Halibut - Public Sick of Whining

[sport rec]

Removed content.

 

[hali hunter]

This commie must be a spokesperson for the general public.

 

[GLG]

Public opinions...

Oh (sport rec) Keith and Skye you have the facts wrong.
The halibut that the commercials harvest don't go to the 33 million Canadians.
In fact 80% of the halibut they harvest get's shipped out of the country.
They freeze it up and send it out and only a very few get to see the money from a common property resource.
Perhaps when the common Canadian fishermen that uses a guide or goes out on his own boat is told there is not enough Halibut, you should think why that is.
Let's hope Ottawa stops treating the commercial halibut fishermen like spoiled children and give the Canadian Halibut back to the people who are the rightful owners of this resource. Ever heard of the BNA act or the Magna Carta. These documents give the resource to the people. Not the Government or the commercial fishermen.
GLG

 

[Little Hawk]

Too late Holmsie, you did...

 

[Cuba Libre]

Does deserve a reply to the Record newspaper. Why not take a few minutes and email the editor telling him and the Comox valley that you deserve a fair share etc

 

[sport rec]

Oh (sport rec) Keith and Skye you have the facts wrong.
The halibut that the commercials harvest don't go to the 33 million Canadians.
In fact 80% of the halibut they harvest get's shipped out of the country.
They freeze it up and send it out and only a very few get to see the money from a common property resource.
Perhaps when the common Canadian fishermen that uses a guide or goes out on his own boat is told there is not enough Halibut, you should think why that is.
Let's hope Ottawa stops treating the commercial halibut fishermen like spoiled children and give the Canadian Halibut back to the people who are the rightful owners of this resource. Ever heard of the BNA act or the Magna Carta. These documents give the resource to the people. Not the Government or the commercial fishermen.
GLG

Yes a large portion is exported , after all we are an export country.But it is to feed the masses.Commercial fishermen are Canadians, there for are rightful owners.Any Canadian citizen can purchase a commercial fishing license.But it is expensive.

 

[sport rec]

these two articles are a bunch of crap, how did these even get printed?, whatever, not even worth responding to....holmes*

Skye's article seems accurate right down to the daily bag limits.Maybe the truth hurts.Looks like she did her research.

 

[reelfast]

i hope someone who has all the facts and figures along with the background regarding the slipper skippers does take some time to carefully craft a fact based response. do not let this slip on by, it going to come back and bit you.

 

[finaddict]

Yes a large portion is exported , after all we are an export country.But it is to feed the masses.Commercial fishermen are Canadians, there for are rightful owners.Any Canadian citizen can purchase a commercial fishing license.But it is expensive.

Not sure the masses support the $18.50 a pound that halibut commands these days. Perhaps it would be more accurate to say it supports a select few in other countries who are able to afford the high price. Buying a commercial license is ONLY available from the existing licenses that are out there. There are no new licenses available hence the high value. It is one thing to buy a license. It is another to have an allocation gift given to you by the Canadian people. That is what Halibut commies have now. Lets not try to sugar coat it.

 

[UkeeDreamin]

Sport Rec, you're obviously new to this issue so I won't hold your ignorance of the facts on this issue against you. You say any Cdn can purchase a commercial license and get into the business, which is true for many of our commercial species but that isn't the case for halibut and that is what has everyone so upset. The Cdn gov't decided to "gift" a select few halibut fisherman with an Individual Transferrable Quota representing 88% of the harvestable halibut biomass on an annual basis. ITQ means the quota stays with the owner and their estate forever - which means you're wrong, no other Canadian will ever be able to get into the halibut commercial business again. In fact, it's worse than that because quota has been bought up and consolidated by the so called "slipper skippers", like Jimmy P, who then lease out the quota to regular working stiff commercial fishermen who do all the hard work of harvesting the quota for a fraction of the profit they'd be able to make if they could access their own quota in a fair and open manner.

Same goes for the general public Canadian, who should be able to access a common property like a fishery resource that has no conservation concerns via a reasonably managed and open recreational fishery. Instead, the ITQ system, which limited the Canadian rec fishery to 12% up to this year and now just 15% of the annual TAC determined by the Int'l Pacific Halibut Commission, puts artificial restraints on access such as severely reduced daily and possession quotas, a shortened season in recent years and now the ridiculous proposal of a slot size for your second of two fish in possession. Again, I stress that none of this is a result of conservation or stock concerns, it's a result of ITQ for halibut that was gifted (fair market value was not paid by the slipper skippers in exchange for their ITQ) to a small number of private individuals.

Hope this explains why the majority of us bristle at comments like "Commercial fishermen are Canadians, there for are rightful owners" as the ITQ system illegally gifts a common property resource and inhibits Canadians access to that common property resource.

Would be a lot less misinformation bantered around if folks took the time to fully inform themselves before entrenching their position on one side or the other of whatever issue they're discussing.

 

[Last Chance]

I'm not going to have our Google hit count help spread those articles around the Internet.. Some editing has been done.

I hope I don't get a concrete block in front of my house tomorrow..

 

[GLG]

Yes a large portion is exported , after all we are an export country.But it is to feed the masses.Commercial fishermen are Canadians, there for are rightful owners.Any Canadian citizen can purchase a commercial fishing license.But it is expensive.

At $50 a kilo, what masses are you talking about? The masses that go to a fancy restaurants in New York City?
You see Chris this is the heart of the problem. You send Canadian TAC out of the country when clearly not all Canadian needs have been met. To say that a commercial halibut fishermen are Canadians is an insult to the nation. I would argue that they should be held liable for treason as there actions are clearly against the common good of Canada. You must adhere to the notion that greed is good because your words sure show it.

 

[Gunsmith]

You might be right about the license but what about the quota? You can also by chickens but you can't sell the eggs, so do not try to sell the free enterprise to me.

Yes a large portion is exported , after all we are an export country.But it is to feed the masses.Commercial fishermen are Canadians, there for are rightful owners.Any Canadian citizen can purchase a commercial fishing license.But it is expensive.

 

[Cuba Libre]

Check it out..... http://www.bcwf.net/images/stories/...2-_Halibut_Fleet_says_NO_to_Pink_T-Shirts.pdf

 

[sport rec]

Sport Rec, you're obviously new to this issue so I won't hold your ignorance of the facts on this issue against you. You say any Cdn can purchase a commercial license and get into the business, which is true for many of our commercial species but that isn't the case for halibut and that is what has everyone so upset. The Cdn gov't decided to "gift" a select few halibut fisherman with an Individual Transferrable Quota representing 88% of the harvestable halibut biomass on an annual basis. ITQ means the quota stays with the owner and their estate forever - which means you're wrong, no other Canadian will ever be able to get into the halibut commercial business again. In fact, it's worse than that because quota has been bought up and consolidated by the so called "slipper skippers", like Jimmy P, who then lease out the quota to regular working stiff commercial fishermen who do all the hard work of harvesting the quota for a fraction of the profit they'd be able to make if they could access their own quota in a fair and open manner.

Same goes for the general public Canadian, who should be able to access a common property like a fishery resource that has no conservation concerns via a reasonably managed and open recreational fishery. Instead, the ITQ system, which limited the Canadian rec fishery to 12% up to this year and now just 15% of the annual TAC determined by the Int'l Pacific Halibut Commission, puts artificial restraints on access such as severely reduced daily and possession quotas, a shortened season in recent years and now the ridiculous proposal of a slot size for your second of two fish in possession. Again, I stress that none of this is a result of conservation or stock concerns, it's a result of ITQ for halibut that was gifted (fair market value was not paid by the slipper skippers in exchange for their ITQ) to a small number of private individuals.

Hope this explains why the majority of us bristle at comments like "Commercial fishermen are Canadians, there for are rightful owners" as the ITQ system illegally gifts a common property resource and inhibits Canadians access to that common property resource.

Would be a lot less misinformation bantered around if folks took the time to fully inform themselves before entrenching their position on one side or the other of whatever issue they're discussing.

No you are wrong, licences and quota have been bought and sold since the quota system was implemented in 1990. Quota and-or licences are still sold every year and any Canadian citizen can by quota as long as they have a L-tab to park it on. As a matter of fact Jimmy P owns very little quota and leases at a reasonable rate, i personally know the fisherman that lease it.
Conservation is a concern when you have no solid number and you over harvest your TAC by 270,000 pounds.
As for the ridiculous proposal of a slot size, you have to thank the SFAB for that. Being so-called gifted quota 23 years ago, a big percentage of them have sold out or deceased. New entrees have spent hundreds of millions of dollars and have bought into the quota system over 2 decades ago. Also, i do not agree with slipper skippers, it should be you use it or you lose it.
I agree there would be a lot less misinformation floating around if people did know the facts.

 

[sport rec]

At $50 a kilo, what masses are you talking about? The masses that go to a fancy restaurants in New York City?
You see Chris this is the heart of the problem. You send Canadian TAC out of the country when clearly not all Canadian needs have been met. To say that a commercial halibut fishermen are Canadians is an insult to the nation. I would argue that they should be held liable for treason as there actions are clearly against the common good of Canada. You must adhere to the notion that greed is good because your words sure show it.

Market value is market value. I understand your pie chart you constantly post. Canada is an export Country, what don't you understand about that? There are a lot of smart people on this forum with lots of good information, unfortunately you are not one of them. As for the rest of your post, i would be embarrassed to say something like that. Commercial fisherman are only trying to make a living. By the way my name is not Chris.

 

[sport rec]

sure thing skye johnston, that article is so full of holes its not even worth picking apart, basically skye can go jump off the bow of a boat about 60 miles offshore, whatever....holmes*

Read the article again and i still can't find anything untruthful. Maybe you can't either.. are the bag limits not quite right?

 

[Jencourt]

Market value is market value. I understand your pie chart you constantly post. Canada is an export Country, what don't you understand about that? There are a lot of smart people on this forum with lots of good information, unfortunately you are not one of them. As for the rest of your post, i would be embarrassed to say something like that. Commercial fisherman are only trying to make a living. By the way my name is not Chris.

It appears that you suffer from the same inability to understand plain English as Captain Hook and all the others who have decided to jump on here and try to justify the GREED. It is either that or you are so bloody daft that you think it is ok to post what a man said and then tell him he said something else.

Quote from GLG " You send Canadian TAC out of the country when clearly not all Canadian needs have been met."

We are not saying do not export we are saying it is wrong to do so ahead of Canadian needs.

And it is not market value, it is an artificial exaggerated price created by the fish lords created by DFO's Blunders.

 

[Lipripper]

Read the article again and i still can't find anything untruthful. Maybe you can't either.. are the bag limits not quite right?

What are you arguing for?

Both sides have a lot of truths... Those articles show one. Half the story.

Seriously, would like to know your motive.

 

[GLG]

Conservation is a concern when you have no solid number and you over harvest your TAC by 270,000 pounds.

I agree there would be a lot less misinformation floating around if people did know the facts.

Oh Chris you amaze me with your wisdom
Well tell me this ... if you say we have gone over by 270,000 pounds and we have no solid numbers how can you say we have gone over? Are you just blowing smoke with the number or is it the statement that we don't have a accountability because you can't have it both ways. So pick one and stick with it because the rest of Canada want's to know.
GLG