker colors and oily meat. even with the white meats though, oily is better for me, something like sablefish. As for killing to keep, i follow what most seem to be doing here. make it fast, bleed it, and chilled. Something i always wanted to do but never got around to are the 2 ways generally saved for tuna but are done on other fish and that's iki jimi followed by running a rod/wire down the spine. I intend to try it next season to see if i can tell the difference but something tells me there are to many other factors making it difficult to arrive at any conclusion. Although i don't do it, chopping off the tail is a common way of bleeding that i didn't see mentioned in the thread
xavier
Member
Wolf - not saying there are no marbled salmon, there certainly are. Meant to express that I have seen many guys refer to their catch as being marbled, when it was white, with a great deal of blood still in and on the fish/fillets.
Enniberg
Well-Known Member
I have yet to learn to appreciate raw fish, so it makes little difference to me, but I thought the "rule" per Health Canada is to freeze for a minimum of 7 days at below -20C ?
I have made all kinds of sushi fresh on the boat with no freezing, no problem.. What can you get from our coldwater fish?
TheBigGuy
Well-Known Member
Worms for one thing. You may not see them, but they're there.
hud52
Member
dmurph
Well-Known Member
Pretty sure they recommend to freeze salmon before any consumption , including if your going to cook it. Not aware of the health canada standards but our deep freeze was purchased from a friend who owned a sushi restaurant in whistler, he said to freeze as cold as freezer will go for at least 48 hours . I find the springs are better than sockeye, and coho was good too as sashimi.
Charlie
Well-Known Member
The parasitic worm people get from eating sushi or sashimi is normally the “Anisakidae”. “Anisakiasis can be easily prevented by adequate cooking at temperatures greater than 60°C or freezing. The FDA recommends all shellfish and fish intended for raw consumption be blast frozen to -35°C or below for fifteen hours or be regularly frozen to -20°C or below for seven days.”
The word "sushi" refers to the vinegared rice. Your rounded bricks of rice, with slivers of fish is accurately called "nigiri sushi." The fish without the sushi rice is "sashimi." You can get sick from all the above, along with everything else we humans eat. The Food-borne diseases (FBD) mainly associated with eating sushi and sashimi is, Hepatitis A, Salmonella, Coli along with ingestion of infectious organisms and/or noninfectious substances. Guess what… Those are found in just about everything we humans eat. “Food-borne diseases (FBDs) constitute a serious public health problem in the United States. FBDs encompass classic toxin-mediated food poisoning, such as botulism; gastroenteritis that follows ingestion of preformed Staphylococcus aureus toxin; ingestion of chemicals in foods; and bacterial, parasitic, and viral infections. Many FBDs are zoonoses, which implies that the infectious agent has a primary animal reservoir and that humans are affected incidentally.”
As noted, tapeworms can be found in fish. Tapeworms can also be found in just about everything eaten… and they certainly are not good! You think fish tapeworms are bad, how about reading up and looking at the “Pork Tapeworm” that causes parasites in the brain; cysticercosis, neurocysticercosis:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cysticercosis
“Salmonella is one of the most commonly contracted types of food poisoning. It can come from many other things besides sushi, but because sushi often involves raw fish there is a higher risk of contracting it. Although there are three ways in which salmonella can affect a person, it often manifests itself as gastroenteritis. According to the Center for Disease Control the symptoms include diarrhea, abdominal cramps and fever. The symptoms will last anywhere for four to seven days and often ,can be remedied without the need of a physician. If the diarrhea is especially severe those afflicted may need to be admitted to a hospital because the disease can spread to the intestines or bloodstream. Antibiotics will be given only if the case is severe enough or if the salmonella has entered the intestines. People with weakened immune systems often develop more severe cases.”
“Staphylococcus Aureus is a disease that can come from the rice of the sushi rather than the fish. The rice can grow this bacterium rapidly if it is not quickly chilled after making. This ailment is more common in foods such as casseroles and custard based deserts, but because sushi is often prepared and served at room temperature, it is possible to contract it. Symptoms include vomiting, nausea and loss of appetite, mild fever and diarrhea; they usually only last one to two days at most. The best treatment for Staphylococcus Aureus is replenishing fluids and electrolytes lost by vomiting and diarrhea. The National Library of Medicine says that anti-diarrhea medicines can be used but are not always necessary.”
“Anisakiasisis a disease that comes from eating raw fish. This is considered a rare disease in the United States, although it has been on the rise with the popularity of sushi. The symptoms are very similar to other types of food poisoning; because of this a doctor is needed to actually diagnosis the ailment as anisakiasis.They include nausea, fever, stomach cramps, and vomiting. People get Anisakiasis from eating sushi or sashimi infected with the larvae of aparasitic worm known as the Anisakidae. Sushi chefs can usually spot the worm so it is rare to be infected with Anisakiasis. In severe cases, the worms must be removed by a doctor.”
http://www.ehow.com/list_5981516_sushi-food-poisoning-signs.html#ixzz1aebc9Hb0
The word "sushi" refers to the vinegared rice. Your rounded bricks of rice, with slivers of fish is accurately called "nigiri sushi." The fish without the sushi rice is "sashimi." You can get sick from all the above, along with everything else we humans eat. The Food-borne diseases (FBD) mainly associated with eating sushi and sashimi is, Hepatitis A, Salmonella, Coli along with ingestion of infectious organisms and/or noninfectious substances. Guess what… Those are found in just about everything we humans eat. “Food-borne diseases (FBDs) constitute a serious public health problem in the United States. FBDs encompass classic toxin-mediated food poisoning, such as botulism; gastroenteritis that follows ingestion of preformed Staphylococcus aureus toxin; ingestion of chemicals in foods; and bacterial, parasitic, and viral infections. Many FBDs are zoonoses, which implies that the infectious agent has a primary animal reservoir and that humans are affected incidentally.”
As noted, tapeworms can be found in fish. Tapeworms can also be found in just about everything eaten… and they certainly are not good! You think fish tapeworms are bad, how about reading up and looking at the “Pork Tapeworm” that causes parasites in the brain; cysticercosis, neurocysticercosis:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cysticercosis
“Salmonella is one of the most commonly contracted types of food poisoning. It can come from many other things besides sushi, but because sushi often involves raw fish there is a higher risk of contracting it. Although there are three ways in which salmonella can affect a person, it often manifests itself as gastroenteritis. According to the Center for Disease Control the symptoms include diarrhea, abdominal cramps and fever. The symptoms will last anywhere for four to seven days and often ,can be remedied without the need of a physician. If the diarrhea is especially severe those afflicted may need to be admitted to a hospital because the disease can spread to the intestines or bloodstream. Antibiotics will be given only if the case is severe enough or if the salmonella has entered the intestines. People with weakened immune systems often develop more severe cases.”
“Staphylococcus Aureus is a disease that can come from the rice of the sushi rather than the fish. The rice can grow this bacterium rapidly if it is not quickly chilled after making. This ailment is more common in foods such as casseroles and custard based deserts, but because sushi is often prepared and served at room temperature, it is possible to contract it. Symptoms include vomiting, nausea and loss of appetite, mild fever and diarrhea; they usually only last one to two days at most. The best treatment for Staphylococcus Aureus is replenishing fluids and electrolytes lost by vomiting and diarrhea. The National Library of Medicine says that anti-diarrhea medicines can be used but are not always necessary.”
“Anisakiasisis a disease that comes from eating raw fish. This is considered a rare disease in the United States, although it has been on the rise with the popularity of sushi. The symptoms are very similar to other types of food poisoning; because of this a doctor is needed to actually diagnosis the ailment as anisakiasis.They include nausea, fever, stomach cramps, and vomiting. People get Anisakiasis from eating sushi or sashimi infected with the larvae of aparasitic worm known as the Anisakidae. Sushi chefs can usually spot the worm so it is rare to be infected with Anisakiasis. In severe cases, the worms must be removed by a doctor.”
http://www.ehow.com/list_5981516_sushi-food-poisoning-signs.html#ixzz1aebc9Hb0
Englishman
Well-Known Member
Very interesting, except this particular parasites life cycle is entirely devoted to freshwater. I don't think this worm can infect salmon and certainly not halibut or other saltwater fishes. Charlie's post is much more accurate and looks like there is only one rare type of worm that affects sushi. As he says you are much more likely to get more common diseases such as salmonella or e.Coli. from sushi than any form of worm.
Back in 1991 I worked at one of the fish plants (Arrow Seafoods) in Ukie. We had just gotten the PTO (Pacific Trollers Assoc.) contract to unload about 100 extra commercial trollers so you can bet we were busy. I was hired on as a salmon grader and I swear I must've handled over a million pounds of salmon that season. I've seen everything from snowballs to almost sockeye red flesh in springs, not to mention every shade of pink AND that marble cheese look. By coincidence, that same year the North American white spring market was lost to the Norwegian fish farmers. OUR main market went to New York to supply the Jewish community with white springs for making lox. So now we got some fish that can't be sold. Order a salmon steak dinner in a restaurant and get a white spring, most folks not in the know will return it! "MY SALMON IS SUPPOSED TO BE RED!" So what happens? The buyers dropped the price of large whites down to 80 cents a pound, while large reds began at $3.50 a pound. The commercial trollers freaked out because whites were NEVER graded out on the dock before that. They went through some strike action and refused to go fishing until the powers that be came to their senses and offered a better price than 80 cents. After 2 weeks they reached a compromise and agreed to $1.20 a pound for large whites. Not the greatest but you still have to make a living!
I swear I've never been through a more crazy fishing season. Boat skippers were constantly haranging me when I graded a pink spring as a white and you can bet my boss was trying to take advantage of the situation by deeming everything that wasn't really red was considered a white. I was caught right in the middle and everytime some fisherman freaked out on me I'd have to call the boss over and let them sort it out. The ironic part was most times the largest fish on every boat ended up being a snowball! OUCH! So some guys refused to sell them. One guy decided it was cheaper than buying catfood, another froze his and planned to use them for halibut bait, other guys just refused to sell out of spite and commanded a better price from their neighbors when they got back home.
In other seasons I worked at dockside monitoring of commercially caught (gillnet, seine and troll) salmon all over Vancouver Island and the Queen Charlottes. My primary function was collecting coded wire tags from hatchery origin fish (adipose fin clipped), along with lenght/weight, scale samples and noting flesh color. Not all tagged fish originated from hatcheries, btw. There were numerous studies involved on wild stocks, juveniles "in stream" were frequently electroshocked, and coded wire tagged then released after being revived. Most of the tags I recovered from whites did indeed originate from the Harrison River as well as the Skagit River. Those are unique genetic strains that are different from other stocks. There is a gene that triggers the manufacture and release of a specific enzyme which will break down the red pigments found in the food they eat. The enzyme can be produced in varying amouns which results in the marbled pattern and varying shades of pink being incorporated into the flesh. The whites do not have this enzyme at all. All of the red pigments they consume are not digested and just vented out.
I swear I've never been through a more crazy fishing season. Boat skippers were constantly haranging me when I graded a pink spring as a white and you can bet my boss was trying to take advantage of the situation by deeming everything that wasn't really red was considered a white. I was caught right in the middle and everytime some fisherman freaked out on me I'd have to call the boss over and let them sort it out. The ironic part was most times the largest fish on every boat ended up being a snowball! OUCH! So some guys refused to sell them. One guy decided it was cheaper than buying catfood, another froze his and planned to use them for halibut bait, other guys just refused to sell out of spite and commanded a better price from their neighbors when they got back home.
In other seasons I worked at dockside monitoring of commercially caught (gillnet, seine and troll) salmon all over Vancouver Island and the Queen Charlottes. My primary function was collecting coded wire tags from hatchery origin fish (adipose fin clipped), along with lenght/weight, scale samples and noting flesh color. Not all tagged fish originated from hatcheries, btw. There were numerous studies involved on wild stocks, juveniles "in stream" were frequently electroshocked, and coded wire tagged then released after being revived. Most of the tags I recovered from whites did indeed originate from the Harrison River as well as the Skagit River. Those are unique genetic strains that are different from other stocks. There is a gene that triggers the manufacture and release of a specific enzyme which will break down the red pigments found in the food they eat. The enzyme can be produced in varying amouns which results in the marbled pattern and varying shades of pink being incorporated into the flesh. The whites do not have this enzyme at all. All of the red pigments they consume are not digested and just vented out.
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Interesting post AlGee.
Informative as always Charlie.
Quick question - what does the freezer in your fridge, or in a small chest freezer go down to? I know I can buy a thermometer, but don't have one on hand.
Oh, and Doh!, I knew that sashimi is "raw" in the sense of not being cooked, but not raw as in straight out of the water to the plate. And, when I caught a 34lb'er in Port Alb this summer, I guess I forgot that it should be frozen as I took some pieces, marinated them in kikkomen and wasabi for a couple of hours and ate with steamed rice.
Hopefully I don't have any worms ready to crawl out of me ... Yuck.
It sure was tasty though - the salt in the soy sauce firmed the pieces up a bit, and they were good!
I'mn going with the salt and wasabi killed any nasties .... yeah, that's it!
Oops, forgot to add - a quick bonk to stun em, cut the gills to bleed em, put em on ice (I find old wet towels kind of help spread the cold from the ice evenly), and the first chance you get, gut and gill em.
Definitely the best way to treat the meat.
It is, after all, a precious resource and a crime to not treat it properly.
Informative as always Charlie.
Quick question - what does the freezer in your fridge, or in a small chest freezer go down to? I know I can buy a thermometer, but don't have one on hand.
Oh, and Doh!, I knew that sashimi is "raw" in the sense of not being cooked, but not raw as in straight out of the water to the plate. And, when I caught a 34lb'er in Port Alb this summer, I guess I forgot that it should be frozen as I took some pieces, marinated them in kikkomen and wasabi for a couple of hours and ate with steamed rice.
Hopefully I don't have any worms ready to crawl out of me ... Yuck.
It sure was tasty though - the salt in the soy sauce firmed the pieces up a bit, and they were good!
I'mn going with the salt and wasabi killed any nasties .... yeah, that's it!
Oops, forgot to add - a quick bonk to stun em, cut the gills to bleed em, put em on ice (I find old wet towels kind of help spread the cold from the ice evenly), and the first chance you get, gut and gill em.
Definitely the best way to treat the meat.
It is, after all, a precious resource and a crime to not treat it properly.
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Fish Assassin
Crew Member
Most newer freezers only go to -18 to -23
Fish Assassin
Crew Member
"energy saving" freezers are -18 but most can be turned down to -23. Old freezers are way better IMO. In fact months ago Islandgirl and I thought that would be a great thread. Old freezers may not be energy smart but are they not better for your meat in the long run?
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