I'm feeling the need to troll deep

Birdman said:
When you're fishing off Nanaimo a lot of the time you're going to want to be down at least 200 feet. Sometimes much deeper.

You need to:

1. keep your lead from down rigger clip to flasher to 15 feet or less to lessen the chances of lines crossing over and tangling (which also helps when a fish does a "pop up" type of hit down deep instead of a hit and run as there is less slack line to deal with). In my opinion 30 to 40 feet is waaaay too far back unless you are trolling only plugs on a shallow line (like we used to do out offshore in the pilchard days on the west coast) without a lot of other boats in the area.

2. ensure you are trolling with your boat "in line" with the current, i.e. so one of your rigger cables isn't cutting under the boat on an angle. Also if you are trolling with your cables on a ****-eyed angle, your two flashers are going to be rotating differently and likely 1 side will not fish as well as the other. This is a very common mistake.

3. pull your outside rod and rigger up when you make a turn, then if you want to turn sharp you can and you are guaranteed not to tangle, and I find a lot of the time popping a sharp turn on that inside rod drastically changes the action resulting in an immediate hit. If I am trolling "deep" (180 plus) or in significant current I very rarely turn with 2 rods down, even on a gradual basis. This is also a good excuse to check your lines. Nanaimo always has tons of shakers, and often lots of weeds in the water.

4. if tangles remain really bad, consider running a big plug or spoon with no flasher on at least one side, potentially both sides.

5. strongly consider getting extended booms on your down riggers. Harbour Chandler set these up for me many moons ago. Once I did that and went to 15 pound balls, my number of tangles declined dramatically on a boat with an 8'6 beam.

6. listen to experienced guys from Campbell River on this topic, nowhere else on the coast do people consistently fish in extreme tides, really deep, as the guys who focus on the south end of Quadra. Most of my experience with this issue is west coast offshore or Nanaimo area, both of which can have strong currents and a lot of deep fishing, but frankly nothing like what'd I've seen at south Quadra the modest number of times I've fished that area. If you can learn from an expert in that area you will gain a lot.

What you're going through is all part of the normal learning curve for deep fishing. Hope this helps.
Click to expand...
Spot on
 
Birdman said:
When you're fishing off Nanaimo a lot of the time you're going to want to be down at least 200 feet. Sometimes much deeper.

You need to:

1. keep your lead from down rigger clip to flasher to 15 feet or less to lessen the chances of lines crossing over and tangling (which also helps when a fish does a "pop up" type of hit down deep instead of a hit and run as there is less slack line to deal with). In my opinion 30 to 40 feet is waaaay too far back unless you are trolling only plugs on a shallow line (like we used to do out offshore in the pilchard days on the west coast) without a lot of other boats in the area.

2. ensure you are trolling with your boat "in line" with the current, i.e. so one of your rigger cables isn't cutting under the boat on an angle. Also if you are trolling with your cables on a ****-eyed angle, your two flashers are going to be rotating differently and likely 1 side will not fish as well as the other. This is a very common mistake.

3. pull your outside rod and rigger up when you make a turn, then if you want to turn sharp you can and you are guaranteed not to tangle, and I find a lot of the time popping a sharp turn on that inside rod drastically changes the action resulting in an immediate hit. If I am trolling "deep" (180 plus) or in significant current I very rarely turn with 2 rods down, even on a gradual basis. This is also a good excuse to check your lines. Nanaimo always has tons of shakers, and often lots of weeds in the water.

4. if tangles remain really bad, consider running a big plug or spoon with no flasher on at least one side, potentially both sides.

5. strongly consider getting extended booms on your down riggers. Harbour Chandler set these up for me many moons ago. Once I did that and went to 15 pound balls, my number of tangles declined dramatically on a boat with an 8'6 beam.

6. listen to experienced guys from Campbell River on this topic, nowhere else on the coast do people consistently fish in extreme tides, really deep, as the guys who focus on the south end of Quadra. Most of my experience with this issue is west coast offshore or Nanaimo area, both of which can have strong currents and a lot of deep fishing, but frankly nothing like what'd I've seen at south Quadra the modest number of times I've fished that area. If you can learn from an expert in that area you will gain a lot.

What you're going through is all part of the normal learning curve for deep fishing. Hope this helps.
Click to expand...

great post, lots of good info in there
 
Thank's everyone for your valuable info. The depth of knowlege and experience
is remarkable. I will fine tune and hopefully things will improve. Fishing is one of
my biggest passions and I want to be better at it.
 
I like to run the flasher no more than 10 feet from the clip. I have hooked more fish since going to approx that length.
 
Also for the love of god, don’t stack deep. I forgot that in my previous post but it’s probably the the most important point.
 
Your finder will tell you where they are usually. I also never fished that deep but my biggest fish this year was at 170 off thrasher. Yes don't stack when its not anything but favorable conditions. I lost a bunch of gear its just not worth it you have to catch yourself stacking is a luxury and only if the time is right.
 
Most tangles happen due to what others have said- too much line out behind clip and turns. DR line out at way to much of a scope, likely you are bucking the tide and need to be trolling the other way. I personally don’t turn all the way around when down greater than 140’ in the Strait of Georgia. Too much current. I just plan my tack to pull lines up at the end and run back to the spot to go again with the current. Know the current directions for each tide... hint, just follow the guide boats ;). 15lb balls are good. 18’s or more if you have the high output scotties. Just limit or don’t do turns when down deep and try to use straight plugs (troll fast) or spoons whenever you can. Like others have said, if the bait is down say 200’ you might have to drop balls down 230’ or deeper to be effective just due to the scope from fishing that deep.
I find plugs or just spoons (no flasher) more fun and less drag on your lines when that current wants to sheer one line under the boat. Having lines doing that is fine as long as they stay clear of the prop. Keep the speed up to keep them heading back from the boat (1.7 to 3mph speed over ground). You’ll get less dogfish going faster too. Don’t slow down or have a rookie with adhd on the wheel who can’t keep the boat on a straight tack, or the current wins :).
 
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coastalmarinesafety said:
Most tangles happen due to what others have said- too much line out behind clip and turns. DR line out at way to much of a scope, likely you are bucking the tide and need to be trolling the other way. I personally don’t turn all the way around when down greater than 140’ in the Strait of Georgia. Too much current. I just plan my tack to pull lines up at the end and run back to the spot to go again with the current. Know the current directions for each tide... hint, just follow the guide boats ;). 15lb balls are good. 18’s or more if you have the high output scotties. Just limit or don’t do turns when down deep and try to use straight plugs (troll fast) or spoons whenever you can. Like others have said, if the bait is down say 200’ you might have to drop balls down 230’ or deeper to be effective just due to the scope from fishing that deep.
I find plugs or just spoons (no flasher) more fun and less drag on your lines when that current wants to sheer one line under the boat. Having lines doing that is fine as long as they stay clear of the prop. Keep the speed up to keep them heading back from the boat (1.7 to 3mph speed over ground). You’ll get less dogfish going faster too. Don’t slow down or have a rookie with adhd on the wheel who can’t keep the boat on a straight tack, or the current wins :).
Click to expand...
More great advice. I don’t bother with turns down deep either. Just pull and run back to start. Plugs with no flasher or I’ve yet to try them, but I got some monster spoons from AP Tackle to try out soon. I prefer round 20 lb balls no fins.
 
tinboatrobb said:
I gotta try the no flasher gig...
Click to expand...
Just use 6” or bigger spoons or same in plugs. 10-15’ behind rigger depending on what your using. I go 30’ difference in depth side to side.
I have to add, I like fishing alone a bit and it’s so much nicer to boat a fish alone with the flasher on!!
I have to add. I use 50 lb mono test for leaders and braid for my main line. I can rarely have pop offs.
 
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Minimum 40 lbs off your braid. 30 is fine but it gets some twists but lets face it you need 40 for hootchies. Use 40 off your braid.
 
I think the main problem is that your lines are way too far back from your downrigger line. Just still to 15-25’ back. Not 30’-40’
 
awesome lost by Birdman.
in CR the currents are ridiculous and in order to be productive you must fish ( troll ) in the same direction as the current. chinook are lazy and want the food to be delivered to them. picture a fish holding in a river. what way are their bodies positioned? head upstream, picking up feed as it washes to them.

with the cable angle thing Birdman eluded to: THIS IS CRITICAL : when the lines start to go under the boat or angle that way, resist the urge to alter the boats course in a way that straightens the lines. instead you almost have to turn even sharper and give the boat some added speed so the cannon balls suck back in line behind the boat.

we have consistently been picking up fish at 260 - 300 feet.
 
Breakin"even said:
I'm using round coated 15# with a fin, not pancake, I bought a 18 pound round today, I should have bought the 20. Does 30 to 40 feet back from the the ball seem like an ok distance?
Flashers probabley add to the problem as they roll. I've been hesitant to removing the flasher
but untangling lines is frustrating, I've heared some guy's run a dummy flasher and a lure 10' back and 10' up
from the dummy flasher.
Click to expand...
I run dummy flashers and mostly plugs. 60” clip and usually clip so the lure is 3-5 feet behind and 5-8 feet above dummy flasher clip. Easiest way to take guessing game out of it is to use 60” tuna cords to your snubber and ball. Clip dummy at bottom of tuna cord, clip at top.
 
I allways trolled fairly shallow 40-80 feet with most action around 65 I'm now
trying 200. At 65 I could look at the angle of the line an know if I was too fast or to slow,
but a deeper depths It doesn't work becouse of more drag. I use to look for about 45 degree
on the line at 65 feet, is there a chart or something I can download to roughly figure out
how hard the lure is working or is it a trial and error thing
 
speed, ball size/shape, drag of flasher/s, and direction of current all change the chart of someone's approximation.
We have caught fish in 225' with 320' out a few times. 60 feet is more fun.
file.php
 
Interesting chart, where'd that come from @tubber? I like charts. Reminds me of the old dive charts for diving plug models (back in the walleye days). Trying to figure out what "distance back" is. . .I was thinking it was the lead (distance from ball/cable to terminal gear) but that doesn't make much sense (250' lead?). Anyways, just interested,
fb
 
fishbadger said:
Interesting chart, where'd that come from @tubber? I like charts. Reminds me of the old dive charts for diving plug models (back in the walleye days). Trying to figure out what "distance back" is. . .I was thinking it was the lead (distance from ball/cable to terminal gear) but that doesn't make much sense (250' lead?). Anyways, just interested,
fb
Click to expand...
Looks like that's the horizontal distance between ball and downrigger on the boat (X Axis)
Cable Length = Hypotenuse
Depth = Y Axis
 
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