The Fish Farming Report from Global TV

quote: gotta love the extremists

this is exactly it - people who care about the environment are labelled 'extremists'.

the wool is so far over some people's eyes that you would think they are walking around with their head buried in a sheep's butt.
 
and if you have any kind of opinions that are pro fishfarms you are labelled a 'lobbyist', ya i totally agree with you about the wool comment, only you have to agree it works both ways
 
Is anyone writing a letter to Minister Pat Bell? It would be useful to see copies of letters people may have written. Maybe someone drafting a letter template that forum participants could use. Not everyone has time to sit down and put the time in to right a letter. the only way to see results is to put pressure on them.
 
That is an excellant idea coho fisher. I wish I had the letter writing skills as well a the info that a few of our fellow posters have. But a form letter that we could endorse en masse, might have at least a ripple in Victoria. eman
 
quote:i sure hope all of you opposed to the fish farms feel the same way about the chicken, beef and pork farms, because these industries, produce far more of everything that poppa just listed,

This is true, however when a fish farm uses antibiotics and fouls up the water and surrounding environment it impacts not just the farmed fish, but all the fish in the surrounding ocean. For the most part, the impact surrounding a cattle or pork farm is much more limited.

I can choose organic meats and know that they will be free from antibiotics and other harmful substances. Unfortunately, fish farms spread the filth to farmed and non-farmed fish.
 
I wouldn't beat the antibiotic argument to death, it's not used too frequently. I believe there is a producer now on the west coast who raises chinooks at a low density and does not use any antibiotics at all.

This news article seems like a very one sided alarmist type sound bite used to sway public opinion. Unfortunately this sort of **** is far too effective and I'm willing to bet is the basis for many of the opinions here.

It would be nice to see the government step in and help the industry grow to a land based operation as I really do feel that this is a necessary industry. Sure you can argue that wild salmon have naturally stood the test of time, however it just stands to reason that a population of humans that continues to grow as unnaturally as it does will need some form of mass production in their diets. I far rather export farmed salmon than our wild stocks.

Wouldn't it be nice if both sides could reach a solution that met everyones concerns and remained possible for this industry (again a necessary one) to stay competitive with the world markets? Wouldn't it also be nice if this %$#* weather remained calm enough for everyone to jump in their boats and go fishing rather than sit on this thing?
 
the only solution is to move to land based farms, until then we will continue to b*tch and moan.

The problem the industry faces is the fact they are talking about trying to keep the price low, the same problem that Alberta beef has.

From a marketing stand point, trying to be lowest price producer rarely works out. Instead you need to position your product as a luxury product "Farmed salmon from the pristine waters of British Columbia" yada yada. promote that fact that is ecologically viable and a "green product", get creative and position your product at the highest level and not the lowest.

High price tag = High quality to the consumer.

Don't sell just the meat, sell the story of how its made and how by buying farmed salmon the consumer is helping the wild stocks.

salmon is good, but salmon that comes with a warm fuzzy "green" feeling is even better - its about marketing and PR, not just meat.

Just watch, the first one to move inland and market it correctly will do very well - but you're all too scared so you continue to focus on price points, which is a never ending battle with few winners.
 
Seems like this has become quite the lively conversation. As I stated earlier I am not against Fish Farming, just the way it is handled now. In the last 20 years here on the coast they have come a long ways in cleaning up their act. I just feel it can go further same as the pulp and paper mills did when they put in bio-reactors and treatment plants for their waste. Some information from a site I was just reading shows that raising on land can produce a lot more fish per gallon that open sea pens could. If you want to read the complete article here is the link and just an excerpt from it below

http://www.northernaquafarms.com/aquaculture/index.html


(Quote)
Benefits of Recirculation Aquaculture System Designs

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Fish grown in a RAS facility must be supplied with the correct conditions necessary to remain healthy and grow. They need a continuous supply of clean water at an appropriate temperature and a dissolved oxygen content that is optimum for growth. A mechanical and biological system is necessary to purify the water and remove or detoxify harmful waste products and uneaten feed. The fish must be fed a nutritionally complete feed on a daily basis to encourage fast growth and high survival. With that in mind let's review the potential benefits of using farm systems based on RAS designs.

Low water Requirements

Because RAS farms recycle most of their water, they consume considerable less than other types of culture systems and are especially well suited to areas with limited water supplies. The required quantity of water needed to successfully grow fish varies with the species of fish selected, size of the farm system, and the unit process equipment design. As a general rule, a minimum water volume of 1-5 gallons is needed for every pound of fish reared and minimum new water flows of 5-20 gallons per minute are needed to grow 50,000 - 75,000 pounds of fish per year.
A properly designed and operated recirculating system requires a minimum daily input of water, just enough to clean the waste from the filters and to replace water lost to evaporation. This allows construction of fish farms in areas where ground water is limited and even opens the possibility of an operation being located in an urban area to use de-chlorinated municipal water. Such a production facility could be located close to the market. By comparison a recirculating system which produces the same number of pounds of fish as 1000 acres of ponds (about 4.8 million pounds of fish) would require about 4000 gallons of fresh water each day or 1.5 million gallons per year, However, to fill 1000 acres of ponds averaging 5 feet in depth would require 1.6 billion gallons of water.

Less Land Requirements

Since fish in a recirculating system are reared in tanks, with oxygen being supplied and metabolic wastes removed by flowing water, fish can be be safely stocked and grown at high densities. Currently the goal which designers are striving to attain is 1 pound of fish per gallon of water. However, many people consider 0.5 to 0.75 pounds of fish per gallon of water acceptable, In pond aquaculture, the common maximum density is about 0.003 pounds of fish per gallon of water, Therefore, a recirculating system can be located in areas where large amounts of level land are not available. The low land requirement also permits the facility to be located in areas where the soil cannot hold water or, again, in urban areas, or housed in vacant warehouse buildings converted to fish farming.

(End Quote)

And for the flip side, someone asked earlier how to send a message to the government.
Here is one link

http://www.democracyinaction.org/dia/organizationsORG/farmed/campaign.jsp?campaign_KEY=11169
 
******************************************************
2. Join us for a Salmon Rally on July 4th!
******************************************************

The BC government needs to take action to save our precious wild
salmon from going the way of the Atlantic cod. July 2nd will be the
15th year anniversary of the east coast cod fishery shutdown. As a
first step, the BC government needs to accept and implement the
recommendations made recently by their own Special Committee on
Sustainable Aquaculture, which will help defend our wild salmon
stocks from the negative impacts of salmon farming. Some of the
recommendations included:

* Permanent ban on salmon farms on the North Coast of BC, north
of Cape Caution.
* For existing open-net caged salmon farms on the South Coast of
BC a transition to closed containment within 5 years, with a
biological barrier separating the farmed salmon from the marine environment.
* Moratorium on any new salmon farms until transition of existing
farms to closed containment is complete.
* Fallowing the salmon farms on migratory routes during young
wild salmon migration from the rivers to the sea.
* Move away from industry self-policing and have government staff
conduct random checks without any notice to salmon farm operators.

The BC government must accept and implement these recommendations as
soon as possible, as they are a good first step forward to help
protect our wild salmon.

So join us for a fun Salmon Rally from 11:30am to 1pm, Wednesday,
July 4th, 2007 in front of the BC government office at the World
Trade Centre at Canada Place to help send a message that the BC
government must implement their Aquaculture Committee's recommendations.

Also check out recent videos by a talented film maker on the
devestation sea lice is having on our wild salmon this spring:
www.callingfromthecoast.com or http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1BcRBwCh6BA

See you at the rally!
Geoff Senichenko
Director of Research and Mapping
Wilderness Committee
 
I love the comment from your Mr Pat Bell explainging his logic for approving the latest addition to your farm salmon problem.

"...well they met the requirements of the application and they have been working really hard now for four whole years". What a moron!!!

His aurgument is paramount to my child stating her friend told her to throw the rock through the neighboors window. Forget that there is clear evidence showing that current policy and enforcement actions are failing to protect the public resources and ultimately wild salmon.

I can't believe they let him on TV...you guys really need to figure out how get that wonk out of his position as soon as possible. Save the money spend on airline tickets to Norway. Instead, spend it getting elected officials who are commited to saving your salmon.

Tourism fishing does pump more revenue to BC economy but you would know it by the way your political representatives continue to screw the sport fishing public.
 
Howdy,

Sven...

Zuzuki's outfit does not:

-dump enough raw sewage into our pristine waterways to choke a small country.

-produce a product laced with sufficiet contaminants that both the FDA and Health Canada recommend consuming no more than one portion per week.

-allow the unmitigated escape of thousands upon thousands of an alien species into our ocean and waterways to compete directly with, spread infectious-diseases to, and threaten displacement of our 'WILD' salmon and steelhead.


Let me ask all you pro-farmers this: Does it not make complete sense to let the world's nations - who want to suppliment their food needs through aquaculture - grow their own fish in their own water?</u>

Of course not.

Not when you're a big multi-national conglomerate and you can hop into bed with a collusive government like we have in Canada. Why CRAP in your own back yard when you can CRAP in their's?

Sadly, our government seems to have suddenly/conveniently forgotten about the "Super Natural" capacity of BC's abundant rivers and streams to produce (history recalls) enough 'WILD' fish to feed us all, with tons left for export.

I repeat, (Sven/Barbender) I am not a member of ANY political/environmental organization. I'm simply an individual who looks forward to that day when he can see the look of unbridled joy and excitement on his Grandchild's face when his/her reel begins smokin' at the run of a big 'WILD' spring... or a fiesty coho.

In closing I ask you Sven, Barbender: what exactly is the salmon-farming industry in BC contributing to ensure the preservation/enhancement of the sportfishing opportunities for our Children and our Grandchildren?

Little tongue-tied are you?

Let me help you...

Answer: Dick! Na-da! Nothing!

Sincerely,
Terry Anderson
 
quote:I can choose organic meats and know that they will be free from antibiotics and other harmful substances. Unfortunately, fish farms spread the filth to farmed and non-farmed fish.

FYI there is organic farmed salmon too.
 
Terry,historically our main resorce has been fishing and logging, right? do you think that all those fish for hundreds years were kept here on the island or even B.C.,and the same goes for the logs, exporting product is how you make money its never goin to change, because a bunch of guys on a sportfishing website dont like it, refering to the salmon farm industry, yes i agree , to a extent,as one of the farms i worked on yrs ago raised what we called wild coho, and also chinook, and we sold our fish to Earls resturants, made a guy feel better that the fish were first, native fish, second staying on the island.
and wow, you are lost in 1950s if you think theres enough fish to support locals needs and with 'tons' left for export, gyhas
again there are so many misimformed people out there that its hard to address every comment, it all boils down to either you read the anti-farm progaganda, or you read the pro-farm propaganda, and you belive what you read,i personaly am not totally for and totally against fishfarms, there are definatly better ways to do it , but it might be along time before those changes come, just as the fishing and logging industries went thought the same things, oh but i guess i am using the 'change the subject' routine again, sucks to be a little informed on a subject
ensure the future C&R
 
fishman69er
If there are so many misinformed people out there than instead of making generalities put forward some actual data or information. This forum would like to hear some of the pros for fish farming and make people more aware, rather than slagging one another.
I firmly believe you have a right to your opinion and I may or may not agree but I will listen if you have something beneficial to put forward.
I have read the literature that is listed on a number of sea farm sites as well as what enviromentalists and others have to say.
I do find that the farm sites deal in generalities, how many jobs they are creating and how they contribute to the welfare of the province by creating these jobs.
I find that independant research gives a lot more data as to losses by escape, animal kills and the dangers of what the fish are fed.
If this information is so wrong show the data to disprove it.
 
If you want specifics, I can offer a little info regarding the health quality of farmed salmon.

Salmon feed producers are constantly striving to improve salmon diets using leading edge science. Fish feeds are now being supplemented with alternative fish oils to reduce contaminant levels and to reduce their dependence on small pelagic fish (ie anchovies). Most of these alternative oils are grain sourced, such as canola oil and flax seed oil. Some of the feeds are additionally supplemented with poultry fat which may offend some people but in fact it's probably a good source of oil for feed. At this point in the feed development science, there is still a dependence on anchovy oil to maintain healthy levels of omega-3 fatty acids but there have been incredible results with up to 50% alternative oil supplementation.

The most recent contaminant data (dioxins, furans, PCBs and PBDEs) has revealed that farmed Atlantic salmon have the SAME low levels as wild chinook salmon and in fact farmed coho and chinook measure LOWER levels than their wild counterparts. At the same time omega3 fatty acids were measured higher in farmed salmon than wild salmon.

From a health perspective, BC farmed salmon are very nutritious.
 
According to data gathered by the US Food and Drug Administration farmed salmon contain more fat and are lower in the beneficial essential fatty acids such as omega-3 than wild salmon. The stark contrast between lean wild salmon and fatty farmed salmon is evident if you take the time to read the nutritional information on salmon labels. Whilst some wild salmon can have fat levels of less than 1% some farmed salmon can be as high as 27%.

In 2003, the B.C. aquaculture sector produced 72,700 tonnes of salmon. Looking at what the farm industry considers a ratio of 3 to 1 (i.e 3kg of feed for 1kg of fish) we can assume approximately 210,000 tonnes of feed was used. And in 2003 these same fish were fed over 25,000kg of antibiotics
 
Kisinana,as i have stated before, i dont have the printed atricales that you look for, i am just giving what i know(knew) as a farmer, and my thoughts on the subject, when it comes down to showin anything , it is my belive that anyone can pull info,pro, or con on fishfarms, and from there they draw their own conclusions, if you are lookin for answears to questions, then just ask and i will give you my best i can, without the propaganda bulls%$t answear.
 
Kisinana you are looking at old data. I will provide a quote from a recently published scientific paper in a highly respected scientific journal that concludes omega 3 fatty acids are higher in Atlantic farmed salmon:

“Farmed Atlantic salmon were a richer source (mean, 2.34 g/100 g fillet) of omega 3 fatty acids than the other farmed and wild sources of salmon examined (means, 0.39-1.17 g/100g). The present findings support the recommended weekly consumption guidelines for oily fish species (includes all BC salmon sources) for cardio-protective benefits as made by the American Heart Association and the UK Food Standards Agency. "

SOURCE: Flesh Quality of Market-Size Farmed and Wild British Columbia Salmon, Ikonomou et al, Environ. Sci. Technol. 2007, 41, 437-443

Regarding fat levels in salmon ~ yes, farmed Atlantics have higher lipid levels but that is not a bad thing. These are the essential fatty acids that make all salmon so nutritious and good for your cardiovascular system. Your numbers are a little off too. BC farmed Atlantics record lipid levels of about 10 to 15% while wild Chinook are 7 to 10%. Chum and Pink salmon measure the lowest lipid levels (often around 1%) but they also contain the least fatty acids and from that perspective are not as nutritious.
 
"Chum and Pink salmon measure the lowest lipid levels (often around 1%) but they also contain the least fatty acids and from that perspective are not as nutritious."


Probably explains why both levels of government support the industry so much.
They are just trying to get rid of all those useless pinks and chum so we don't have "not as nutritious" fish to deal with.
Thinking of us all the way.

So far that sea-lice thing has been working out very well for that purpose it seems.

Way to go. ;)


Take care.
 
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