All Things COVID-19

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Time to put the brakes on the rhetoric here again. The Covid discussion has reached the point where people on either side have made their choice and aren't going to be convinced that they should change their way of thinking, because someone with an opposing view shouts at them via an online fishing forum. We have come to that place in time where my "science is smarter than your science," "my publication is sound," "my research is better than your research," etc. One thing is for sure; if you search long enough on the internet you will find information to support your point of view and the source matters little because it aligns with your own beliefs. In the end, only your own experiences are likely to have any dramatic influence on changing your mind about any of this. If someone close to you suffers long term effects or dies from Covid, you may change your way of thinking about vaccines or treatments, or if they have an adverse reaction to a vaccine that is major in nature, of course you will question the validity of the vaccine. My personal experiences, and talking with people I know and trust on the front lines of emergency health care, have lead me to believe the vaccines are worth the risk, but I am not on every form of social media trying to convince others that I am right. So, we are going to elevate the level of respect here and slow down the bombardment of any back and forth that really isn't helping the cause, but will lead to useless fights.
 
Opposing views are good but if you cant provide credible sourcing for the info to back it up it then its just an opinion open to scrutiny imo. Science is science, the numbers are clear, misinformation and flat out BS are rampant everywhere including our little fishing forum. It’s a major problem in the world right now. I agree personal attacks are not helpful but I for one will continue to call out misinformation and BS.
 

Five reasons why COVID herd immunity is probably impossible​



CDC shifts pandemic goals away from reaching herd immunity​



Many Americans embraced the novel farmyard phrase, and with it, the projection that once 70% to 80% or 85% of the population was vaccinated against COVID-19, the virus would go away and the pandemic would be over.

Now the herd is restless. And experts at the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention have set aside herd immunity as a national goal.

The prospects for meeting a clear herd-immunity target are “very complicated,” said Dr. Jefferson Jones, a medical officer on the CDC’s COVID-19 Epidemiology Task Force.
 
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I don’t believe that 10 players on a fully vaccinated hockey team should be contracting and also spreading Covid to each other if the vaccine was effective.

Then, Dr. Jefferson Jones, a medical officer on the CDC’s COVID-19 Epidemiology Task Force, spoke up.

“Thinking that we’ll be able to achieve some kind of threshold where there’ll be no more transmission of infections may not be possible,” Jones told the CDC panel. The widespread phenomenon of waning immunity — among people who survived coronavirus infections as well as those who’ve been vaccinated — has made the adoption of a clear herd-immunity goal “very complicated,” he added.
 

Five reasons why COVID herd immunity is probably impossible​



CDC shifts pandemic goals away from reaching herd immunity​



Many Americans embraced the novel farmyard phrase, and with it, the projection that once 70% to 80% or 85% of the population was vaccinated against COVID-19, the virus would go away and the pandemic would be over.

Now the herd is restless. And experts at the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention have set aside herd immunity as a national goal.

The prospects for meeting a clear herd-immunity target are “very complicated,” said Dr. Jefferson Jones, a medical officer on the CDC’s COVID-19 Epidemiology Task Force.
really unfortunate but with vaccination rates so low in the US hard to get there.

From your link-

“But the once-popular idea that enough people will eventually gain immunity to SARS-CoV-2 to block most transmission — a ‘herd-immunity threshold’ — is starting to look unlikely.

That threshold is generally achievable only with high vaccination rates, and many scientists had thought that once people started being immunized en masse, herd immunity would permit society to return to normal. Most estimates had placed the threshold at 60–70% of the population gaining immunity, either through vaccinations or past exposure to the virus. But as the pandemic enters its second year, the thinking has begun to shift. In February, independent data scientist Youyang Gu changed the name of his popular COVID-19 forecasting model from ‘Path to Herd Immunity’ to ‘Path to Normality’. He said that reaching a herd-immunity threshold was looking unlikely because of factors such as vaccine hesitancy, the emergence of new variants and the delayed arrival of vaccinations for children.”
 
really unfortunate but with vaccination rates so low in the US hard to get there.

From your link-

“But the once-popular idea that enough people will eventually gain immunity to SARS-CoV-2 to block most transmission — a ‘herd-immunity threshold’ — is starting to look unlikely.

That threshold is generally achievable only with high vaccination rates, and many scientists had thought that once people started being immunized en masse, herd immunity would permit society to return to normal. Most estimates had placed the threshold at 60–70% of the population gaining immunity, either through vaccinations or past exposure to the virus. But as the pandemic enters its second year, the thinking has begun to shift. In February, independent data scientist Youyang Gu changed the name of his popular COVID-19 forecasting model from ‘Path to Herd Immunity’ to ‘Path to Normality’. He said that reaching a herd-immunity threshold was looking unlikely because of factors such as vaccine hesitancy, the emergence of new variants and the delayed arrival of vaccinations for children.”

also from the link, ie if vaccinations were 100%

"The result is that even if vaccination were universal, the coronavirus would probably continue to spread."
 
really unfortunate but with vaccination rates so low in the US hard to get there.

From your link-

“But the once-popular idea that enough people will eventually gain immunity to SARS-CoV-2 to block most transmission — a ‘herd-immunity threshold’ — is starting to look unlikely.

That threshold is generally achievable only with high vaccination rates, and many scientists had thought that once people started being immunized en masse, herd immunity would permit society to return to normal. Most estimates had placed the threshold at 60–70% of the population gaining immunity, either through vaccinations or past exposure to the virus. But as the pandemic enters its second year, the thinking has begun to shift. In February, independent data scientist Youyang Gu changed the name of his popular COVID-19 forecasting model from ‘Path to Herd Immunity’ to ‘Path to Normality’. He said that reaching a herd-immunity threshold was looking unlikely because of factors such as vaccine hesitancy, the emergence of new variants and the delayed arrival of vaccinations for children.”

I'm still hopeful that once the kids are vaccinated that will see a dramatic drop. I have friends that are getting exposure notices for their kids ever other week.

I got one for my son on the 15th for an exposure on the 5th at school.
 

“Highlights
 There are a total of 15,081 AEFI reports received following 22,578,430 doses of COVID-19 vaccines administered in Ontario to date with a reporting rate of 66.8 per 100,000 doses administered (0.07% of all doses administered)”

OBD I think what caught your eye was the percentage of serious adverse reactions to the total number of adverse reactions 5%+/-. The overall percentage as you can see from the quote above is 0.07% pretty much in line with the rest of Canadian numbers. Thats how I read it.
 
Some good points made here. Certainly something to consider if you are at all open minded.


Looks to me like the Young Blood video has been removed from the website, only available on youtube now.
 
So is the deal we have to keep getting the shots? People who got their shots this year are already on their 3rd and 4th shots.
And if this is the case, will the two shot Vax pass no longer be valid?
Will we have to get re jabbed every 4 months and update the pass?
Will we villify the two shotters as anti- vax, conspiracy theory loving scum soon? What a world.
 
So is the deal we have to keep getting the shots? People who got their shots this year are already on their 3rd and 4th shots.
And if this is the case, will the two shot Vax pass no longer be valid?
Will we have to get re jabbed every 4 months and update the pass?
Will we villify the two shotters as anti- vax, conspiracy theory loving scum soon? What a world.
This is the new normal. Viruses mutate rapidly so if we want to avoid the diseases, new vaccines will be necessary. Covid 19 is only one virus, with several mutations, already. Other zoonotic viruses are increasingly likely to show up as they move from animals to people.

We need to be much better prepared for future pandemics. With Covid we we're faced with a moderately deadly and moderately transmissible respiratory pathogen. We cannot begin to imagine the devastation — possibly even a threat to civilization — if the planet had to face a severe, natural pandemic or worse, from a virus that had been intentionally designed and engineered to spread as quickly and effectively as measles and had the aggressive virulence of filoviruses such as Ebola or Marburg. The case fatality rate for MVD is up to 90%.
 
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Are you referring to Fauci being an anti-vaxxer?

What part of what he said is nonsense?

He has been in charge in the US for over 50 years

Guessing they have been listening to him
Here is a quote from the source of the article from Dr. Fauci ““Ultimately, all pandemics burn themselves out,” he told us, adding: “So you have a choice. Do you want it to burn itself out and kill a lot more people and make a lot more people sick? Or do you want to do something about it to prevent further deaths and further illness?”

if you would like the New York Times take on the interview or would like to listen to it instead of “extremelyamerican.com’s” write up here is the link

 
Thanks for the link to the original NYT interview with Dr. Fauci, HH. I listened very closely and at no time did I hear him say that we would be getting boosters forever. Nor did I hear him say that the vaccines were depleting human immune systems.
Fauci does make some interesting comments around 23:30 about being taken out of context.
I’m glad to see Admin took down the post with the questionable link that was taking Fauci out of context.
 
Thanks for the link to the original NYT interview with Dr. Fauci, HH. I listened very closely and at no time did I hear him say that we would be getting boosters forever. Nor did I hear him say that the vaccines were depleting human immune systems.
Fauci does make some interesting comments around 23:30 about being taken out of context.
I’m glad to see Admin took down the post with the questionable link that was taking Fauci out of context.
Sadly those types of posts as well as YouTube videos of "doctors" that sounds smart, spreading lies, make people who cannot critically think, analyze facts, information and research.. believe that this is all a big hoax and the product of big pharma and government powers. Sad.
 
Thanks for the link to the original NYT interview with Dr. Fauci, HH. I listened very closely and at no time did I hear him say that we would be getting boosters forever. Nor did I hear him say that the vaccines were depleting human immune systems.
Fauci does make some interesting comments around 23:30 about being taken out of context.
I’m glad to see Admin took down the post with the questionable link that was taking Fauci out of context.
That’s awesome that you listened to the whole interview. So many people just read headlines and pick and choose these days and that’s trouble. Backing up our own ideas with nonsense happens for sure.

Do you feel confident in Fauci? I want to but I can also be pretty sceptical.
Whats your take on vaccine dose administration over the next 12 months?

We are fighting a pandemic so everything seems to be on the table at this point in terms of cures

There are therapeutics coming which is good news but I haven’t seen anything on how those might be rolled out. I hope we can find a way to treat patients.

Lets hope the therapeutics get us back to normal and we can be done with this COVID nonsense. Or more jabs.
 
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