Agree 100%
The status quo is the best course of action for most people so that has been the tried and true course of action.
Studied to death!
The Hill to Die On - by Bob Hooton
- Thread starter OldBlackDog
- Start date
The status quo is the best course of action for most people so that has been the tried and true course of action.
Studied to death!
Bryan Allen
Well-Known Member
Best explanation and comment yet....
Derby
Crew Member
Remember one needs to ask themselve this question...why have the big players not signed on the the letter... lot's of politics in the back ground and for that matter.... ****... sadly has goes on.. Say the word steelhead to a group of steelheaders in a room and that room would devide quickly in the a couple fraction.. I agree it would be nice to have a round table of groups where all groups are equal.. At this time I just dont see it happening now or in the future sadly.... Some big personalities in the room currently
Bryan Allen
Well-Known Member
Yes, I understand your comments. There are lots of politics being played. But walk away ??? The fish need us more than ever. If this tragedy is allowed to come to the apparent conclusion without TRYING to change things .... who knows what is next on the chopping block. Remember this quote ? "“Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed, citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has.”
Dreaming ?? No-- I am just pissed about how "we " have "managed" our fish stocks.
Dreaming ?? No-- I am just pissed about how "we " have "managed" our fish stocks.
Derby
Crew Member
No one has walk away Bryan... you have known me for over 40 years .. just because its not seen in the public eye doesnt mean myself and many others are not working on this or doing there best with steelheadin mind... there are many ways to skin a cat as i have learned over the years.. both MOE & DFO have failed badly to do anything for the steelhead and other stocks of concern ..
Bryan Allen
Well-Known Member
Well one thing I learned well in my time is that a couple emails to a politician will get you , at best, a "thank you for your email--bla bla etc " Same for a senior bureaucrat. The staff will normally draft the letter for the bosses signature. But if the complainant goes public , and includes the press then the response will attract attention much higher up the food chain. Multiple hand- written letters AND press coverage upsets the system. They don't like being questioned by the public. And a petition with thousands of voter's signatures demands that they defend their position. And when the "kiss off" reply gets back to the complainant --- crank up the press coverage.
I know that the few here are not the only ones working to change how steelhead are being treated. But there is a saying that goes: "You have to be seen to be heard" So my unsolicited advice is that working in the background helps at times, but perhaps its time for those doing so, step out in front and TELL the public what is happening. Make the politicians uncomfortable. I would be very please to see organizations such as the SFI, PSF, SFAB, FNs throw support behind the petition. I hope the members of this forum have ALL signed the petition as well.
I know that the few here are not the only ones working to change how steelhead are being treated. But there is a saying that goes: "You have to be seen to be heard" So my unsolicited advice is that working in the background helps at times, but perhaps its time for those doing so, step out in front and TELL the public what is happening. Make the politicians uncomfortable. I would be very please to see organizations such as the SFI, PSF, SFAB, FNs throw support behind the petition. I hope the members of this forum have ALL signed the petition as well.
I see what you did here, you threw this in just to see if we were reading the fine print.
Bryan Allen
Well-Known Member
Ya-- they might not want to get involved with "snakefish" But I think with a little refection, they could realize that is hard to carry the moniker of "Keepers of the Land" while ignoring one of the creatures that was here even before they were.
Sharphooks
Well-Known Member
It was said earlier in this thread.....”follow the money”.......correct me if I’m wrong but it appears that those three words perfectly distill why there is a conspicuous silence and lack of signatories from certain “fishing advisory” groups on the petition. It’s all about status quo on the resource extraction front....and those doing it quietly in the background worry that supporting SARA for ISF might take a bite or two out of their apple....again, correct me if I have missed an important piece of information as to why there is such a conspicuous absence of signatories for the SARA petition
It’s a bit like asking the Upper Skeena Angling Guides Association to voluntarily stop fishing next Fall if the projected returns are once again below the 8,000 fish threshold that’s supposed to ring the ECC bell (as occurred in Fall 2021 , though it’s true someone hung a wet pair of Simms waders over the bell so nobody could hear its plaintive tinkling that the Skeena steelhead were in dire peril....)
.....ain’t going to happen unless Victoria and Smithers step in and lower the boom.
It’s a bit like asking the Upper Skeena Angling Guides Association to voluntarily stop fishing next Fall if the projected returns are once again below the 8,000 fish threshold that’s supposed to ring the ECC bell (as occurred in Fall 2021 , though it’s true someone hung a wet pair of Simms waders over the bell so nobody could hear its plaintive tinkling that the Skeena steelhead were in dire peril....)
.....ain’t going to happen unless Victoria and Smithers step in and lower the boom.
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Derby
Crew Member
As stated before ... letters have been sent bye other groups.. And you may see names people from those groups personal sign on those petetions that is there choice... Not all people support a SARA listing of the steelhead.. Personal I dont I believe there are other ways to get action .. some say yes others say no... At this point its a stalemate as it seems neither works... As I said before say steelhead in a room of folks that fish steelhead and it turns into a **** show.... just like this has.. sadly it is the reality of what is going on and the steelhead are the losers.....
searun
Well-Known Member
I've had the caring beaten out of me. The ideological puritans and their obsessive insistence on driving personal attacks and wedges between all the potential supporters whom might offer differing free thinking thoughts on how to help steelhead have won. There goes any hope of finding common collaborative ground to formulate a recovery strategy and build community support.
In the alternative, I will do my steelheading down south across the line where WA state has brought all the tools in their kits to help save their runs...well funded habitat, hatchery, and fisheries management - balanced approach. And if anyone thinks their fish are somehow sub-parr (pun intended) my buds who are down there fishing right now are posting release pics of large teenagers in prime condition. Sad that this was the norm here in BC.
In the alternative, I will do my steelheading down south across the line where WA state has brought all the tools in their kits to help save their runs...well funded habitat, hatchery, and fisheries management - balanced approach. And if anyone thinks their fish are somehow sub-parr (pun intended) my buds who are down there fishing right now are posting release pics of large teenagers in prime condition. Sad that this was the norm here in BC.
searun
Well-Known Member
Not really...its all about either you agree with us on SARA listing or you are the enemy. SARA is the wrong tool, its a blunt instrument and will lead to significant social, cultural, and economic consequence. Well meaning folks pushing that option are clearly not familiar with the logical consequences of what SARA listing would actually bring and how that might impact their fishery for generations to come....and not in a good way. Now I will "brace for impact" as the personal attacks rev up.
searun
Well-Known Member
yup, exactly what dithering around hoping for a SARA listing is doing....a recovery strategy would be quicker and easier to put in place than SARA.
EXACTLY! searun. And there's at least 2 complications for that to happen, and happen in time:
1/ to get the one salmon they got under Provincial authority to be included under the Fisheries Act, and
2/ to get it done in time.
The 2nd part is likely the most critical part, and possibly the hardest to do.
They are starting on those recovery strategies - for Chinook (WCVI, and Fraser). Many more species/stocks to come. And nobody is anywhere near the action part that is supposed to follow - except maybe PSSI. That might be the quest for the Holy Grail - to get Fraser steelhead listed thru that initiative.
However that initiative only deals with fishing - not forestry nor land use issues. And even if there was stricter regs on that industry (forestry) the time lag there is 60+ yrs.
As depressing as it sounds - I hope someone is storing ovum/sperm in cryogenic freezers and start a program like they did for the condors.
OldBlackDog
Well-Known Member
Context
The rivers flowing into Washington State’s Puget Sound and those originating on its Olympic Peninsula have long been the focus of intensive recreational fishing for (winter) steelhead. They a…
steelheadvoices.com
Using the term "recovery strategy" and Thompson steelhead, with less than 100 spawners, using the same old tactics, is beyond comprehension. All "recovery strategies" are just blowing smoke up peoples back sides at this point.
Bryan Allen
Well-Known Member
Have a look at the bs platitudes from DFO , FNs and the Province in Toms op ed.
BC Steelhead: a forgotten species? - Northern Beat
Tom Davis gives us his take on the alarming decline in steelhead populations in british columbia and the response by governments
northernbeat.ca
searun
Well-Known Member
Well, reading SARA, and also from practical experience (SRKW), it takes the SARA process glacial ages to actually get to the Recovery Strategy....lets skip all that dithering and move directly to the strategy part. And hoping somehow SARA will get nets out of rivers is again a far off in the distance dream....PSSI may actually get us far closer to selective harvest faster.
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