Fish Farms vs Commercial Fishing

L

likwit

Member
i love fishing reports and tips, but it seems there is alot of threads about dwindling stocks, fisheries mismanagement, etc.

it is obviously a complicated issue, and clearly the 'blame' rests on a lot of different shoulders.

given the general distaste for commercial openings on dwindling species/runs, but acknowledging the need for salmon at the super market, i am putting out a simple question:

would you support fish farming if there was a moratorium on commercial salmon fishing?

thoughts?
 
I would suggest that rather than contemplating "elimination" of either Commercial Fishing or Fish Farms, we should be focusing on better management, of both. :)
 
No.
Fish farming uses twice as much feed fish to raise a kilo of salmon as a wild fish eats. Fish farming does not create sea lice but gives them a location to mass in abundance attacking juvenile smolt returning to the sea. Wild salmon do not need steriods to bulk up nor antibiotics to keep them healthy. Wild salmon do not need food colorants to find the color of their flesh acceptable to our pallettes.
Rather than fish farming I would rather see much higher license fees for both commercial and sports fishers and the money spent on fish farming spent on rehabilitating rivers and hatcheries with wild runs.
Perhaps a sport fishery where you buy a license and tags for each fish you keep and a maximum allowable.
Allow companies to be the managers of the hatcheries and allot funding from the pool of resources based on percentage of runs managed and how much they raise the returns.
There would be no need for the cost of nets, antibiotics, colorants or chemicals used to clean the pens.
Raise the cost of licenses for commercial fishing but at the same time raise the amount that they get for their catch and allow the companies managing the hatcheries to set the catch limits and return levels.
Allow the companies managing the hatcheries to take the returning catch allowing for restocking and some wild restocking and cash in the remainder.
Tagging could be done and the government could be pressured to levy duties on other countries fishing hatchery fish on the high seas.
I am sure the same numbers of people could be employed as farming uses now, perhaps even more depending on the number of hatcheries.
 
Not as profitable as a fish farm, but what about a privatly run "farmed river". I heard that there was a project such as this underway in the states where a fresh water body was seeded with a species of salmon (Atlantics I think), the run was permitted to leave, and upon return, all the fish returning to that body of water were harvested by the private enterprise running it as they entered the body of water. You could take some turd of a lake or stream near the coast that has already been decimated, (Jordan River comes to mind, there is a channel there that is not polluted by the mining tailings) fire as many smolts into it as you can(Hatched by the company managing the lake), and as they return, scoop 'em as they head for the lake. Since spawning isn't going to happen, there is no need for spawning habitat, hence a still freshwater source near the salt to attract them as they return to spawn. You would not waste the brood stock as the removal of eggs and milt does not hurt the product that would go to the cannery.

This would only work for species that do not spend a long time in fresh water, otherwise feeding arrangements would have to be made. Not a necessarily a bad thing, as the size of the smolts hitting the salt probably has a direct impact on their survival rate.

I'm sure there are several "crap" small freshwater lake/river systems that do not have signifigant runs along the coast to attempt this with. Using the Koksilah as an example (But not in real life as the FN have dibs on it), you take a great habitat that has no signigant run any more, and stock it.

ALthough the producer does not have the control over their product as they would in a fish farm, the total cost of running it would be near nil, as you are only producing smolts, and harvesting them as they hit your river.

Your fish can be sold as wild, some may be caught incidently in the commercial and sport fisheries, but such as a cost of doing business. ECVI has so many closures in place already, these could be adjusted to protect the farmed rivers runs.

Since a fish farmer has to babysit, I don't know, say 10 thousand fish for two to four years, I think the running costs of hatching, raising dumping and feeding smolts for a few months a year and then harvesting them would be a lot less.
 
I am staying out of this one. I have tried to point out so many errors and misinformation about salmon farms however I think there are basically three camps. Pro,For and don't care. All I can tell you is to not believe everything you hear, most of what Kisana says is based on old data and is not even close. That being said I thinkt that most people on this site that are anti salmon farming do it because they care about our wild resource and there is nothing more noble than that. Do the research and draw your own conclusions.
 
although there is a lot of evidence that fish farms negatively impact salmon populations (which i believe), i think most people would agree that the commercial fishery continues to remove more salmon the waters than fish farm impacts do.

so in light of ever declining populations, and admitting that there is a market for salmon on people's dinner plates, people would still rather see a commercial fishery to the bitter end, but no fish farms?

really?

btw, i have never been a fish farm supporter, but given some recent thinking, i am willing to play devil's advocate this time...
 
Sorry to burst your bubble BarBender but my information is up to date. I am even willing to agree that the amounts of antibiotics is being reduced (a good thing) i.e. down almost 10 percent in the last 4 years when compared with the tonnage of net fish.
Colorants are still used and I can provide links to sites that show the different hues that are wanted by different buyers.
Fish farms are here at present but there are many things that we realize later down the road are harmful to the enviroment. All you have to do is look at the steps pulp and paper mills have taken to clean up there act in the last 20 years.
 
Kisana FYI the sheet you talk about with regards to colourants is used in the wild fishery too. It is simply a way of measuring pigment so that the fish can be graded accordingly. (good meat color, pale meated etc). I can show you sheets that are used for Chums, Coho and Sockeye. The "colourant" you talk about is a natural beta carotene (found in carrots shrimp etc) that is not harmful (unless you eat 200 lbs of it) and actually has shown to be a powerful antioxidant. My point here is that yes there are some negative issues associated with salmon farming and they should be addressed. However in comparisson to other major farmed protein sources (Chicken, Beef, Pork). Salmon has been proven to be the least intrusive in the enviroment and also uses the lowest amount of antibiotics. Not to mention, is one of the best proteins in comparison to saturated fats etc. I am basing this on the Harvard Medical Schools findings by the way. Also be aware of certain NGO's claiming they want to protect wild salmon by stopping aquaculture. Many of them get their funds from the questionable sources and once salmon farms are gone most likely will work on stopping recreational fishing. All you have to do is look at Europe where many of these associations got started. They are already targeting sport fishing as cruelty to animals. In England they have been succesful in stopping recreational fishing in certain public areas. Just something to consider.
 
Howdy,

LC... good idea (containment) except for the resultant pollution and narrowed proximity to other native Wild stocks in the chosen river and estuary.
Remember, each fish-farm dumps the daily equivalent RAW-SEWAGE into OUR water as does the city of Victoria.

Krisiana... hold your ground and good-work on researching the TRUTH about fish-farming.

Barbender... cudo's to you too for your support and concern and effort around Wild-fish conservation/enhancement; yet, as I continue to read your posts on this topic - with your accompanying denials and lame attempts at skewering the volumes of well documented evidence against this terrible industry - I remain curious; What fish-farming outfit do you work for?

Cheers,
Terry
 
Barbender, you seem to be very knowledgable in this area. Can you tell me who owns the majority of farms on the coast? Where is most of the product shipped to, and how much natural feed does it take to produce a pound of farmed.[?]
 
very interesting idea LastChance, but I don't see a time when a river is handed over to a fishfarm ever happening. Who knows, they did just sell the entire town to a developer and I never would believe that could happen either.

I also think you're right about the raw waste, I think equal to Vic is a stretching the facts.
 
Well that is the problem with the fish farm debate. Certain groups use misinformation to scare the general public. They take a fact but twist it out of proportion to mislead. That being said fish farms are far from perfect especially in Chile.
Klob. Current feed convertion ratios are anywhere from 1.2-1.4 to 1lb of fish. It depends on what diet the fish are using. Currently a lot of farms are using more and more vegetable in feed to minimize impact and to reduce costs.
Hawk To answer your question I work in both wild and farmed although 95% is farmed now. Namely because at one time I did all wild and could not justify it. The things I saw on the wild side made my stomach turn. However keep in mind I do not want to use this site as a soap box for the aquaculture industry. I simply like to point out some of the misinformation that floats around. The reason I am on this site is namely
1: To enjoy people's stories about fishing
2: To be jealous of Wolf and Justin's catch record
3: Fishing reports around the island
4: To be jealous of wolf and Justin's catch record (this is also reason 5, 6 and 11).
 
quote:Originally posted by Poppa Swiss

very interesting idea LastChance, but I don't see a time when a river is handed over to a fishfarm ever happening. Who knows, they did just sell the entire town to a developer and I never would believe that could happen either.

I also think you're right about the raw waste, I think equal to Vic is a stretching the facts.
Click to expand...

It would have to be a dead, useless river, Ala Jordan. Who knows, it may be commerically viable for them to fix it (The mining tailings pollution).
 
quote:Originally posted by Poppa Swiss

very interesting idea LastChance, but I don't see a time when a river is handed over to a fishfarm ever happening. Who knows, they did just sell the entire town to a developer and I never would believe that could happen either.

I also think you're right about the raw waste, I think equal to Vic is a stretching the facts.
Click to expand...

It would have to be a dead, useless river, Ala Jordan. Who knows, it may be commerically viable for them to fix it (The mining tailings pollution).
 
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