Thousands of 10-pound Atlantic salmon, catch as many as you want!

[fogged in]

So when 42% of people think Open Ocean Farmed salmon harms the environment, we need to take heed, I say
Can't disagree with the 53% who say it's an important industry BUT it should be done in dry land closed containment!
If this was the world wide policy, it might drive the price up a few cents per pound, but we all would be better off!
my bet is that figure to Ban will increase over the next few years.
And I also say good for the 1st Nation people for standing up to these disease riddled farms.
It is not the first time in the history of Canada unlawful protests have taken place to fight gross wrong doing!
CHEK Point Poll: Should sea based salmon farming be banned?
Yes, salmon farming is a threat to the environment
6,137 votes
42%
No, salmon farming is an important industry
8,403 votes
58%

Votes 14,540
Thank you for voting!
Votes 14,540

 

[agentaqua]

Tofino fishermen catching escaped Atlantic salmon
Posted By: Tyler Bennetton: September 01, 2017
https://www.cheknews.ca/tofino-fishermen-catching-escaped-atlantic-salmon-362213/

 

[agentaqua]

So when you fish or hunt or even live in "their" territory do YOU get their permission? Anyone who defends these protests and then turns around and doesnt get " their approval" to enjoy "their land" are Hippocrates all of you

I think the people who made the decision to manage the so-called "Indian Question" the way they did during the expansionist stage of our collective colonial history should be the ones held accountable for the mess we still find ourselves today. Obviously being dead - means they didn't live long enough to deal with the mess they left their descendants - along with the aboriginal survivors. We are still living through this "experiment" in colonization governance & domination - and there's quite a bit of both history and understanding of the colonial law NOT TAUGHT in our school system - along with aboriginal history/culture. It's a much broader topic than this thread can accommodate.

 

[UkeeDreamin]

So when 42% of people think Open Ocean Farmed salmon harms the environment, we need to take heed, I say
Can't disagree with the 53% who say it's an important industry BUT it should be done in dry land closed containment!
If this was the world wide policy, it might drive the price up a few cents per pound, but we all would be better off!
my bet is that figure to Ban will increase over the next few years.
And I also say good for the 1st Nation people for standing up to these disease riddled farms.
It is not the first time in the history of Canada unlawful protests have taken place to fight gross wrong doing!
CHEK Point Poll: Should sea based salmon farming be banned?
Yes, salmon farming is a threat to the environment
6,137 votes
42%
No, salmon farming is an important industry
8,403 votes
58%

Votes 14,540
Thank you for voting!
Votes 14,540

I'm no fan of net pen salmon farming but the CHEK poll specifically asks "should ocean net pens salmon farming be banned?" And 60% of folks say no ... I appreciate you're passionate about your personal stance on the topic but it's pretty obvious how the general public views this topic despite a very active and organized anti lobby.

Cheers!

Ukee

 

[agentaqua]

Got one today on an anchovy.

I believe all the FF spokesmen have been placating the public concern by saying the escaped Atlantics only eat pellets - and won't survive. Guess you just proved them wrong, fishtofino....

 

[fogged in]

I'm no fan of net pen salmon farming but the CHEK poll specifically asks "should ocean net pens salmon farming be banned?" And 60% of folks say no ... I appreciate you're passionate about your personal stance on the topic but it's pretty obvious how the general public views this topic despite a very active and organized anti lobby.
Cheers!
Ukee

Yes indeed 58% said "salmon farming is an important industry" last time I checked.
I was surprised to see 42%" said they should be banned altogether.
A better questions would have been "should open pen Atlantic Fish Farms be move to closed containment land based production"
That is my point. Can anyone give me a cost per pound of making the move?
We know those trying land based fish farming have trouble competing price wise with ocean pens.
As far as your comment "despite a very active and organized anti lobby." there is no stronger lobby group then that of the Fish Farms!!!

 

[agentaqua]

B.C. First Nations occupy a second salmon farm as company raises safety concerns
Marine Harvest says protests are creating unsafe conditions at farms
By Laura Kane, The Canadian Press Posted: Sep 02, 2017
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...m-as-company-raises-safety-concerns-1.4273628

 

[GLG]

Not sure if anyone has posted this link but WDFW is tracking them and mapping them.

WDFW is asking anglers who catch Atlantic salmon that escaped from a salmon farm Aug. 19, 2017, near the San Juan Islands to report their catch. State fishery managers would like to track how many Atlantic salmon are recovered by sport anglers and how far those fish dispersed.

http://wdfw.wa.gov/fishing/salmon/atlantic_catch_map.php

 

[UkeeDreamin]

Yes indeed 58% said "salmon farming is an important industry" last time I checked.
I was surprised to see 42%" said they should be banned altogether.
A better questions would have been "should open pen Atlantic Fish Farms be move to closed containment land based production"
That is my point. Can anyone give me a cost per pound of making the move?
We know those trying land based fish farming have trouble competing price wise with ocean pens.
As far as your comment "despite a very active and organized anti lobby." there is no stronger lobby group then that of the Fish Farms!!!

Yes, and 58% said No it shouldn't be banned because it's an important industry. We're in agreement that it is a poorly worded poll w/ only two answer options and I'm pretty sure we're in agreement that we both personally feel invasive species shouldn't be farmed in our ocean but you can't pretend that this poll is showing anything other than a strong majority of the general public isn't opposed to the industry as it currently operates at this time.

Cheers!

Ukee

 

[shuswap]

Got one today on an anchovy.

A salmon or trout eating or eliciting a feeding response to piscivorous species.....That's mind blowing. I thought they just ate insects, plankton and for others...pellets.

I caught a rainbow trout on a plug and a Rappala once. I guess I was onto something back when I was a teenager. Should have published a paper on it. Love halibut.

 

[agentaqua]

...Love halibut.

I hear they are keen on escaped Atlantics for bait

 

[agentaqua]

Is There a Better Way to Farm Fish?
We’ve just seen how open-net operations can go wrong. It’s time to look at the alternatives.

By Amorina Kingdon Today | Hakai Magazine
https://thetyee.ca/News/2017/09/04/Better-Way-To-Farm-Fish/

 

[shuswap]

I hear they are keen on escaped Atlantics for bait

Lol....ok

 

[bigdogeh]

A better questions would have been "should open pen Atlantic Fish Farms be move to closed containment land based production"

I wonder what the outcome would have been if the question was asked "Do you think a strong open net pen fish farm industry along our inland coastal waterways is more important than the health of our wild salmon and the wild salmon industry? Would you be in favor of moving the fish farms to on land rearing pens if science said this was a better alternative for the health and ultimate survival of what are left of our wild salmon stocks?"
Because it seems it's coming down to one or the other. And the science is on the side of the advocates that believe open net fish farms should be removed from the ocean.

 

[agentaqua]

Competing efforts emerge to track escaped Atlantic salmon in B.C.
Derrick Penner
Published on: September 5, 2017
http://vancouversun.com/news/local-...merge-to-track-escaped-atlantic-salmon-in-b-c

 

[agentaqua]

Ignore the Lame Excuses: What 300,000 Escaped Salmon Prove About Factory Fish Farming
Sustainable-food advocates want to love aquaculture—yet it comes with so many risks.
http://www.yesmagazine.org/planet/p...al&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

 

[Whole in the Water]

I'm no fan of net pen salmon farming but the CHEK poll specifically asks "should ocean net pens salmon farming be banned?" And 60% of folks say no ... I appreciate you're passionate about your personal stance on the topic but it's pretty obvious how the general public views this topic despite a very active and organized anti lobby.

Cheers!

Ukee

Highly doubtful that this survey is an accurate and true indicator of how the general population feels about this industry.

You need more surveys with larger and more importantly randomly selected participants to have a higher level of confidence that the survey results accurately reflect the opinions of the general population on this subject. A basic course or an intro book on survey statistics will clearly indicate this.

TV/radio station surveys are typically smaller and more biased (i.e. less random) and thus are not that accurate. You have to randomly select survey participants to reduce bias. For all we know the FF supporters forwarded this link to as many other FF supporters they know and so on...

 

[tincan]

@bones Here is your one paper that says farmed fish are infected with disease... HSMI to be exact.

Interesting side note is that the fish farm industry as well as CFIA (fed gov't) denied that any diseases existed in these fish farms all the way up until HSMI was found by this research team. The research was funded with primarily private funds via the SSHI and who knows if/when this disease would have been discovered/announced if not for that. Another interesting tidbit it that the initial samples that were found to have the disease HSMI were from 2004 so this disease existed for at LEAST a couple of years in our waters and were hidden from the general public knowing. The fish farming industry was extremely reluctant and a pain in the butt to deal with during these studies according to researchers I have spoken with personally and the only way they got this done was by bringing in the feds/Miller to essentially force the farms to provide access to samples. Pretty sad state of affairs when it takes this sort of effort to find out that a potentially harmful disease to wild salmon has been floating around these farms for years.

And then guys like @Birdsnest and others play the 'lets just move the goalposts' game as follows:

1) claim that no diseases exist
2) disease discovered
3) try to discredit the science / methodology (impossible to do in this case as the research team made sure testing methods passed all international standards BEFORE they began testing
4) finally admit that the disease exists but that it's no problem
5) try to conflate the findings with other diseases / pathogens to confuse the public about things
6) etc etc etc.

These apologists will continue to defend open net pen farms as long as they are making a living doing so. It's no different than the tobacco industry or many others like it. Diseases in fish farms are just 1 of the many harmful aspects to the industry. Our coast and our salmon are resilient to a certain extent but it baffles the mind to think we will continue to play russian roulette with our wild fish like we are doing now.

http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0171471
Abstract
Heart and skeletal muscle inflammation (HSMI) is an emerging disease of marine-farmed Atlantic Salmon (Salmo salar), first recognized in 1999 in Norway, and later also reported in Scotland and Chile. We undertook a longitudinal study involving health evaluation over an entire marine production cycle on one salmon farm in British Columbia (Canada). In previous production cycles at this farm site and others in the vicinity, cardiac lesions not linked to a specific infectious agent or disease were identified. Histologic assessments of both live and moribund fish samples collected at the farm during the longitudinal study documented at the population level the development, peak, and recovery phases of HSMI. The fish underwent histopathological evaluation of all tissues, Twort’s Gram staining, immunohistochemistry, and molecular quantification in heart tissue of 44 agents known or suspected to cause disease in salmon. Our analysis showed evidence of HSMI histopathological lesions over an 11-month timespan, with the prevalence of lesions peaking at 80–100% in sampled fish, despite mild clinical signs with no associated elevation in mortalities reported at the farm level. Diffuse mononuclear inflammation and myodegeneration, consistent with HSMI, was the predominant histologic observation in affected heart and skeletal muscle. Infective agent monitoring identified three agents at high prevalence in salmon heart tissue, including Piscine orthoreovirus (PRV), and parasites Paranucleospora theridion and Kudoa thyrsites. However, PRV alone was statistically correlated with the occurrence and severity of histopathological lesions in the heart. Immunohistochemical staining further localized PRV throughout HSMI development, with the virus found mainly within red blood cells in early cases, moving into the cardiomyocytes within or, more often, on the periphery of the inflammatory reaction during the peak disease, and reducing to low or undetectable levels later in the production cycle. This study represents the first longitudinal assessment of HSMI in a salmon farm in British Columbia, providing new insights on the pathogenesis of the disease.

I dont believe I have made any claims on behalf of the farming industry. I have asked one question "wasn't this only found in one fish on one farm?"
And i do believe I have asked in a pleasant manor and not called anyone out or belittled anyone. To bad it always comes down to this.
On a side note can anyone provide one paper that says farmed fish are infected with disease? Just asking again.

 

[rockdog]

Highly doubtful that this survey is an accurate and true indicator of how the general population feels about this industry.

You need more surveys with larger and more importantly randomly selected participants to have a higher level of confidence that the survey results accurately reflect the opinions of the general population on this subject. A basic course or an intro book on survey statistics will clearly indicate this.

TV/radio station surveys are typically smaller and more biased (i.e. less random) and thus are not that accurate. You have to randomly select survey participants to reduce bias. For all we know the FF supporters forwarded this link to as many other FF supporters they know and so on...

I had actually spent some time and read some of the hundreds of comments. 98% of the comments were in favour of removing the net pens, many of them strongly in favour. No one took the time to comment for the 'no' (FF side). So I looked into it a little further, and found out that if you 'refresh' the page after you voted, you could vote again. It's clear the industry figured this out pretty early on. As I said, the comments were overwhelmingly in favour of the 'yes' vote.

I wasn't going to post this as it's just gonna start a shitnado, but whatever...this argument is tiring.

 

[agentaqua]

First Nations leaders rally in solidarity with salmon farm occupation
Document urging the province to move fish farms in-land to be delivered to Premier John Horgan
By Jon Hernandez, CBC News Posted: Sep 07, 2017 8:01 PM PT
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...idarity-with-salmon-farm-occupation-1.4279850