Now That We Know TAC, What Should 2014 Limits Be?

[SophiaB]

Is that a formal invite to the Halibut Working Group table Derby? LOL

Whether your invite is rhetorical or not, it does nothing to address the fact that key information about this issue is not being shared with interested and vested parties - i.e. rec fishermen who take an interest and ask questions, there is no transparency in the process and the model is clearly broken. Everyone deflects away from these very basic, but important facts. The old catch all defensive response "step up and get involved" does nothing to answer the valid questions being asked about information the average rec fishermen should expect to have access to.

Is it not embarrassing to us all that we can't answer basic questions from these "experimental" regs, like how many fish are harvested as first versus 2nd possession fish at various times in the season and at various locations? Funding is not a defence, it costs DFO nothing to add a question or two to their creel survey data sheet in their Excel file to give out to the creelers at the beginning of the season.

Anyway, I guess I'll continue to dream about a day where an average joe interested party can get some answers from those "representing" him.

Ukee

More of a nightmare then a dream, but we are aligned forsure.

 

[Derby]

Is that a formal invite to the Halibut Working Group table Derby? LOL

Whether your invite is rhetorical or not, it does nothing to address the fact that key information about this issue is not being shared with interested and vested parties - i.e. rec fishermen who take an interest and ask questions, there is no transparency in the process and the model is clearly broken. Everyone deflects away from these very basic, but important facts. The old catch all defensive response "step up and get involved" does nothing to answer the valid questions being asked about information the average rec fishermen should expect to have access to.

Is it not embarrassing to us all that we can't answer basic questions from these "experimental" regs, like how many fish are harvested as first versus 2nd possession fish at various times in the season and at various locations? Funding is not a defence, it costs DFO nothing to add a question or two to their creel survey data sheet in their Excel file to give out to the creelers at the beginning of the season.

Anyway, I guess I'll continue to dream about a day where the average joe interested party can get some answers from those "representing" him.

Ukee

No,that's not a formal invite As it's been stated to you before on more then one occasion, get involved in the process our you involve?.... you strike me as a really smart guy, you were a regional fresh water biologist at one time correct? You would understand the politics and all the tape that requires cutting.. Perhaps you could bring another prospective to the table.... Have you gone to the meeting an ask the people involved theses questions? You might be surprised how knowledgeable some of the guys & gals are... some of the info you seek will or cannot be put on the forums .Perhaps talking to them in person yes...That is why there is a SFAC the SFAB a process although not perfect & like most process flawed but never the less there is one.... So get involved and seek the answer that you seek... When you go on this forum board and keeping beating on those good people involved I just see another key board cowboy......

Anyway, I guess I'll continue to dream about a day where an average Joe interested person can go to there local SFAC meeting get some answers from those "representing" them in person.

 

[profisher]

Down here on the south Island SVIAC did hold a meeting( in a large room at their expense) just before the local SFAC met so that concerned anglers could advice their SFAC reps as to their wishes for the upcoming halibut season. This was done because DFO will no longer fund larger SFAC meetings as we had down here in the past. The last DFO guys that attended the last large meeting got intimidated by the large vocal crowd and informed our chair that no more. So we found away around it.

 

[GLG]

Can we get back on track?
Here is option A/F
This one combines option A (last years rules) with the Option F (shoulder).
I would like some feed back on the positive and negative.
I see two things that I like.
1- same rule as last year for the folks that fish July and August (majority)
2 - get more data on this slot because we may need it for 2015
Things that I don't like
1- might not use up the TAC

Measure	Open	Daily	Possession	Annual	1st Fish Size	2nd Fish size
a. 2013 Management	July 1 - Aug 31	1	2	6	126 cm/60lb	83 cm/15lb
f	Feb 1 - Dec 31 Shoulders	1	2	6	none	83 cm/15lb

<tbody>
</tbody>

Month	Option a	Option F
	last year	shoulder
Feb	2,247	2,247
Mar	29,905	29,905
Apr	22,975	24,435
May	30,379	28,958
Jun	218,286	236,883
Jul	284,171	282,535
Aug	281,499	274,378
Sep	36,930	36,619
Oct Nov Dec	6,481	7,263
Feb		2,247
Mar		29,905
Apr		24,435
May		28,958
Jun		236,883
Jul	284,171
Aug	281,499
Sep		36,619
Oct Nov Dec		7,263
	Harvest	931,980
	Bio-risk -10%	93,198
	Total	1,025,178
	2014 Tac	1,057,950
	over/under	32,772

<tbody>
</tbody>

That's 32,772 pounds under TAC

 

[SerengetiGuide]

Fairly sure they'll pass on this...why I don't know but they're the most risk adverse group in the world (as this isn't even risky!!!) I hope logic prevails and I'm proven wrong though. I have a hunch it'll be 70 all year and we once again will be well under tac.

Positive of this, BIG positive is it has a little of everything for everyone. Not gonna go over, so long season, bigfish for part of year, always 2 possession. Only negative is it isn't 1/2 all season but not a choice ATM. Need 1.3mill for that

 

[Fish Assassin]

Why narrow it down to those 2..... Don't need to answer that

Neither of those options raise the size of our second fish..... I'd rather a larger second fish then a pretend I want to kill a fish of a life time. Tourist still come from around the world to catch and release Sturgeon of all sizes. Why is it people don't think we can catch and release large halibut and still catch enough meat for our families.

 

[bigbruce]

I can live with this. However, I'm with FA - would like to see the "second" fish limit raised to, say, 20 lbs, even if it's at the expense of the "no limit" on the shoulders or a slightly shorter season.

 

[Samnjoe]

Second fish size needs to be raised to around 25 pounds at least.

 

[ziggy]

If i'm reading this right and there is no size limit on the first fish during the shoulder, how can the total remain the same or in one case go down?

 

[SerengetiGuide]

Last year we used up 850k so I'm confused what you mean ziggy

 

[scott craven]

Lots of opinions on what might work, however DFO will ultimately lay down
the regs for us.
I wouldn't be surprised if it was exactly the same as last year

1 daily /2 possession
6 fish annual
March 15 to Dec 31
126 cm , 83cm slots

If I was a betting man, I'd bet on it.

 

[spring fever]

Lots of opinions on what might work, however DFO will ultimately lay down
the regs for us.
I wouldn't be surprised if it was exactly the same as last year

1 daily /2 possession
6 fish annual
March 15 to Dec 31
126 cm , 83cm slots

If I was a betting man, I'd bet on it.

Yeah I think you are probably right-once something is taken away it seldom is returned. Voodoo math will make sure the TAC surplus will be made to disappear. Kind of like the fox guarding the henhouse!! Man I wish there was an independent overseer of halibut catch!

 

[ziggy]

Last year we used up 850k so I'm confused what you mean ziggy

In the chart where it shows last year in one column and option f in the other. It shows Feb, Mar as the same Apr as slightly more and May as slightly less. If option f is with no limit and option a is with a 126 cm limit, I don't get how the monthly totals are arrived at. I must be missing something. Not talking the overall, but obviously it would be impacted if monthly totals are wrong.

 

[SerengetiGuide]

Ask dfo...their model.

 

[ziggy]

Ask dfo...their model.

I thought maybe GLG could shed some light as he posted it. Hard to agree with something without understanding it?

 

[SerengetiGuide]

Agreed. You might make ukee go on a tear again with that comment ha ha

They get numbers and obviously from past few years they are not accurate

Still best option is C combined with F in my opinion

 

[GLG]

In the chart where it shows last year in one column and option f in the other. It shows Feb, Mar as the same Apr as slightly more and May as slightly less. If option f is with no limit and option a is with a 126 cm limit, I don't get how the monthly totals are arrived at. I must be missing something. Not talking the overall, but obviously it would be impacted if monthly totals are wrong.

That's a good question. I used the DFO 2nd table in all the calculations. Here is their explanation of those numbers
"Feb/March estimates for all options are based on 2013 regime (option A) since the current angling licences contain regulations for the Halibut fishery which expire March 31 2014."

So this year we will be under those rules and we should see those amounts if all things are equal.

 

[ziggy]

Thanks, GLG, it makes more sense for this year in as far as Feb and March go.

 

[Tips Up]

Agree with Craven. Don't think annual limit will change as they would have to redesign license again.

Would like to see the size limit moved up a bit. I have no problem with releasing fish pushing 100 but I hate to release a 65lb fish.
No change is easy way out for DFO.

Hoping for March 1. (some good tides in early March) Can't see why not. I think it only got pushed later because decisions are not made early enough.

Should start new thread on "What do you think regs WILL be this year" - To keep this one on track.

Tips

 

[SerengetiGuide]

Have room to make upper limit 80lbs.