Wiring/Charging Question

[Skins88]

So I just had my 05 225 yamahas pulled off my boat and replaced with 12 250 verados. I have 2 starter batteries and 2 house batteries on the boat. With the yamahas everything charged fine. I've found that the house batteries won't charge after the swap. I'm told the yamahas were capable of charging two separate banks of batteries but the mercs can't. It's being suggested that a couple relays will need to be added etc to make the mercs charge everything. This sound correct? Looking at $2500 for the rewire.

 

[ship happens]

I'm not sure if the Yamahas have a split charge cable option on the power head or not, the etecs had that option. It's basically just a dual output coming from the rectifier / regulator that has diode isolation so they are separate. That being said you would have notice 2 positive battery cables coming into your engine rigging instead of just the one battery cable you should see a single positive cable as well.

The best way to do it is to add a dual motor battery switch with and ACR, and then an on/off battery switch for the house bank.

 

[zurk]

ditch the overly complicated setup and battery weight. rip out all 4 batteries, install one battery wired to both alternators. plug everything into the one battery and be done with it. you can remove everything except one switch and put in a blue seas dualbus hub to replace the spaghetti mess of wiring. oh and you can forget about your electrical system or replacing batteries for the next 11 years - because the battery has an 11 year warranty.

DL+ 12V 560 Ah LiFePO4 Dual Purpose Battery with CAN bus

A 12V 560 Ah LFP LiFePO4 battery with CAN bus and internal heating for charging in extreme cold. Best battery for solar, off grid homes, RVs and sailboats.

dakotalithium.com

 

[Rayvon]

ditch the overly complicated setup and battery weight. rip out all 4 batteries, install one battery wired to both alternators. plug everything into the one battery and be done with it. you can remove everything except one switch and put in a blue seas dualbus hub to replace the spaghetti mess of wiring. oh and you can forget about your electrical system or replacing batteries for the next 11 years - because the battery has an 11 year warranty.

DL+ 12V 560 Ah LiFePO4 Dual Purpose Battery with CAN bus

A 12V 560 Ah LFP LiFePO4 battery with CAN bus and internal heating for charging in extreme cold. Best battery for solar, off grid homes, RVs and sailboats.

dakotalithium.com

WHat?

 

[Skins88]

ditch the overly complicated setup and battery weight. rip out all 4 batteries, install one battery wired to both alternators. plug everything into the one battery and be done with it. you can remove everything except one switch and put in a blue seas dualbus hub to replace the spaghetti mess of wiring. oh and you can forget about your electrical system or replacing batteries for the next 11 years - because the battery has an 11 year warranty.

DL+ 12V 560 Ah LiFePO4 Dual Purpose Battery with CAN bus

A 12V 560 Ah LFP LiFePO4 battery with CAN bus and internal heating for charging in extreme cold. Best battery for solar, off grid homes, RVs and sailboats.

dakotalithium.com

I think a little redundancy is needed

 

[ship happens]

ditch the overly complicated setup and battery weight. rip out all 4 batteries, install one battery wired to both alternators. plug everything into the one battery and be done with it. you can remove everything except one switch and put in a blue seas dualbus hub to replace the spaghetti mess of wiring. oh and you can forget about your electrical system or replacing batteries for the next 11 years - because the battery has an 11 year warranty.

DL+ 12V 560 Ah LiFePO4 Dual Purpose Battery with CAN bus

A 12V 560 Ah LFP LiFePO4 battery with CAN bus and internal heating for charging in extreme cold. Best battery for solar, off grid homes, RVs and sailboats.

dakotalithium.com

You can't do that. Transport Canada regulations on engines are that you must have one batter per engine on any engine that is not an auxillary.

 

[ship happens]

The ACR takes complication of the user right out of the equation. There's no need anymore for 1/2/all switches either. Use 4 post battery switches with a combination built in, ACR ties right into the switch for house bank. Automatically charges the house bank and you have 2 on off switches to shut the boat down when your done using the boat. There's not a better system out there.

 

[zurk]

You can't do that. Transport Canada regulations on engines are that you must have one batter per engine on any engine that is not an auxillary.

can you post a link to the regulations ? all it says under construction standards is the weight under table 4-1 which are based on one battery per motor. https://ccga-pacific.org/files/library/TP1332-E-FINAL-v2.pdf
also checked the 2010 which are the latest - https://publications.gc.ca/collections/collection_2010/tc/T29-87-2010-eng.pdf
i dont see anything about mandating one battery per engine.
it actually wouldnt make any sense since they specify a single electrical bus anyway (common negative).

 

[BC Coast Pilot]

ACR on each engine battery to house bank with fuses. I have verados also. The verados require an AGM according to the manual, my tech said they like the voltage. I run 31 series AGM's. Would a deviation from that setup void warranty?most likely..

 

[zurk]

I think a little redundancy is needed

you have a common negative bus anyway which is non isolated. for true redundancy you would need 2 separate buses which you dont have. one battery on a single bus is as redundant as 2 batteries or 4 on a single bus. the same fault can take all of them out.

 

[zurk]

WHat?

literally the same setup i have in my kingfisher. one battery to motors and house. it simplifies the wiring greatly and i have far less problems (actually zero) with it than i had with the house/starting split it came with originally. turns out if you throw out a bunch of useless wiring and have a really really good battery you have less issues.

 

[BC Coast Pilot]

literally the same setup i have in my kingfisher. one battery to motors and house. it simplifies the wiring greatly and i have far less problems (actually zero) with it than i had with the house/starting split it came with originally. turns out if you throw out a bunch of useless wiring and have a really really good battery you have less issues.

How does that lithium like saltwater? Asking for a friend

 

[zurk]

How does that lithium like saltwater? Asking for a friend

i've sprayed mine with saltwater several times by accident . no issues. they are fully sealed. i have an electric kayak with a dakota on it which gets subject to spray often. gorilla tape and nooxid on connectors.

 

[BC Coast Pilot]

I'm curious to know what happens when the boat becomes a bit submerged, or the battery compartment floods. Will the boat catch fire? so now not only are you sinking but also on fire. Neither are a great situation but compounded would certainly get your attention. That and I would have to buy a new inverter charger is my limiting factor for switching the house system over.

 

[ship happens]

can you post a link to the regulations ? all it says under construction standards is the weight under table 4-1 which are based on one battery per motor. https://ccga-pacific.org/files/library/TP1332-E-FINAL-v2.pdf
also checked the 2010 which are the latest - https://publications.gc.ca/collections/collection_2010/tc/T29-87-2010-eng.pdf
i dont see anything about mandating one battery per engine.
it actually wouldnt make any sense since they specify a single electrical bus anyway (common negative).

I don't know where to find it. Its how we setup boats. I deal with surveyers all the time. As a boat builder and a mechanic there is reasons we do things a certain way. One engine one battery, and whatever type battery required for that engine is used. Period the end.

 

[ship happens]

I'm curious to know what happens when the boat becomes a bit submerged, or the battery compartment floods. Will the boat catch fire? so now not only are you sinking but also on fire. Neither are a great situation but compounded would certainly get your attention.

On these lithium battery packs, it all in the circuit board inside. It has to regulate the charging, temperature, and shorting out etc. It's all in the board. So your basically trusting the curuit board to do it's job. If it were to fail on any level whatsoever, there is risk of an explosion or a fire that you cannot put out with a fire extinguisher. If the lithium itself even touches water it ignites and burns till it's burnt up.

 

[Skins88]

Thanks Ship's and BC Pilot. I'll go with the acr's and new switch.

Another example of how great this forum is. You guys are the best. Appreciate the input.

 

[BC Coast Pilot]

Thanks Ship's and BC Pilot. I'll go with the acr's and new switch.

Another example of how great this forum is. You guys are the best. Appreciate the input.

I'd scrutinize that quote too

 

[Skins88]

I'd scrutinize that quote too

Relays are a couple hundred each, switch is 120, wire, Fuses and 8 hours labour.

If I wasn't so busy with work I'd probably take a run at it myself.

 

[ship happens]

You only need one ACR if you switch your battery switch to a 4 post dual motor switch. Then you need a smaller on off to shut the house power down. That's it.

The ACR is just there to isolate the house battery from your start batteries when not in use. That's it. Simple simple

****** old picture, but this setup is my go to when dealing with 2 mains and a kicker. 2 dual circuit battery switches with an ACR. One breaker.