Its going to get more heated on the water back East..
- Thread starter SpringFever552
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wildmanyeah
Crew Member
Indigenous services minister calls raid on N.S. fishing facilities an 'assault' on Mi'kmaw people
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/miller-fishery-dispute-1.5763402
Miller called for calm while talks at the federal level continue.
"To protect that right, space needs to be afforded to Indigenous leaders to continue discussions with the Department of Fisheries and Oceans and [federal Fisheries Minister Bernadette Jordan]. And they are not easy discussions, but they must be had and they must be respected," he said.
"To do so, clearly, our police forces must ... maintain the peace."
The fact that no arrests have been made so far in connection with the two raids is prompting questions about the RCMP's response.
Nova Scotia RCMP spokesperson Sgt. Andrew Joyce said no arrests had been made as of Wednesday afternoon — but added that officers did witness criminal activity and investigative teams were being assembled.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/miller-fishery-dispute-1.5763402
Miller called for calm while talks at the federal level continue.
"To protect that right, space needs to be afforded to Indigenous leaders to continue discussions with the Department of Fisheries and Oceans and [federal Fisheries Minister Bernadette Jordan]. And they are not easy discussions, but they must be had and they must be respected," he said.
"To do so, clearly, our police forces must ... maintain the peace."
The fact that no arrests have been made so far in connection with the two raids is prompting questions about the RCMP's response.
Nova Scotia RCMP spokesperson Sgt. Andrew Joyce said no arrests had been made as of Wednesday afternoon — but added that officers did witness criminal activity and investigative teams were being assembled.
wildmanyeah
Crew Member
The only difficult thing is that the PMO's office knows thet are going to lose atlantic votes if they give them a modest livelihood fishery.
fish4all
Well-Known Member
The part that frustrates me is that government spent a couple hundred million to buy the band 15 commercial Lobster licenses and they lease those out instead of participating in the fishery. Same **** here. 20% of the halibut quota is owned by DFO for fn yet they choose to lease it out and then whine about not having any access.
disco
Well-Known Member
If you know the ruling govt has balls the size of BBs and will never stand up to you, why wouldn't you do what they're doing?
First Nation chief says he fears for his people after attacks on Mi'kmaw lobster fishery
https://www.cbc.ca/radio/asithappen...-attacks-on-mi-kmaw-lobster-fishery-1.5763609
https://www.cbc.ca/radio/asithappen...-attacks-on-mi-kmaw-lobster-fishery-1.5763609
wildmanyeah
Crew Member
Go for a stroll on your local First Nation reserve and tell me if you feel safe lol
SpringFever552
Well-Known Member
I was thinking exactly the same thing
wildmanyeah
Crew Member
Another and Important Perspective
by Bob Hooton
A long time friend and wonderfully outspoken advocate for wild steelhead, Ehor Boyanowsky, is a man of many and diverse talents. His professional qualifications include graduate degrees in human and social psychology. Until his recent retirement he was a faculty member at Simon Fraser University. He is a past president of the Steelhead Society of BC and now resides on the banks of his all time favourite river, the Thompson, near Ashcroft.
Ehor has never been one to shirk responsibility to say what wouldn't be said otherwise. He follows (fish and environmental) politics closely and sometimes has views and opinions that don't survive political filters or conform with the views popularized by mainstream media. Earlier today Ehor forwarded me a copy of a piece he prepared and distributed to a long list of personal contacts. I read it and contacted him immediately to seek approval to share it here. For those who might like to broaden their perspective on where we find ourselves today and what may lie ahead, enjoy.
"Today’s news that non-aboriginal Nova Scotia lobster fishermen have escalated their protest to destruction of boats and catch against a massive lobster fishery mounted out of season by aboriginal fishermen is heartbreaking, but sadly, expected, even inevitable. Nova Scotia is perhaps the most peaceful idyllic place in Canada, even North America. I found its people welcoming of strangers rather than clannish when I moved there many years ago. It is why several members of my family moved back there recently to escape the social, political and climatic uncertainties, the turmoil besetting the normally preferred promised lands of BC and California.
Why inevitable? Because as research all over the world, including some conducted by my colleagues at the University of BC, Hong Kong and by me has repeatedly recorded: when an identifiable minority, often ethnic, is repeatedly awarded special status, privilege or even just preference by government and the courts to compensate for past injustices, it creates resentment and psychic tension. When the tensions reach breaking point, sometimes over an unrelated issue, the result is violence toward those minority groups seen as privileged. Accompanying that violence is a growing hatred where none existed before, a psychological phenomenon justifying the violence in the minds of the perpetrators as they witness themselves committing acts they would never before have contemplated.
Witness the slaughter in Rwanda where hundreds of thousands of Tutsis were murdered, cut to pieces with machetes by their once friendly neighbours even though many of them had intermarried with the marauding Hutu majority. Why? Because over the last century, the colonial Belgians had shown preference in treatment, education and government jobs toward the lighter skinned Tutsi minority. But that was in the distant past? No, scarcely 26 years ago while the United Nations, the world stood idly by.
But that was Africa you might argue where the people are traditionally tribal, backward, suspicious of outsiders, believe in witches and demons, even today. As anthropologist Claude Levi-Straus observed, humanity ends at the outskirts of the village. Why almost every tribal group’s name for itself means simply ‘the people’ and so everyone else is a nonperson as the Japanese perceived the Chinese in Nanking during their invasion. Again wanton massacre ensued.
But alas, not just in Africa or Asia. So too in every country on earth. As the ironically, relatively (by comparison to what followed) benign shroud of communistic equality slid from Yugoslavia, Serbs, and Croats resumed ethnic identities, resurrected old grievances, descended into age old enmity and slaughtered each other and Muslims in their midst. Not simple tribal people but those with PhDs, lawyers, physicians and poets driving BMWs not oxcarts and not worshipping obscure idols.
Judges in Canada have been in a frenzy to promote the welfare of aboriginal people. Alas, there is now a whole generation of judges and lawyers trained very narrowly and badly by crusading law professors, demagogues who do not promote logic and deduction and the serious negative implicatons of favouring aboriginal plaintiffs, but declare by fiat that aboriginals have a special position in society based on ancient treaties or even merely statements made by the colonial English in a time when those governing officials, now foreign to Canada, gave what they saw was a crust of bread to a minority of people: hunting and fishing rights in exchange for their loyalty in conflicts with the Americans.
They did not envision a mosaic of tribal groups that are part of larger Canadian society, the fastest growing sector in Canada, even as they reproduce at the highest rate and incorporate nonaboriginals into their group. Two years of living common law with a status aboriginal makes you eligible for aboriginal status and all of its privileges as my recent mover, a pleasant young man of Russian descent recently joyfully declared: “No more taxes, no more hunting or fishing licences.” I was happy for him but I silently wondered if he knew the societal unrest he was contributing to.
Pierre Trudeau, the elder, in his wisdom, despised by many for being unfeeling, (entirely ‘left brain we say in psychology) was prescient, saw the coming conflict and societal disarray and instructed his apprentice Jean Cretien to patriate the constitution from Britain and with it to eliminate any special status for aboriginal people, for Quebec, for anyone. Today in hindsight it is clear how much conflict, resentment and mistaken reliance on the federal government for bounty at the individual and provincial level that would have avoided. Alas, a national alarm was sounded by men of limited vision with perhaps misguided, kind intentions, personified by Ed Broadbent of the NDP… and Trudeau backed off.
His offspring Justin, now PM in a confusing frenzy to ‘reconcile’ with aboriginal people has rescinded the aboriginal accountability bill that forced chiefs to show where they are spending taxpayers’ money (hopefully for housing, sewage and health rather than personal condos in the USA), he visited the family of an armed home invader (who had posted his intentions to rob on Facebook) who was shot (but not those innocent ‘settlers’ who were invaded), and he appointed as the leading lawmaker in government an aboriginal lawyer of little experience who had written a long, dense book about how to disassemble Canada and return it to aboriginal ownership.
As a former ten year member of The BC aboriginal treaty negotiation advisory committee I urged the BC government to proffer land, money and administrative expertise to aboriginal groups but not to isolate them nor to perpetuate special rights and privileges. Clearly the federal courts did not follow such a plan and have created a situation that has emboldened aboriginals to undertake untenable lobster fisheries against Federal Fisheries scientists’ recommendations, to allow the killing of endangered species of salmon, eg Thompson River steelhead (and putting the evidence on Facebook without repercussions) and to kill large game, even those endangered, in and out of season.
The result is a widening of distance between status aboriginal people and the rest of Canada that if history repeats itself here, even in “the peaceable kingdom” will lead to hatred and increasing violence. It always has in the past."
Ehor Boyanowsky
October 15, 2020
by Bob Hooton
A long time friend and wonderfully outspoken advocate for wild steelhead, Ehor Boyanowsky, is a man of many and diverse talents. His professional qualifications include graduate degrees in human and social psychology. Until his recent retirement he was a faculty member at Simon Fraser University. He is a past president of the Steelhead Society of BC and now resides on the banks of his all time favourite river, the Thompson, near Ashcroft.
Ehor has never been one to shirk responsibility to say what wouldn't be said otherwise. He follows (fish and environmental) politics closely and sometimes has views and opinions that don't survive political filters or conform with the views popularized by mainstream media. Earlier today Ehor forwarded me a copy of a piece he prepared and distributed to a long list of personal contacts. I read it and contacted him immediately to seek approval to share it here. For those who might like to broaden their perspective on where we find ourselves today and what may lie ahead, enjoy.
"Today’s news that non-aboriginal Nova Scotia lobster fishermen have escalated their protest to destruction of boats and catch against a massive lobster fishery mounted out of season by aboriginal fishermen is heartbreaking, but sadly, expected, even inevitable. Nova Scotia is perhaps the most peaceful idyllic place in Canada, even North America. I found its people welcoming of strangers rather than clannish when I moved there many years ago. It is why several members of my family moved back there recently to escape the social, political and climatic uncertainties, the turmoil besetting the normally preferred promised lands of BC and California.
Why inevitable? Because as research all over the world, including some conducted by my colleagues at the University of BC, Hong Kong and by me has repeatedly recorded: when an identifiable minority, often ethnic, is repeatedly awarded special status, privilege or even just preference by government and the courts to compensate for past injustices, it creates resentment and psychic tension. When the tensions reach breaking point, sometimes over an unrelated issue, the result is violence toward those minority groups seen as privileged. Accompanying that violence is a growing hatred where none existed before, a psychological phenomenon justifying the violence in the minds of the perpetrators as they witness themselves committing acts they would never before have contemplated.
Witness the slaughter in Rwanda where hundreds of thousands of Tutsis were murdered, cut to pieces with machetes by their once friendly neighbours even though many of them had intermarried with the marauding Hutu majority. Why? Because over the last century, the colonial Belgians had shown preference in treatment, education and government jobs toward the lighter skinned Tutsi minority. But that was in the distant past? No, scarcely 26 years ago while the United Nations, the world stood idly by.
But that was Africa you might argue where the people are traditionally tribal, backward, suspicious of outsiders, believe in witches and demons, even today. As anthropologist Claude Levi-Straus observed, humanity ends at the outskirts of the village. Why almost every tribal group’s name for itself means simply ‘the people’ and so everyone else is a nonperson as the Japanese perceived the Chinese in Nanking during their invasion. Again wanton massacre ensued.
But alas, not just in Africa or Asia. So too in every country on earth. As the ironically, relatively (by comparison to what followed) benign shroud of communistic equality slid from Yugoslavia, Serbs, and Croats resumed ethnic identities, resurrected old grievances, descended into age old enmity and slaughtered each other and Muslims in their midst. Not simple tribal people but those with PhDs, lawyers, physicians and poets driving BMWs not oxcarts and not worshipping obscure idols.
Judges in Canada have been in a frenzy to promote the welfare of aboriginal people. Alas, there is now a whole generation of judges and lawyers trained very narrowly and badly by crusading law professors, demagogues who do not promote logic and deduction and the serious negative implicatons of favouring aboriginal plaintiffs, but declare by fiat that aboriginals have a special position in society based on ancient treaties or even merely statements made by the colonial English in a time when those governing officials, now foreign to Canada, gave what they saw was a crust of bread to a minority of people: hunting and fishing rights in exchange for their loyalty in conflicts with the Americans.
They did not envision a mosaic of tribal groups that are part of larger Canadian society, the fastest growing sector in Canada, even as they reproduce at the highest rate and incorporate nonaboriginals into their group. Two years of living common law with a status aboriginal makes you eligible for aboriginal status and all of its privileges as my recent mover, a pleasant young man of Russian descent recently joyfully declared: “No more taxes, no more hunting or fishing licences.” I was happy for him but I silently wondered if he knew the societal unrest he was contributing to.
Pierre Trudeau, the elder, in his wisdom, despised by many for being unfeeling, (entirely ‘left brain we say in psychology) was prescient, saw the coming conflict and societal disarray and instructed his apprentice Jean Cretien to patriate the constitution from Britain and with it to eliminate any special status for aboriginal people, for Quebec, for anyone. Today in hindsight it is clear how much conflict, resentment and mistaken reliance on the federal government for bounty at the individual and provincial level that would have avoided. Alas, a national alarm was sounded by men of limited vision with perhaps misguided, kind intentions, personified by Ed Broadbent of the NDP… and Trudeau backed off.
His offspring Justin, now PM in a confusing frenzy to ‘reconcile’ with aboriginal people has rescinded the aboriginal accountability bill that forced chiefs to show where they are spending taxpayers’ money (hopefully for housing, sewage and health rather than personal condos in the USA), he visited the family of an armed home invader (who had posted his intentions to rob on Facebook) who was shot (but not those innocent ‘settlers’ who were invaded), and he appointed as the leading lawmaker in government an aboriginal lawyer of little experience who had written a long, dense book about how to disassemble Canada and return it to aboriginal ownership.
As a former ten year member of The BC aboriginal treaty negotiation advisory committee I urged the BC government to proffer land, money and administrative expertise to aboriginal groups but not to isolate them nor to perpetuate special rights and privileges. Clearly the federal courts did not follow such a plan and have created a situation that has emboldened aboriginals to undertake untenable lobster fisheries against Federal Fisheries scientists’ recommendations, to allow the killing of endangered species of salmon, eg Thompson River steelhead (and putting the evidence on Facebook without repercussions) and to kill large game, even those endangered, in and out of season.
The result is a widening of distance between status aboriginal people and the rest of Canada that if history repeats itself here, even in “the peaceable kingdom” will lead to hatred and increasing violence. It always has in the past."
Ehor Boyanowsky
October 15, 2020
the butcher
Well-Known Member
I have a lot of respect for the commercial guys back east. They are taking a stand against the ******** that is dished out by DFO year after year after year. All I see is greed from FN ... They want unlimited access to a scarce resource and even go as far as saying they should have the right to self govern their own fishery....what a joke...
When there is strength in numbers and everyone is taking a stand like what the commercial guys are doing... there ain't nothing that dfo or the cops can do... there is mounting pressure on DFO to do something to appease both groups... you better believe there won't be any Reductions to commercial quotas or anything negative for the commerxial sector back east next year....
Wish we would stand up for the injustice over here and rip nets out of rivers and tell DFO to go and F off...
All the idiotic fisheries minister Bernadette Jordan has done is to condemn the violence. Hopefully this heated issue back east will highlight how useless AND incompetent the entire DFO organization is.... get rid of them and leave the fisheries in the hands of the provincial government so that elected officials who reside in the areas and understand the issues can actually make educated amd scientific decisions.
When there is strength in numbers and everyone is taking a stand like what the commercial guys are doing... there ain't nothing that dfo or the cops can do... there is mounting pressure on DFO to do something to appease both groups... you better believe there won't be any Reductions to commercial quotas or anything negative for the commerxial sector back east next year....
Wish we would stand up for the injustice over here and rip nets out of rivers and tell DFO to go and F off...
All the idiotic fisheries minister Bernadette Jordan has done is to condemn the violence. Hopefully this heated issue back east will highlight how useless AND incompetent the entire DFO organization is.... get rid of them and leave the fisheries in the hands of the provincial government so that elected officials who reside in the areas and understand the issues can actually make educated amd scientific decisions.
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ship happens
Well-Known Member
FN people are segregating themselves. If the WM did that.. oooohh boy would that be a long event.
When the FN were holding the sign that said " Aboriginal people are sacred " I about fell off my chair. Seriously though. What is sacred? Is the rest of Canada sacred? What about the rest of the world? Is anything sacred?
I feel discriminated against.
Like when I was on anchor in the river this Aug and 2 young FN who were hand bombing their net off the bow of their skiff not realizing which way the tide was. Didn't pay attention to the 4 rods I had out or which way my bow was pointed. I yelled at them saying Stop before that net gets wrapped up in my bow and anchor line. They yelled back at me saying WTF are you doing here you should't be here. Meanwhiile a ton of garbage was coming out of their skiff along with the net. I said, ok that net touches my bow i'm cutting it off. They werent so tough when their skiff slammed around the side of mine and got stuck on my anchor setup. I had to show them how to use forward and reverse. Honestly someone could have got hurt. I mentioned to them, after I got their boat free of mine, that you first off should not throw garbage in the river, secondly you as FN people claim that this is your land and its holy this and that. They said ohh yeah it wasn't us. I said, hey guys we just watched the garbage come out of your boat. That was only one boat, I watched several others setting nets and garbage spilling out of their skiffs.
I thought Canada was a claim to fame " multicultural " country? We need to all live as one
When the FN were holding the sign that said " Aboriginal people are sacred " I about fell off my chair. Seriously though. What is sacred? Is the rest of Canada sacred? What about the rest of the world? Is anything sacred?
I feel discriminated against.
Like when I was on anchor in the river this Aug and 2 young FN who were hand bombing their net off the bow of their skiff not realizing which way the tide was. Didn't pay attention to the 4 rods I had out or which way my bow was pointed. I yelled at them saying Stop before that net gets wrapped up in my bow and anchor line. They yelled back at me saying WTF are you doing here you should't be here. Meanwhiile a ton of garbage was coming out of their skiff along with the net. I said, ok that net touches my bow i'm cutting it off. They werent so tough when their skiff slammed around the side of mine and got stuck on my anchor setup. I had to show them how to use forward and reverse. Honestly someone could have got hurt. I mentioned to them, after I got their boat free of mine, that you first off should not throw garbage in the river, secondly you as FN people claim that this is your land and its holy this and that. They said ohh yeah it wasn't us. I said, hey guys we just watched the garbage come out of your boat. That was only one boat, I watched several others setting nets and garbage spilling out of their skiffs.
I thought Canada was a claim to fame " multicultural " country? We need to all live as one
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fish4all
Well-Known Member
So people don’t get shot and boats don’t get burnt to the waterline. They play a little different on the east coast then we do.
Lobster fishery at a crossroads
https://www.halifaxexaminer.ca/environment/lobster-fishery-at-a-crossroads/
https://www.halifaxexaminer.ca/environment/lobster-fishery-at-a-crossroads/
20 years ago the Supreme Court ruled on Mi’kmaq fishing rights, so what has changed?
https://www.aptnnews.ca/investigate...on-mikmaq-fishing-rights-so-what-has-changed/
https://www.aptnnews.ca/investigate...on-mikmaq-fishing-rights-so-what-has-changed/
disco
Well-Known Member
It's becoming more frequently obvious that rulings made by delusional, activist, radical leftist supreme court judges are dividing are ruining this country. These judges aren't infallible, they're human and these erroneous judgments need to be reversed. That's what the "not withstanding" clause is for. Que doesn't hesitate to use it, why do the rest of the provinces lack the balls to do it?
The Facts Behind Mi’kmaw Fishing Rights
https://www.aptnnews.ca/national-news/the-facts-behind-mikmaw-fishing-rights/
https://www.aptnnews.ca/national-news/the-facts-behind-mikmaw-fishing-rights/
SpringFever552
Well-Known Member
Lets go back to the old ways...
Cant wait till a " nation" demands to raid and pillage its neighboring nation or the nation down the coast to it...Its their right after all!! Its what was going on before colonial people arrived and fkd it all up?!
Sound crazy!?
We evolve, we become educated, cant go back to old ways/days..
Move forward, 1st nations have the means to fish in the commercial openings, (this is the means to make a " moderate living" and more)
Fish the allocation bought back and turned over to them, what more can they want?!
This will get worse before it gets better and will spread across the country, mark my words
Cant wait till a " nation" demands to raid and pillage its neighboring nation or the nation down the coast to it...Its their right after all!! Its what was going on before colonial people arrived and fkd it all up?!
Sound crazy!?
We evolve, we become educated, cant go back to old ways/days..
Move forward, 1st nations have the means to fish in the commercial openings, (this is the means to make a " moderate living" and more)
Fish the allocation bought back and turned over to them, what more can they want?!
This will get worse before it gets better and will spread across the country, mark my words
kingblazer84
Well-Known Member
Time for a good ol civil war.
SpringFever552
Well-Known Member
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