FISH FARMS HAVE TO GO!!!!!!!

[fishman69er]

if you read my posts a little better you might realize that this is not my so call pessimistic outlook, but my out look on the way that people fear what they dont know and they also fall into the propaganda of people who are agaisnst these fishfarms,and start a witch hunt to GET RID OF THEM, instead of mabye ,just mabye finding and working on a bettter system, oh and did you say proper managment by DFO, thats freakin halarious

 

[scott craven]

bring in more SPORT fishermen and let all those guys catch and kill all the fish they can now therees no fish left, so i guess you will be bitchin about the sportfishermen 20 years down the road, but hey the farms are gone, now the coastal towns have gone under and nobody has any jobs because theres no loggin, no fishin,no fishfarms, now theres no tourisam, because the sporties have wiped out the entire wild stock, so what now???
pretty grim future eh,

well if that ain't pessimism, i don't know what is ???

 

[fishman69er]

whats the difference between what i put compared to any of the stuff about how fishfarms are goin to totally wipe out wild stocks, i am just offering a different thought on the whole situation, but i guess thats the nice thing about a good open for disscusion topic such as this its very debatable, and there are a very wide opinion about the subject

 

[dohboy]

wow 69 you sure dont listen , wolf said read his past post's and you would see he is not for shutting the farms down but better managing them, as for going where logging has gone i sure hope your not implying logging has shut down, if so it is you who needs to head out in the bush and see for yourself the pilaging that is still going on, clear cut after clear cut, it is just too bad they log with bigger faster machines and ship our raw logs away, sending all those small town jobs with it, once again we go back to a govt issue of management, i think everyone on this site agrees with some of what you have said but your attitude is what might be causing you some issues
woops did i say that[:0]
just my 2 cents
dohboy

 

[bloodhound]

dohboy!! please don't speak of those massive barges fully loaded with raw logs going by my cabin on the inlet. makes me cry!!!

 

[wolf]

69 your missing the point as to what i am saying!!!!!!!!!!!!! please re read ok one more time just for you!!!!!!

I am not going to run the one in nananimo first thing and the main reason it fails because its too cost effective to run it because they cant compete with the other outfits but if THEY all had to go the land route then it would all put them on the same playing field for costs ill use a rough figure for you and this is totally made up figures ok if the land guys have got to charge $10 a fish and the one that have the farms in the ocean only charge $5 a fish of course they cant compete, got me so far.

From the report I saw and read considering land ones they can do it but, they cost more money to run and need people there 24/7 to make sure generators, pumps, filters are running at all times it can be done but they choose not you cant blame them at all but as soon as the gov. will hopefully change it then ALL farms will have to comply and unfortunatlly the consumer will have to pay more for it big deal we already are paying more than double from 10 years ago for gas,and other things just another thing what would you suggest?

As for employment the sport fishing industry take approx. 5% of the salmon totalls in the ocean but employ almost 200,000 people up and down the coast and generate close to 3 billion a year in revenues from this industry do you think fish farms do? you got to remember it its a domino effect to a little corner grocery store,hotels airports, restaurants,tourist traps all the way to the lodges the money filters to all up and down from victoria to the charlottes do you think fish farms DO!!!!!!!


Wolf

 

[fishman69er]

as you say to me i will return to you , you are not gettin as to what i am sayin,ok yes your right about the on land thing and yes we ARE in agreeance, and it is unfortunate that the govt would not step in and help make it work , but you know our govt, as for employin people up and down the coast you have to consider that those thing you talk about, the stores, airports,etc, and yes even the tourist traps , did you know that the so called whale watchin boats that travel out of tofino are doin fishfarms tours as the are lookin for whales, so yes we are on the same page to a extent, but if you belive that the sporties are only takin 5% of the fish, if this is what i read correctly, then i am sorry ,you are grossly misdirected, anywho , its funny how many people can attack someone when there opinion is diderent than the masses, as for doboy well first off let me tell ya that i KNOW that loggin is still goin on and it will be for a long time seein as it is the main resouce on the island and for most of bc, but the loggin practices have changed for the better than it was 40 years ago, and yes this is a touchy subject to , by that i mean the export of OUR wood,as for you thinkin that my attiude might be a factor , well i am just tryin to, again, shed some light for those that have less knowledge on the subject, not that i am a expert, just sharin what i know

 

[wolf]

Well im sure someone will post the correct amout of what is caugt by sporties,commercial,native.

Whale watching is doing a tour!!!!! whales, seals,eagles,trees birds etc, im sure they dont say to there guests, hey!!! we are going to go look at a fish farm cmom dont insult us we are not that stupid!!!!I do respect what you are saying because a good debate is good thats one thing we can agree on


Wolf

 

[fishman69er]

well i am glad to see this thing gettin back into control, as for someone postin the right amount of fish being caught, that would impley that every one out there is recording everything , well i know forsure that there is ALOT of how do you say dishonest people out there , to bad eh, as for the tours heres a story for ya about two yrs after i had finished fishfarmin on the west coast(tofino), the wifes boss sent us to the wick for a weekend and paid for a whale watchin trip, well after we got pass catsface and into whale area we where not findin the whales so this is when the boat operater anounced that due to the lack of whales we would try to find some bears and check out a eagles nest then he added that we would show a diidernt couple fish farms, well wouldnt you know it he took us right to the two farms that i had spent the last 7 yrs workin on, i am sure glad i didnt pay for the trip, after i told him about my knowledge of the area, i all of the sudden became the tour guide, and i sure did find many bears, and a couple whales, also one of the largest eagles nest on the west coast of the island is right behind a farm i worked on for yrs, also when i work on the farms the boats would pull up every day of the season, some would even come on to the farm for a tour, so dont tell me that i am b.s.in , and no i am sure that they dont tell ya that, hey today we are goin to visit a smelly fish farm, not to good for biesness, but once they got ya on the boat, what are ya goin to do, well thats it then ensure the future C&R

 

[Red Monster]

'I Did Not Have Public Relations with that Fish'
Rachel Carson: Spun in her grave And other PR half-truths.

Checkout the link below for a piece that came out yesterday about how fish farmers use bogus PR spun by folks like Greenline Strategies. All too often lazy voters choose not to focus on environmental issues in part because they're too confused by the half-truths and outright BS sponsored by those who are exploiting the environment. The jury's been in for some time: Fish farms are bad news. And it's time we told those who remain in denial --that small number of grossly unqualified and biased folks-- where they can stick the fish farms.

http://thetyee.ca/Views/2006/11/13/PR/

 

[Rum Buddies]

So the defence for ocean based fish farms is the offer something for whale watching boats to look at should they not find any whales?

Ever think that there might be less whales in the area because there is less feed in the area?

Come on, arguing that fish farms aren't harmful is ridiculous. I like wolf's idea, make them all land based and we all win.

 

[ringo]

Here's a link to a different slant on the topic, http://www.salmonfarmers.org/pdfs/critical_review_of_Krkosek.pdf

 

[Rum Buddies]

well I tend not to trust information put out by the salmon farming industry itself and many of the arguments in that paper are down right ridiculous.

Which would you believe and actual scientific study done by the university of Alberta or a damage control piece done by the BC Salmon Farmers Association.

 

[Barbender]

I always find it amazing that people are willing to take everything the anti fish farming groups say as the gospel truth. Yet when someone says something that might contradict what the anti farmers are saying they are immediately discredited and their credentials are questioned. Take Alexandra Morton for example. She is not a biologist yet everything she says is taken as fact. When DFO or someoene else says "hey I think she is wrong" then for some reason everyone starts saying they are in business with the farmers or have a hidden agenda. I think people need to have slightly more open minds and not get taken down the road by a bunch of zealots that are in bed with commercial fishermen. Just food for thought.

 

[Nerka]

Ringo,

Check out

http://www.math.ualberta.ca/~mkrkosek/Brooks_response.htm

for a statement from the lead author (Martin KrKosek) regarding Ken Brooks "critical review".

It is important to note that the usual scientific process for proceeding with a review like this is to submit it as a comment to the journal, go through the scientific peer-review process, and allow the original authors to respond to the concerns.

The fact that Brooks does not do this (even though he is well aware of the practice, he is a "scientist") raises serious concerns about his motives, never mind his level of professionalism.

Cheers,

Nerka

 

[sockeye seeker]

MP Kieth Martin has read this post, and his assistant Jeff Silvester noted that there were a number of compelling arguments on this site.
His tel# is 474-6505 if someone would like to talk to him on the subject. I feel that it's very unlikely that the fish farms will be totally shut down.
One thing that could be done on our coast is testing as is being done on the east:
In the much colder waters off eastern Canada, Thierry Chopin of the University of New Brunswick and his coworkers have experimented with combining salmon farming with other types of aquaculture.
"Don't put all your salmon eggs in the same basket," Chopin says. The waste from one species can be food for another.
The researchers have combined salmon farming with mussel and kelp farming. They found that mussels grew better right next to the fish cages, and kelp thrived when it grew a bit farther away.
At the same time, the shellfish and seaweed helped clean up waste generated by the salmon farms, Chopin says.
Regarding sea lice - Studies are being done elsewhere. We should be looking at what other countries are doing about their problems, so we don't have to start from scratch. see "Multi-party project studies sea lice dynamics in a complete fjord system".
http://www.marineharvest.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=137&Itemid=0

 

[Red Monster]

Found this note on the link I mentioned above. I think I'll watch it.

This evening, Nov. 15, CBC TV will be airing a show on the Fifth Estate called the "Denial Machine." It will discuss the people involved in denying global warming and how they influence "political leaders." It is on at 9 PM.

And like I said: And it's time we told those who remain in denial --that small number of grossly unqualified and biased folks-- where they can stick the fish farms.

 

[Rum Buddies]

quote:anti fish farming groups say as the gospel truth

Well as far as I know the University of Alberta is not in bed with the commericial fisherman.

 

[Oglthorpe]

quote:Originally posted by Red Monster

about how fish farmers use bogus PR spun by folks like Greenline Strategies. All too often lazy voters choose not to focus on environmental issues in part because they're too confused by the half-truths and outright BS sponsored by those who are exploiting the environment.

Are you saying that environmental groups that run smear campaigns are not biased to one side?

 

[fishman69er]

Are we back at this again, look, we can sit here and pull diferent links out our as#@^s all day long, because there are SO many for and SO many against, that they would never end, and i can hear it now, "well that was a independent study", PLEASE let me tell ya , they are never INDEPENDENT, they are always either for or against,but you guys are going to belive what you want to , and there is no changing your thoughts or views because i thought i shed some light on alot of things, well i guess not, And to you poppa, where the hell did you read i my post that i say its a defence for fish farms, read again, i was just tellin a story about a experince that i had!!! Well, to tell the truth i didnt read one of the links that have been recently posted because i know exactly what they say, one says, FISH FARM BAD, the other say, FISH FARM GOOD, its the never ending circle.
I was wonderin if this fourm would *** back up, due to its never endin debatable subject, and here it is
next
ensure the future