Proper Tongue Weight

[Squire]

Update on my boat trailer saga: after measuring every dimension and taking several pictures with the boat on the original trailer I put the boat back at the marina. Bill Howich Marine had three aluminum I-beam candidates for me to choose from and offered me a decent trade-in price so I towed the EZ Loader up there along with my notes, tape measure, straight edge and level. The Tuff 6000 didn’t have high enough bunk brackets for my boat to clear the fenders unless they were close enough together that I’d be worried about the boat tipping over on a corner.
the Marlon Karavan 6000 and 7000 are on the same frame with the same axles. The difference is in the wheels (14”-15”) and the the
rotors (more braking power). The 6000 sat at the same hitch height as the EZ Loader while the 7000 would have meant getting a 4” step-up hitch to replace my current 2” and I want to be able to open the tailgate while hooked up so I went with the 6000. If I don’t tow with a full tank of fuel, that’s lots of capacity for me.
Like Explorer682 I now have plenty of hours in setting up the new trailer. The first thing I had to do was move the winch post back as far as possible as I had to work off the length from stern to bow eye where it touches the roller. This involved drilling new holes so I could use two u-bolts around the crossmember that supports the main tongue beam instead of it being ahead of the crossmember.
I had to move the rear crossmember ahead 20” and the fourth crossmember ahead 7”. There are four crossmembers supporting these main bunks as opposed to the two with yokes to spread out the support on the EZ Loader. Then I cut the main bunks back to 10’ from 12’ and spaced them to miss the chines and have the boat clear the fenders. This will place the boat about 15” forward relative to the center of the axles compared to where it sat on the old trailer. I have the option of moving the axles forward as well if the tongue weigh is too much now.
With the keel potentially clearing the crossmembers by less than 2” I only have 1” upward adjustment remaining at the back of the bunks and I’m at the highest position at the front of the bunk. With this setup, the front bunks can’t be mounted low enough to work with the main bunks so they have to go. I’m going to mount keel rollers on the front two crossmembers instead. They might not get low enough with u-bolts so I am considering drilling two 1/2” bolt holes through the aluminum crossmembers. Will this compromise the strength of the crossmember enough to worry about it? I believe they’ll be more of a retrieval guide that weight bearing in any event.
I ordered a tongue weight scale from Amazon and once it’s in I’ll go load the boat and weigh it up. Anything over 700 lbs I’ll be moving axles forward some.
As it‘s set up now I have 18” extra inches at the rear of the I-beam that I will cut off once I confirm it all works with the boat. This trailer came 3’4” longer overall than the EZ Loader.
It’s a lot of work (and cost) to be able to fish the West side with the peace of mind of a safe set-up but I’m in it for the long haul now.

 

[Explorer682]

Update on my boat trailer saga: after measuring every dimension and taking several pictures with the boat on the original trailer I put the boat back at the marina. Bill Howich Marine had three aluminum I-beam candidates for me to choose from and offered me a decent trade-in price so I towed the EZ Loader up there along with my notes, tape measure, straight edge and level. The Tuff 6000 didn’t have high enough bunk brackets for my boat to clear the fenders unless they were close enough together that I’d be worried about the boat tipping over on a corner.
the Marlon Karavan 6000 and 7000 are on the same frame with the same axles. The difference is in the wheels (14”-15”) and the the
rotors (more braking power). The 6000 sat at the same hitch height as the EZ Loader while the 7000 would have meant getting a 4” step-up hitch to replace my current 2” and I want to be able to open the tailgate while hooked up so I went with the 6000. If I don’t tow with a full tank of fuel, that’s lots of capacity for me.
Like Explorer682 I now have plenty of hours in setting up the new trailer. The first thing I had to do was move the winch post back as far as possible as I had to work off the length from stern to bow eye where it touches the roller. This involved drilling new holes so I could use two u-bolts around the crossmember that supports the main tongue beam instead of it being ahead of the crossmember.
I had to move the rear crossmember ahead 20” and the fourth crossmember ahead 7”. There are four crossmembers supporting these main bunks as opposed to the two with yokes to spread out the support on the EZ Loader. Then I cut the main bunks back to 10’ from 12’ and spaced them to miss the chines and have the boat clear the fenders. This will place the boat about 15” forward relative to the center of the axles compared to where it sat on the old trailer. I have the option of moving the axles forward as well if the tongue weigh is too much now.
With the keel potentially clearing the crossmembers by less than 2” I only have 1” upward adjustment remaining at the back of the bunks and I’m at the highest position at the front of the bunk. With this setup, the front bunks can’t be mounted low enough to work with the main bunks so they have to go. I’m going to mount keel rollers on the front two crossmembers instead. They might not get low enough with u-bolts so I am considering drilling two 1/2” bolt holes through the aluminum crossmembers. Will this compromise the strength of the crossmember enough to worry about it? I believe they’ll be more of a retrieval guide that weight bearing in any event.
I ordered a tongue weight scale from Amazon and once it’s in I’ll go load the boat and weigh it up. Anything over 700 lbs I’ll be moving axles forward some.
As it‘s set up now I have 18” extra inches at the rear of the I-beam that I will cut off once I confirm it all works with the boat. This trailer came 3’4” longer overall than the EZ Loader.
It’s a lot of work (and cost) to be able to fish the West side with the peace of mind of a safe set-up but I’m in it for the long haul now.

Sounds like you’re almost there, another 40 hours or so and she’ll be perfect ! I. don’t think drilling those small 1/2”or 5/8” holes you mentioned would ever be an issue .

 

[Baxter]

The half ton towing thread got me thinking about my set-up with a Tundra Crewmax towing a Campion 682 On an EZ Loader I figured the boat and trailer weighed 7200-7500 lbs so it would be closer to max than I’d be comfortable with which is why I added the airbags for a bit of extra peace of mind.

I also drive a Tundra Crewmax (2015). Our travel trailer is around 7500 loaded with a full fresh water tank. I have never had any issues towing the trailer at all, to Tofino several times, Victoria, Port McNeill, all over the island. Tongue weight for the trailer is around 700 lbs depending on if water tank is full, how much crap I am packing etc.


Truck is rated for 9990 lbs or something like that - payload 1500 lbs +/-. Curious why you are concerned about the weight?

 

[Squire]

I also drive a Tundra Crewmax (2015). Our travel trailer is around 7500 loaded with a full fresh water tank. I have never had any issues towing the trailer at all, to Tofino several times, Victoria, Port McNeill, all over the island. Tongue weight for the trailer is around 700 lbs depending on if water tank is full, how much crap I am packing etc.


Truck is rated for 9990 lbs or something like that - payload 1500 lbs +/-. Curious why you are concerned about the weight?

My concern was about the distribution of the weight more than the weight itself. I have experienced a close call with a wagging trailer that had too much weight dangling off the back. Because I could feel the lift at the hitch when the trailer bounced at all I wasn’t comfortable towing as is.
When I checked my set-up over the scales I confirmed that I had too little weigh on the tongue with a lot of weight hanging back behind the axles. I want closer to the 700 lbs tongue weight that you have towing your travel trailer with the center of gravity further forward.
Because my EZ Loader trailer didn’t lend itself to moving the boat forward without a lot of custom fabrication I opted for replacing the trailer with an adjustable model so I can get it right.

 

[Baxter]

My concern was about the distribution of the weight more than the weight itself.....

Ahhh, okay that makes sense. Ya, certainly do not want the tongue to be too light!!

I rarely travel with the fresh tank full, partially for that reason. My tank is at the very rear of the trailer, and at 26 gallons is a little over 200lbs. Not that much weight, but when you put it that far back it is amazing how much weight it leverages off of the tongue! I only travel with it full if I am going a short distance, or traveling to somewhere where filling the tank will be a pain in the butt.

One of our first trips with it ever, I had a full tank of water, and a load of firewood on the fold down rack on the back bumper. Not a good idea! Was a rookie mistake! Luckily we were not going far - it really bounced the truck around. Never again. Not sure what the weight of the firewood was, but I had a fair bit back there, maybe a couple hundred extra pounds. Firewood now rides in the box of the truck

 

[Pineapple Express]

I also drive a Tundra Crewmax (2015). Our travel trailer is around 7500 loaded with a full fresh water tank. I have never had any issues towing the trailer at all, to Tofino several times, Victoria, Port McNeill, all over the island. Tongue weight for the trailer is around 700 lbs depending on if water tank is full, how much crap I am packing etc.


Truck is rated for 9990 lbs or something like that - payload 1500 lbs +/-. Curious why you are concerned about the weight?

Be careful with your loads there @Baxter The truck payload includes passengers, fuel, cargo, and tongue weight. It's pretty easy to exceed payload! Also, you'll have an axle weight rating to watch for as well.

 

[Squire]

Ahhh, okay that makes sense. Ya, certainly do not want the tongue to be too light!!

I rarely travel with the fresh tank full, partially for that reason. My tank is at the very rear of the trailer, and at 26 gallons is a little over 200lbs. Not that much weight, but when you put it that far back it is amazing how much weight it leverages off of the tongue! I only travel with it full if I am going a short distance, or traveling to somewhere where filling the tank will be a pain in the butt.

One of our first trips with it ever, I had a full tank of water, and a load of firewood on the fold down rack on the back bumper. Not a good idea! Was a rookie mistake! Luckily we were not going far - it really bounced the truck around. Never again. Not sure what the weight of the firewood was, but I had a fair bit back there, maybe a couple hundred extra pounds. Firewood now rides in the box of the truck

I also changed from a one ton diesel to the half ton gasser last fall and had the air bags installed to prevent sag in the rear and provide more side to side stability while towing. I am going to be more careful when getting closer to max capacity than I ever was before.

 

[pescador]

I also changed from a one ton diesel to the half ton gasser last fall and had the air bags installed to prevent sag in the rear and provide more side to side stability while towing. I am going to be more careful when getting closer to max capacity than I ever was before.

Most of us have been thru what you're going through. You're not alone. I have had a couple of close calls on the Island and reset my whole setup because of fear of an incident. Do what most of us do on longer trips, No water on board minimal gas to get me to the first gas station at my launch point. That'll save you 400lbs plus in most cases Its the little things that add up. No beer bottles, only cans, don't carry 6 downrigger balls. Pull **** out of the boat your not using. I think you'll notice a big diff with 700 lbs on the tongue. That issue causes most trailer sway. Also, watch out going down hills when a large truck passes you. They create Bow Waves, that will suck your rig into their lane, then back into your lane then the dance starts. When I see a large semi passing on a downhill stretch, i'm on my in-cab brake controller on the trailer till they pass. Just slight brake pressure to keep trailer straight.

 

[Squire]

Most of us have been thru what you're going through. You're not alone. I have had a couple of close calls on the Island and reset my whole setup because of fear of an incident. Do what most of us do on longer trips, No water on board minimal gas to get me to the first gas station at my launch point. That'll save you 400lbs plus in most cases Its the little things that add up. No beer bottles, only cans, don't carry 6 downrigger balls. Pull **** out of the boat your not using. I think you'll notice a big diff with 700 lbs on the tongue. That issue causes most trailer sway. Also, watch out going down hills when a large truck passes you. They create Bow Waves, that will suck your rig into their lane, then back into your lane then the dance starts. When I see a large semi passing on a downhill stretch, i'm on my in-cab brake controller on the trailer till they pass. Just slight brake pressure to keep trailer straight.

I do find some comfort in due diligence being common with folks towing bigger boats on the highway. I plan to take on water and fuel closer to my destination. With a 405 litre fuel tank running under 1/4 tank can save me 500 lbs. I’ve already taken all my extra seats, filler cushions and starboard bed platforms out of the boat.
And I appreciate the heads-up regarding large vehicle drafts. It was the in-cab brake controller that I used to save myself from a sure wreck in the incident I referred to. That was no easy task while I was being thrown around in the cab but I was sure standing on the brakes would have had me sideways on the highway.

 

[Baxter]

Be careful with your loads there @Baxter The truck payload includes passengers, fuel, cargo, and tongue weight. It's pretty easy to exceed payload! Also, you'll have an axle weight rating to watch for as well.

Yup, all good on that front.

Axle rating is no issue - rear axle rating is higher than total payload, so if I break the rear axle limit I am already well beyond payload.

If I factor in the weight of my family, bikes, a full tank of fuel and some gear in the bed, I am below total payload. (Most camping gear goes in the trailer itself with a couple exceptions).

(I learned how important weight limits were with an old F250 SD I had. I figured, what the heck, only going a couple blocks - I can haul 2 yards of gravel at once. (put me about 1200 lbs over weight)

I got home fine, but man stopping was interesting!!! Plus a few days later I found a massive leak in the break line! Probably caused by trying to stop a truck that was way over weight!

That was an old truck that I had very little into. My Tundra has a lot more $$$ into it, so I play by the rules now

 

[Baxter]

watch out going down hills when a large truck passes you. They create Bow Waves, that will suck your rig into their lane...

Isnt this the truth. I have not noticed it with the boat, but with the travel trailer I do a max of 90km/hr on the highway. When a semi passes you definitely feel it! I have a Trunion setup as well which makes the ride way better, but you certainly still feel those big trucks!

 

[Squire]

Installed the keel rollers first thing this morning to beat the heat. Drilling the holes had me soaked by 8:30 am.
I have 4” of adjustment upward and plan to get the boat sitting on the bunks then jack the rollers firmly up against the keel without lifting the boat off the bunks. I want to help support the weight, not take on all of it. Hopefully this will keep me from dragging the bottom paint off the chines when I load the boat in the future.
And I still plan to modify the bunk brackets to be able to utilize the two 6’ bunks from the front inside the longer ones at the stern of the boat.
And get two support arms fabricated for guide on bunks like I had done for the other trailer.
And….
And to think I chuckled at Explorer682’s 40 hours

 

[Squire]

Got the boat on the trailer and confirmed tongue weight. I moved the winch post back where it started ($#@%) to move the boat forward about 5” to where I figured the stern would line up. Then I cut off the unnecessary extra 18” off the frame. Now I just have to fit it one more time before making plans for the Alberni inlet.

 

[Squire]

Got the boat on the trailer and confirmed tongue weight. I moved the winch post back where it started ($#@%) to move the boat forward about 5” to where I figured the stern would line up. Then I cut off the unnecessary extra 15” off the frame. Now I just have to fit it one more time before making plans for the Alberni inlet.