Conservation Measures for Northern and Southern BC Chinook Salmon and Southern Resident Killer Whale

[wildmanyeah]

People click like and share, still need to have an Alexandra Morton like video/pictures ect to share that’s a well funded message. To sway the public

Looking for SFI,BCWF ect to put out that massage and I’ll share, like and donate the **** out of it.

 

[profisher]

Do what I have started to do...Raincoast and those groups all have Facebook Pages of their own. They use that platform to keep in touch with their supporters. Find a Raincoast post about the whales/Chinook and make your own comment to it. Start educating their followers about the issues we know about but they don't. Put forward questions on their Facebook page like...if you are truly concerned about Fraser Chinook stocks rebuilding to feed our beloved resident killer whales...why do you say absolutely nothing about the biggest road block to their recovery....the illegal (not legal) nets/poaching going on? I posted that it might be a good idea to educate yourself on the issues by attending meetings held by the other sectors who have apposing views on the problems and the solutions. That it is better to donate funds based on knowledge and not emotions. You can be exploited by those wanting donations to fund agendas that tug at your heart but have no actual science based benefit to the cause. We don't need to convince those of us posting here what the issues and solutions are...we need to get our views into the supporters of the other side...tell them what they are not being told and seed some doubt about what they are being fed to get money from their pockets.

 

[profisher]

Here is my copied post from the Raincoast Facebook page. Why has your emergency order not included forcing DFO to enforce closures on the Fraser River and stop the ongoing poaching of salmon on the lower sections? Fraser sockeye runs are already so depleted there are no directed commercial or recreational openings for them and now Chinook. When will this organization step up and admit to the public this is a major road block to the recovery of southern BC salmon stocks?

 

[Whitebuck]

Profisher , with all due respect.
FN do not even have to poach anymore with all the openings they are getting.
It's not the illegal netting that is doing the damage.....its the LEGAL 24/7 netting our government is allowing on the Fraser.
Look at how many openings we have had so far. So please talk about the LEGAL netting genocide that is occurring on the Fraser, that is the real problem!

 

[GLG]

Profisher , with all due respect.
FN do not even have to poach anymore with all the openings they are getting.
It's not the illegal netting that is doing the damage.....its the LEGAL 24/7 netting our government is allowing on the Fraser.
Look at how many openings we have had so far. So please talk about the LEGAL netting genocide that is occurring on the Fraser, that is the real problem!

Why don't you give us some numbers to backup your claim. You have been on this campaign for many, many years so surely you have some idea what those numbers are. How many chinook travel up the Fraser each year and how many are harvested by FN. Facts matter if you don't want to come off on social media like some guy barking at the moon.

 

[casper5280]

found this It may be helpful
http://waves-vagues.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/Library/331835.pdf

 

[Whitebuck]

GLG, do not know exact numbers. But have a pretty good ballpark figure. Being friends with many FN in different bands from Steveston all the way up to the mid Fraser and talking with many of them on an almost daily basis. You get to realize how many actually get caught and how many don’t get reported. For instance 2 of my friends netted over 90 Chinook in there last opening which was a few days. They were drift netting. Keep in mind these are only 2 individuals from a very large band. For this opening only a 136 were reported lol. This guys family took more than the 136 fish that were reported....now add another 25 to 35 set nets and multiple drift nets and you start to realize how many get caught.
Now this is only one group on the lower Fraser and is below the canyon. Start adding up all the other openings from the mouth to Texas creek and you get to realize why we don’t see the numbers that make it back to the spawning grounds.
Only 27 springs netted from the Port Mann to the mission bridge? 2 FN boats took that in a few hours down here.Even with the 27 reported just goes to show you how inaccurate or false the Albion is! How is it during a 16hr opening the FN can get more than the Albion did on the same drift over a time period of almost 3 months?

Not a guy howling at the moon, just a concerned angler and Canadian who is worried that my grandkids won’t know what a salmon is due to DFOs mismanagement. Any inside or firsthand information I can use to shed light on the Bermuda Triangle of the Fraser I will continue to do so.

 

[littlechucky]

Apparently more news on "marine mammals" coming tomorrow...see end of article:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...announce-ocean-protection-agreement-1.4715786

 

[Floater]

Why don't you give us some numbers to backup your claim. You have been on this campaign for many, many years so surely you have some idea what those numbers are. How many chinook travel up the Fraser each year and how many are harvested by FN. Facts matter if you don't want to come off on social media like some guy barking at the moon.

I’m a numbers type of guy myself too GLG, so I get what your saying. But sheesh, I have to laugh when people on here try to discredit statements about the FN problem.

 

[ryanb]

I fished and boated the Fraser for years in my jetboat. The poaching and overfishing problem has been getting exponentially worse in the last few years. There just simply isn't the political will from those in power to do anything about it.

 

[profisher]

The public would support enforcement in the name of conservation if DFO explained that to do nothing would likely mean the loss of all our killer whales, many grizzlies and eagles as they would not have enough fat reserves to get through the winters. The public can't get emotionally engaged with fish alone but they would when those other species are thrown in the mix.

 

[Floater]

Under numerous monikers on this website...I spoke on this, over many, many years. I did relay the message that this was coming. I was banned so many times for creating the conversation that no one wanted to address(well, and for being a drunk poster. Sorry for that.). Please know, that I tried to inform people of the future then. Evey time I tried to help with a message or two it was always turned into a personal battle toward me and Indians or for being a canary in the coal mine. I tried to direct folks into becoming more open to working with all sectors and especially indigenous peoples of BC. There still is great opportunities for all sectors to work toward developing strong positive working relationships...to which all of our focus should be on now. When I give hints about LAW and TRUST, never have I said take DFO to court. I have always stated "USE THE LAW" and given great reference pieces to review. Cheers.

You speak to my point about not accepting this damn Supreme Court ruling on FN fisheries.

I object on a fundamentally moral level.

They are (understandably) using THE LAW to abuse this resource and I have nothing but contempt for those in the management of our fishery that turn a blind eye to what’s going on all so as to further their career.

With social media and mainstream media telling these people from a young age that the white man is the reason for every ill they have in life, I can’t see a way that they will form an alliance in regards to allocation. Why would they when now they have the winning hand?!

It’s like the powers that be want bad race relations.

 

[halimark]

An alliance is last thing they want, they do want total single possession of all and the extinction of ALL sport fishing, lets say it as it is. Courts are speeding their plans.

HM

 

[fish brain]

Still waiting for leadership and communication from an organization that already exists. Sports fishers working independently is not going to do it. Anybody know if we are close to an organization taking the lead that we can support?

I have been pleading for a coordinated coast wide response @Stizzla briefly stepped up with a protest day From Pender to Salt Spring . Believe this has to happen in every town up and down the coast.

 

[halimark]

Wrong. Plus, clearly you'll need to brush up on your legal rights. Unlike the Colonials, French and Spaniards did, the Canadian government can not extinguish the rights of any human being in this country.

I believe hunting and fishing are a privilege to all non aboriginals in Canada, murky under the Conservative's heritage act, they ARE a right for FN who have treaty's signed. You need to look at BC right now. Ask how the hunting and fishing is in most of area 5 after the court ruling. Our ability to hunt and fish is being extinguished, erode, taken away and given away as we speak, not sure where you have been. You ask me to brush up on my legal rights, I ask you to research Bill C-426 and C-246 and see how your right to hunt and fish will be if Mr Trudeau (JT) and his merry fools ever vote these in, look at Environment Canada's latest direction from JT, look at lead in the environment, one recommendation, cease the use of all lead in ALL hunting and fishing products in Canada, they have "stats" and amounts from our sports. How will that effect our sports if JT forces that thru like he is/did with C-71. What are the regs for none FN fishing in the newly promoted marine protected areas?? Closed as currently proposed, look at the Newfie Premiers worry. Only a FOOL believes we have any right to hunt and fish and only a fool believes the Liberals ever have, or ever will make laws and stand up for Hunters and Fishers. JT is also now looking at rescinding the Conservative hunter harassment law and doing away with the laws concerning donations by anti hunting organizations while keeping tax exempt status. That is not my opinion, this is ongoing in JT rat pack as we speak, this has been proven every time a liberal Gov is voted in, they are anti outdoors and constantly attacks our sports. Many on here are fooled by Sunny Ways, what's that done for us???????????? I see JT as other world leaders do = a LIER and sneaky politician with a lifetime of learning and practice from his father. Follow his speeches and he proves that.

StormTrooper, if you really believe what you wrote, I believe one day you will say" I remember the days we used to hunt and fish", WTH happened. Antis (camouflaged Liberals) WON.

Sorry for the derail, back to saving whales.

HM​

 

[Che]

>they ARE a right for FN who have treaty's signed.

Dude, there just aren't a lot of treaties signed in BC. That's part of the problem and what lead to all these court cases. James Douglas signed a few treaties with the aboriginal groups on southern vancouver island. Known as the douglas treaties, they and the 8 numbered treaties were the only ones signed between aboriginal groups and the crown until the Nisga'a treaty in 1998, over 100 years.

Aboriginal Fishing is not the issue to the decline in Salmon stocks.

 

[high tide]

>they ARE a right for FN who have treaty's signed.


Aboriginal Fishing is not the issue to the decline in Salmon stocks.

The above comment is out right laughable.
You obviously have Zero clue for what goes on along the Fraser River. ZERO!
One example.
Even when DFO has stated complete closures to everyone because of decimated stocks like last years Sockeye..... Many FN continued to fish on the lower River. Many could care less if their grand kids future in fishing could be non existent.
Another example, Thompson River Steelhead , FN dude from Merritt or Spences on FBook with his four DEAD examples of the almost extinct Fish .......
Last weeks ad on Craigslist for Fraser River Kings, $5.00 a pound....... In Washington .......
The list goes on and on.

Many FN Fish with no accountability at all. True harvest numbers thrown aside. Charges thrown aside. Etc etc.

FN harvest not part of the problem ....... Ya right.

 

[wildmanyeah]

The accountability and transparency of FSC fisheries is a real problem, Seems like their is much more monitoring/information for when their is FN commercial fisheries.

I believe harvest is a factor at preventing some stocks from having a material recovery, That includes recreational and commercial and Alaska take.

Does anyone have any CWT/Genetic data for the Fraser River Chinook Spring/Summer 5-2's?

Since this stock is considered important feed for SRKW

Edit: I found some good data http://frafs.ca/sites/default/files/2014 Post-season Fraser CN CO and CH.pdf

http://www.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/fm-gp/fraser/docs/abor-autoc/2008FrasRvrChkInformDocument.htm

 

[Che]

FN harvest not part of the problem ....... Ya right.

There's an old story about a WW2 bomber design team. They looked at the planes coming back, shot full of holes and decided to add armor to those locations on the airplane. Then one guy said, well where are they not shot full of holes. Because the planes shot in those spots aren't coming back at all. The designers armored those locations on the airplanes and more bombers (and their crews) came back.

So here you are worried about the few thousand fish coming back, and not worried at all about the millions of juveniles going out. That somehow, Aboriginal fishing is responsible for the lowered ocean suitability rates. If more juveniles survive, more adults come back. That's pretty straight forward to me, but so many people are just jealously fixated on Aboriginal fishing.

 

[wildmanyeah]

So here you are worried about the few thousand fish coming back, and not worried at all about the millions of juveniles going out. That somehow, Aboriginal fishing is responsible for the lowered ocean suitability rates. If more juveniles survive, more adults come back. That's pretty straight forward to me, but so many people are just jealously fixated on Aboriginal fishing.

Some of these Fraser River Chinook runs were just as low in the early 1980 when ocean survival rates were way higher. I believe harvest was drastically cut to all in 1980's. So again its multi factorial, When abundance is low there should be no in river netting. They cut it out in the 1980's and these stocks recovered. Also some of these stocks recovered while seals were greatly increased.

Harvest can be an issue




Some of these Chinook stocks like this one almost went extinct because they shared the same run timing as sockeye...HARVEST CAN BE AN ISSUE!!!!! in mix stock fisheries