Winter supply of Chinook salmon critical to survival of orcas,

[Derby]

Subject: Winter supply of Chinook salmon critical to survival of orcas, says study

I thought you would be interested in this story I found on MSN: Winter supply of Chinook salmon critical to survival of orcas, says study http://a.msn.com/01/en-ca/BB1ecUHF?ocid=se

 

[ericl]

Somewhere on the internet is a recent tracking study of the J, K, & L pods. K & L went as far south as San Francisco in the winter/spring, sometimes more than once per year. Spring Chinook start coming back to the Columbia in Feb; K&L come for Chum's in Puget Sound in the Fall but J pod seems to be homebodies.

 

[ship happens]

Whoever these people are who keep doing these articles on claim research and so on so forth, really getting tired of the pretentious attitudes.

last year I argued the misinformed given information about their diet, as they said they only eat chinook salmon. Lol FML I have seen these whales a hundred times. Seen them eat seals, herring, salmon. These whales are not starving. These whales don't get tired either lol. They continually move around and go where they see fit. Stop messing with the whales! Stop chasing the whales!

Bottom line here is if these people think that sport fisherman and or even commercial fisherman are going to out fish an Orca your out of your G**Damn mind!

 

[SpringVelocity]

Northern Humpbacks are next now.

If the whales are starving what's with all the new births?

 

[agentaqua]

They preferentially eat LARGE salmon and selectively take out the largest and oldest Chinook and other species (chum, etc.) - the breeders with the most eggs... that's not how the authors are coaching this one tho.

 

[ship happens]

They eat everything. They are the best fisherman on the coast

 

[ericl]

Northern Humpbacks are next now.

If the whales are starving what's with all the new births?

Maybe the latest restrictions??????????

 

[SpringVelocity]

Maybe the latest restrictions??????????

Yeah right. OK EricL

 

[agentaqua]

Humpbacks, and more recently - grey whales - have been increasing their numbers substantially for the past 20 years or so, along with seals. This has nothing no do with the most recent Chinook restrictions, but the fact that they used to be hunted and that has stopped. Younger humpbacks seems to prefer the innermost (or uppermost) inlets on the North and Central coasts, while the older humpbacks congregate more in packs in many coastal areas - and both demographics eat herring (both adults and juveniles), along with Eulachon and anything else they can get their baleen plates on. Grey whales seem to be more benthic eaters - eating shellfish and other near bottom critters.

To paint this as some kind of a "success' attributed to the most recent efforts of the marine mammal lobby is beyond stupid - surreal and dishonest, I would call it. Taking large amounts of herring (and Eulachons) from all marine mammals has large-scale impacts not acknowledged by the "feel-good" stories posted by the enthusiasts and the ENGOs.

 

[ship happens]

Herring is a sustainable fishery and resource. The commercial fishery doesnt even dent the herring supply on the west coast. Not even close.

 

[gone fishin]

Herring is a sustainable fishery and resource. The commercial fishery doesnt even dent the herring supply on the west coast. Not even close.

Which "west coast" are you referring to?
DFO 2021
West Coast Vancouver Island: Closed to commercial harvest due to persistent in a low biomass

 

[ziggy]

These articles play to the cancel culture out there. It would have been interesting if they stressed for the most part the whales overwinter elsewhere , but that doesn’t fit the local fundraisers. Many think Resident Whales reside here and as such the groups clamouring for donations to pay for their summer cruises under the guise of researching the coast, will use this fact out of context to justify their existence.

Also,this whole thing about diets has been spun by the ENGO lobby. Remember when most of us called BS on the fact the whales were portrayed as willing to starve rather than eat any other species of salmon or fish in general? Now low and behold, as common sense always dictated and most fishermen already knew, their research indicates the whales actually are eating whatever is readily available. Watch though how this becomes the battle cry to shut down more fishing.

 

[terrin]

These articles play to the cancel culture out there. It would have been interesting if they stressed for the most part the whales overwinter elsewhere , but that doesn’t fit the local fundraisers. Many think Resident Whales reside here and as such the groups clamouring for donations to pay for their summer cruises under the guise of researching the coast, will use this fact out of context to justify their existence.

Also,this whole thing about diets has been spun by the ENGO lobby. Remember when most of us called BS on the fact the whales were portrayed as willing to starve rather than eat any other species of salmon or fish in general? Now low and behold, as common sense always dictated and most fishermen already knew, their research indicates the whales actually are eating whatever is readily available. Watch though how this becomes the battle cry to shut down more fishing.

I recall about 10 years back fishing just out front of miracle beach about 30 or more orcas came cruising down from Carmanah the black rockfish very close to shore were just bubbling out of the water by at least a foot and I’m sure they were not doing a happy dance.

 

[ericl]

Somehow I don't think the aerial photo's of SRKW looking thin compared to other photo's of the same whales at different times are part of a Liberal Pinko Socialist plot to shut-down a bunch of conservative conspiracy theorist sports fishers.

 

[agentaqua]

Somehow I don't think the aerial photo's of SRKW looking thin compared to other photo's of the same whales at different times are part of a Liberal Pinko Socialist plot to shut-down a bunch of conservative conspiracy theorist sports fishers.

No - I don't think it is a "Liberal Pinko Socialist plot" neither, eric. But I do see the narrative developed promoting intervention to protect what some groups claim is the SRKW prey while simultaneously declaring that we "can't do anything about seals because we don't know what we are doing and there will be unintended consequences" a disingenuous, misleading, hypocritical narrative developed by groups with substantial and undeclared conflicts of interest as well as a lack of background and interest in salmon and specifically Chinook, and how effective the closures were/are. And the real reason for the closures is that Canada could have been shut out of the seafood market in the states if Canada did not mirror NOAAs closures under the U.S. Marine Mammal Protection Act (MMPA).

At the end of the day - the whale watching tour operators and marine mammal researchers earn their $ by having more whales & seals. They have not yet acknowledged the biomass of fish required for this neither - and there is science out there that they don't acknowledge on this point neither:

Competing tradeoffs between increasing marine mammal predation and fisheries harvest of Chinook salmon - Scientific Reports

Many marine mammal predators, particularly pinnipeds, have increased in abundance in recent decades, generating new challenges for balancing human uses with recovery goals via ecosystem-based management. We used a spatio-temporal bioenergetics model of the Northeast Pacific Ocean to quantify how...

www.nature.com

Resurgence of an apex marine predator and the decline in prey body size

Recent recoveries of marine mammal populations worldwide have heightened concerns for their potential impacts on global fisheries. While predator-induced reductions in prey abundance have been documented, trait-mediated changes in life-history characteristics are rarely considered. Here we...

www.pnas.org

https://besjournals.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/1365-2664.13772

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/fog.12109

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/312178591_Estimates_of_Chinook_salmon_consumption_in_Washington_State_inland_waters_by_four_marine_mammal_predators_from_1970_-_2015

Canadian Science Publishing

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/277336750_Predicting_the_effects_of_whale_population_recovery_on_Northeast_Pacific_food_webs_and_fisheries_An_ecosystem_modelling_approach

https://spo.nmfs.noaa.gov/sites/default/files/pdf-content/2013/howard.pdf

Exploring the potential role of late stage predation and Chinook salmon age structure

hdl.handle.net

A century of Chinook salmon consumption by marine mammal predators in the Northeast Pacific Ocean - ScienceDirect

 

[fish4all]

Which "west coast" are you referring to?
DFO 2021
West Coast Vancouver Island: Closed to commercial harvest due to persistent in a low biomass

And when was the last commercial fishery there? And what is stopping the biomass in that area from increasing since the last fishery?
Gulf of Georgia stock is healthy.
Central area stock is very very healthy but only FN get access. North Coast is healthy but again FN only.
Haida Gwaii is also healthy but trying to survey the island with one boat is a joke.

 

[ship happens]

And when was the last commercial fishery there? And what is stopping the biomass in that area from increasing since the last fishery?
Gulf of Georgia stock is healthy.
Central area stock is very very healthy but only FN get access. North Coast is healthy but again FN only.
Haida Gwaii is also healthy but trying to survey the island with one boat is a joke.

Well there you go. I didnt really want to say it, but let it be said. From my knowledge there is only one area in which the herring low, all the west coast is doing excellent. First nations will not allow access to the fishery.

Either way if you calculated the entire herring population in west coast waters BC wide, and you estimated the commercial fishery side by side, the commercial fishery combined would be less than 10 percent.

 

[SpringVelocity]

Oh look a female calf who knew? Looks starved.

 

[RalphH]

Quota debate heats up on the eve of Vancouver Island herring fishery - Today In BC

Industry and conservationists weigh in how much catch should be allowed as DFO decision coming soon

www.bclocalnews.com

Feds called on to enforce emergency closure of B.C.’s last herring fishery | The Narwhal

Conservation groups are calling for the immediate closure of the herring fishery in the Strait of Georgia following the release of new federal government data showing a four-year population biomass decline of almost 60 per cent. “We’ve been systematically overfishing these stocks and the Gulf of...

thenarwhal.ca

Strait of Georgia Herring in Steep Decline - Pacific Wild

For immediate release October 29, 2019 STRAIT OF GEORGIA HERRING IN STEEP DECLINE New DFO data validates concerns of First Nations and conservation groups, shows 60% decline in biomass since 2016. (Coast Salish Territory/Strait of Georgia) International and local conservation groups are calling...

pacificwild.org

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/bc-herring-fishery-1.5479104

government estimates that the total mass Pacific herring in the area will fall from 130,000 metric tons in 2016 to around 54,000 metric tons in 2020 — a nearly a 60 per cent decrease over four years.

 

[ship happens]

The entire commercial fleet is allocated 10,000 tons combined. That's the quota for roe herring in the straight of georgia. There is right now as we speak around 140 tons in the straight of Georgia. That's just in one area of bc

So when the boys get their quota, they will have taken less than 10 percent. There is no way that taking 10 percent of a fishery would cause a collapse. Not a chance.