SALMONGATE! Alex's best yet! (A must read)

Little Hawk

Active Member
Of all of Alex's correspondence I've read to date, nothing encapsulates or reveals the overall sad state of affairs between DFO and the salmon-farmers better than this.

Give'em hell Alex!


November 30, 2009

Minister Gail Shea
Ottawa, Canada

Dear Minister Shea:

Twenty thousand, two hundred forty-three (*20,243*) people have now signed the
letter on my website www.adopt-a-fry.org <http://www.adopt-a-fry.org> insisting
that you apply the /Fisheries Act/ to “farming” salmon.

But the Norwegian salmon farming industry is now so far out of alignment with
common sense and the spirit of Canadian law that the road to compliance is not
simple. As you prepare to assume control of this industry as per the BC Supreme
Court decision we, the public, are doing your job in your absence laying charges
against this industry and removing the firewalls to protect our fish.

Twenty years ago the business of raising salmon was wrongly categorized as
“farming” and assigned to the Province to manage. The Province is not
responsible for wild fish and the feds were not responsible for fish farms, so
no one has been responsible for impact of salmon “farms” on wild fish.

This Provincial regulatory scheme was recognized as unlawful and struck down by
Judge Hinkson, February 2009. He gave government 1 year to sort this out and it
remains uncertain if ownership of salmon (farmed or not) is even legal in the
ocean.

At first it was assumed the Provincial government would somehow continue to run
the industry, but shortly after the August 2009 sockeye crash, the Province
backed away leaving /Fisheries and Oceans (DFO) /scrambling to design a
regulatory regime. As a result a delay is being negotiated during which the
Province expects to continue expanding the industry!

Expansion is crucial to Norwegian fish farmers because they have lost money for
3 years now and their share prices can only rise if they put more fish in the
water. However, we just lost 10 million sockeye that passed through heavily fish
farmed waters and Judge Cohen has “aquaculture” 3rd on his list to investigate
with his Judicial Inquiry. It would be immoral to expand the industry during
this moment of regulatory restructuring and investigation.

When you peel back the layers of the /Fisheries Act/ the conflicting rules make
no sense, except as firewalls. On the one hand the /Pacific (Fishery)
Regulations (1993/) exempts Provincially licenced aquaculture from /all /fishing
regulations appearing to give them unrestricted access to all the wild fish
drawn into their pens by the lights and food. These fish are Atlantic salmon
fodder and highly valuable sablefish, salmon and herring.

Then as if someone recognized the preposterous enormity of this the /Access to
Wild Aquatic Resources 2004/ was produced to licence fish farmers for by-catch,
if the amount was deemed insignificant to wild stocks.

This was a good idea, but no one seems to have these licences. And how could
they? The wild pink salmon Marine Harvest admitted to having in their boat last
June 16 were from an age-class and stock so endangered millions of public
dollars were spent to protect them. However, this is lost in DFO’s regulatory
labyrinth. If Marine Harvest has no licence to possess by-catch, does that mean
that the 1993 regulations come into effect to exempt them from all fishing rules
including possession of an endangered wild fish stock? I hope we get to find
out. Judge Saunderson issued a summons to Marine Harvest to appear in court for
possessing these pink salmon. The Department of Justice could halt this case,
but it would seem in the public interest for a court to hear this.

In October 2009 Marine Harvest also admitted to catching herring in the
Broughton Archipelago and composting them with no reporting or licence. Was this
legal or illegal? Does anyone know? If they had no licence for tons of herring
by-catch are they exempt?

Herring fishing has been closed in Broughton for twenty years because the stocks
are not rebuilding. Now we find out Norwegian “farmers” are killing them despite
the closure with no apparent ramifications, no quota nor reporting. These fish
farmers are out-fishing BC fishermen! Over-fishing is a global scourge.
Minister Shea this is not right.

Nothing is straightforward. When 40,000 Atlantics escaped from Marine Harvest’s
farm October 21, 2009, we were told they were worth a million dollars and
everything had been done to recover them. But now we hear farm fish are
worthless once they escape and only 1,200 were recovered because Marine Harvest
was “confused” about the licence DFO granted them specifically for this
situation. Does profit - starved Marine Harvest really want the expense of
disposing of 40,000 fish? They did not do everything they could have to
recapture their fish and section 55 of the /Fishery (General Regulations)/
states no person shall release live fish into fish habitat. They must be charged
and heavily fined to inspire compliance. This is the tool your Ministry uses on
other fishermen.

It is disturbing that someone lobbied Parliament to disguise the industry as
Provincial farms even though this must have raised legal red flags and then
someone specifically exempted “provincial aquaculture” from the fishing
regulations. This is Salmongate.

We are hosting guests who are pulling the tablecloth into their laps dragging
the silverware, the food, the water /everything/ out of our reach. Thankfully,
Judges Hinkson, Slade, Cohen and Saunderson have nailed the tablecloth to the
table.

However it is not up to the courts to manage fish. /Fisheries and Oceans Canada
/is touring the _National Aquaculture Strategic Action Plan Initiative_ to get
feedback, calling aquaculture a legitimate user of Canadian marine waters.
http://www.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/aquaculture/lib-bib/nasapi-insapa/nasapi-inpasa-eng.htm#intro

It is indeed time the fish farmers became “legitimate.” It is time to remove
their regulatory firewalls, open the farms to public scrutiny and silence
decades of political interference that have given foreign corporations greater
access to Canadian fish than Canadians. All this and these corporations are
still loosing money.

Minister Shea there is one job we cannot do for you. You must close the border
to import of salmon eggs from the Atlantic to prevent introduction of ISA virus
to the eastern Pacific. If you don’t you will see this issue go before the
courts. ISAV strains are highly traceable. You say there is no “strong evidence”
that it travels in eggs (3-11-2009) scientists say we are “guaranteed” to get
the virus if we keep importing eggs.

Others and myself will continue to lay charges under the /Fisheries Act /with
the help of lawyers who are working Pro Bono, and at reduced rates and thousands
of people whose small donations are making this possible. The /Fisheries Act
/specifically encourages the public to lay charges in the face of government
“inertia.”

At the very least I ask that you do not stand in our way.








Alexandra Morton
www.adopt-a-fry.org <http://www.adopt-a-fry.org>
_http://alexandramorton.typepad.com/
_

"Some could care less if there's any fish left for our kids!"
 
I said it before, and I'll say it again:

If fish farm companies are not in compliance, or have broken fisheries regulations than they should be charged and punished accordingly.

Although I have been called many things on this board such as Industry Schill, I do not think that farms should operate above the law.

Morton should be calling for the minister to do her "duty" in this regard, just as any person should.

The only problem I have with her letter is her continued reference to banning imports from ISA areas. This has been in effect for quite some time now. No eggs have been brought in from areas in the Atlantic since the late 90's. There has been some continued imports from Iceland from land based brood companies. These are raised in tanks on freshwater, and are placed in strict quarantines.
 
Not Agitated Chris, just don't like untruths repeated in the media, or risks over inflated for effect & agendas.
 
FYI: I do think eggs are being imported?
Here is a copy of the last email I received!

----- Original Message -----
From: XPAC PRMCU
To: charlie.hart@comcast.net
Sent: Monday, November 30, 2009 1:41 PM
Subject: Pacific Salmon

Charlie Hart
Kent, Washington, USA

< charlie.hart@comcast.net >
Dear Mr. Hart:

Thank you for your correspondence of various dates, addressed to the Honourable Gail Shea, Minister of Fisheries and Oceans, regarding the impact of fish farming on wild salmon stocks. I have been asked to respond on Minister Shea’s behalf.

I understand your concerns, and appreciate the opportunity to assure you that conservation of aquatic species is Fisheries and Oceans Canada’s (DFO’s) first priority, and that the Department recognizes the cultural, ecological and economic importance of salmon in British Columbia.

You may be interested to know that the marine survival of the four-year-old sockeye salmon group returning to British Columbia this year has been low both for Fraser River sockeye, of which some populations migrated through areas that have salmon farms, and also for Skeena sockeye, whose migration route has no proximity to salmon farms.

I appreciate your detailed opinion on the effect of plankton levels and the veterinary drug emamectin benzoate, commonly known as SLICE, on the sockeye returns. I assure you that DFO is committed to evaluating the causes of fluctuation in affected stocks, including interactions with fish farms, during annual reviews to be conducted in late fall 2009. The reviews will be based on the best available science.

The Department prides itself on maintaining an objective science research program, focused on DFO's priority issues. Results of this research are peer-reviewed and published in international scientific journals. The Department is committed to remaining at the forefront of scientific research and has conducted over $100 million in research in the last seven years. DFO has recently initiated a new five-year aquaculture regulatory research program, examining issues related to the regulation of finfish and shellfish aquaculture.

In addition, DFO’s Salmonid Enhancement Program (SEP), with an annual budget of $26 million, provides for hatchery operations, restoration of salmon habitat, rebuilding of vulnerable stocks, and support for community groups to protect the salmon resource. In addition, community partnerships involving 10,000 volunteers and $5 million annually in funding from partners also contribute to salmon habitat restoration in British Columbia.

Any activity with the potential to affect fish or fish habitat is subject to a number of statutes and regulations, including the Fisheries Act and, where applicable, the Canadian Environmental Assessment Act.

Regarding your concern over the spread of the infectious salmon anemia virus (ISAV), I assure you that measures are in place to deal with not only ISAV, but all fish pathogens of concern. Highlights of existing measures to prevent the spread of fish diseases from other countries and other parts of Canada to British Columbia’s (B.C.’s) fish farms are attached as Appendix A.

If you would like to discuss aquaculture matters in further detail, you may wish to contact Mr. Andrew Thomson, Director, Aquaculture Management Division, Pacific Region, by telephone at 604#8209;666#8209;3152, or by e#8209;mail at < andrew.thomson@dfo-mpo.gc.ca >.

The protection and conservation of our wild salmon is a priority for the Department. Please be assured that DFO will continue to work to conserve and protect salmon stocks for current and future generations. Thank you for taking the time to write with your concerns.

Yours sincerely,
Susan Farlinger
Susan Farlinger
Regional Director | Directrice régionale
Fisheries and Aquaculture Branch | Direction des pêches et de l'aquaculture
Fisheries and Oceans Canada | Pêches et Océans Canada
200-401 Burrard Street | 401, rue Burrard, bureau 200
Vancouver, BC | CB V6C 3S4


APPENDIX A

For aquaculture purposes, British Columbia (B.C.) has a strict importation policy of fertilized eggs only for any salmonid species.

Under the B.C. Atlantic Salmon Importation Policy, only surface#8209;disinfected, fertilized Atlantic salmon eggs from sources certified by a Local Fish Health Officer (LFHO) are permitted for import into B.C. No live Atlantic salmon or unfertilized eggs are allowed to be imported.

Any facility serving as a source of eggs for import into B.C. must undergo rigorous health testing under the Fish Health Protection Regulations before eggs can be provided to B.C. culture operations.

This applies to facilities within Canada or abroad. To export into B.C., a facility must be compliant with Canadian laws and regulations.

Since 2001, the only eggs that have been imported into B.C. have come from a pathogen#8209;free source in Iceland. This source is a dry#8209;land, closed#8209;containment facility.

Imports of fertilized eggs from qualifying facilities are held in strict quarantine and isolation for up to one year, and the resulting progeny undergo rigorous health testing before introduction to ocean farms. A condition of the import agreement is that results of the fish health testing must be reported to the LFHO on a monthly basis, while fish are in quarantine. Fish are only released from quarantine if all reports from screening come back as satisfactory. Any signs of a disease problem must be reported within 24 hours to meet import requirements.

Upon completion of the quarantine and isolation period, the Minister issues licences for all introduction and transfers of fish pursuant to Section 56 of the Fishery (General) Regulations (FGR), and only issues licences to transfer fish in the absence of disease agents of concern that may be harmful to the protection and conservation of fish. Fish may only be transferred to sea cage pens with written approval through the LFHO and corresponding Section 56 FGR licence.

Site, vessel, and visitor#8209;related fish-health protocols (including the use of foot baths and disinfection of any equipment used with fish or sediment monitoring) are in place in accordance with the industry#8209;wide Fish Health Management Plans in British Columbia.

With respect to your concerns about ISAV carried in embryo, recent international evidence suggests there is a small possibility that ISAV could be transmitted within reproductive fluids, e.g., ovarian fluid, which could mean that the virus could be on the surface of the eggs at spawning. However, surface disinfection of eggs, which is routinely carried out in all commercial and enhancement hatcheries, along with the quarantine period noted above, provides additional assurance that ISAV will not be transmitted from parent to progeny via the egg. There is no scientific evidence for ISAV occurring inside eggs, where disinfectants cannot reach. As always, DFO will continue to assess new information on this disease and others.

In addition to surface disinfection mentioned previously, all shipping materials are disinfected before disposal. The disinfectant and disinfection protocol that is used is highly effective against ISAV and other salmonid pathogens.

Sockeye... You might want to let this one lay, cause you don't even want to see my response! [:0]
 
quote:Originally posted by Charlie

Sockeye... You might want to let this one lay, cause you don't even want to see my response!
Actually, I would be interested in seeing your response to this bit of creative writing, Charlie.

In particular, I'd like to see how the illustrous wild fish protectors at DFO, such as Andy Thompson answer the following:

They stated: "With respect to your concerns about ISAV carried in embryo, recent international evidence suggests there is a small possibility that ISAV could be transmitted within reproductive fluids, e.g., ovarian fluid, which could mean that the virus could be on the surface of the eggs at spawning."

Okay, where is that "recent international evidence" reference? Who wrote it? What is defined by "small possibility". Not giving that reference is not only disengenious, but unscientific. AND we all know DFO claims it's decisions are science-based, right?

They continue the bafflegab: "However, surface disinfection of eggs, which is routinely carried out in all commercial and enhancement hatcheries, along with the quarantine period noted above, provides additional assurance that ISAV will not be transmitted from parent to progeny via the egg."

Right-on, then - where's the reference? Who tested for ISAV deactivation, and what are the numbers for changes in titre levels? Quantify that "additional assurance", PLEASE.

More blah-blah: "There is no scientific evidence for ISAV occurring inside eggs, where disinfectants cannot reach."

NO "scientific evidence"?

Does that mean somebody actually looked? Where's the reference? How did they look? Using what methodology? How many eggs?

If nobody actually looked, this statement is not only meaningless, but misleading - as it's intended to be.

More misleading statements: "In addition to surface disinfection mentioned previously, all shipping materials are disinfected before disposal. The disinfectant and disinfection protocol that is used is highly effective against ISAV and other salmonid pathogens."

So what Einstein? I'm glad the friggen packing materials won't cause ISAV. Big freaggen deal.

It's what happens out in the real world, using open net-cage technology and boat traffic, and ISAV carriers that really matters. No mention of these real-world problems there. No mention of ISA problems in Chile or Scotland, or Norway or NB; or what were the risks and the delayed responses to those outbreaks by those national authorities.

Noticeably absent references there.

Absolutely no references to pathogen/host/environment relationships, or to biosecurity and husbandry practices, or to disinfection protocols.

No references to: single year class farming, to reductions in numbers of hold-over sites, to control and containment practices, to early depopulation of infected sites, to surveillence programs at each farms, to harvest vessel certification programs, to enforced fallow periods, to sea lice transmission and control, to disease surveillence and control by area, to ISAV longevity in seawater, to data-sharing, to hydrographic modelling, to risk management, to proper disposal of dead fish and offal, or to processing of plant effluent - to name but a few of the issues purposely not addressed.

Pretty shoddy non-scientific non-answers.

Kinda an insult to your intelligence, Charlie - especially after all the time you put-in looking at the ISA issue. They probably both expected and were counting on a letter from more of a dummie, who wouldn't know enough to question the sermon from the mount.

Also unfortunately typical of our wild fish "protectors".
 
quote:Originally posted by agentaqua
Well actually I wish I would have read your response before I replied? You bring up some valid points, I wish I had included!

First, I am not stealing Alexandra Mortons term! Most don't know this, but Alex got the term "Salmongate" from me in an article I wrote back in October and I have given her permission to use "Salmongate" whenever she wants and how she sees fit! She is using it guite well! :)

The following is my response, as requested and it is based off the article I wrote in October:
quote:I do thank you for your reply! But, I don't believe there is anything in your response, that is consistent with facts? Help me out here!
Have you ever considered the following?

“Watergate” or should we call it “Salmongate”
Is this Canada’s “Watergate”? Or, should we call it “Salmongate”?

Watergate refers to, “The Scandal That Brought Down Richard Nixon.” Watergate itself is not what hurt Nixon, but the “knowing of it”, the “lying about it”, and the “cover-up” was his demise and is what eventually brought him down.

“President Nixon refuses to release the tapes and fires the special prosecutor. A decisive Supreme Court ruling is a victory for investigators.”

“The final blow came with the decision by the Supreme Court to order Nixon to release more White House tapes. One of these became known as the 'smoking gun' tape when it revealed that Nixon had participated in the Watergate cover-up as far back as June 23, 1972. Around the country, there were calls for Nixon to resign.”

“November 17 - Nixon declares”, I'm not a crook," maintaining his innocence in the Watergate case.”

July 24 - The Supreme Court rules unanimously that Nixon must turn over the tape recordings of 64 White House conversations, rejecting the president's claims of executive privilege.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/special/watergate/
http://www.watergate.info/
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/special/watergate/timeline.html

There have been several calls for investigation from over 19000 concerned citizens and individuals (mostly Canadians), that is either not being heard, or is just being ignored? I know Alexandra Morton has asked several times for the sea lice and disease records of the individual sites on the out migration of the Fraser River Sockeye to study. To date, I do not believe any records have been released? Unfortunately, I believe I am starting to see similarities between the plight of the “British Columbia salmon fishery” and “Watergate? I am not calling anyone a “crook”, but the similarities, of “secrecy”, half truths”, withholding information”, “not providing information”, “providing incorrect information”, and the list goes on and on… and it all is paralleling the “Watergate Scandal”!

DFO Pacific Region Director Paul Sprout stated these sockeye had a different species of louse than the farm salmon – but this is wrong and he should know this. Marine Harvest timed their treatments to protect the Pinks in Broughton. To protect both Pink and Sockeye the farms would have to do back-to-back treatments as the Pink and Chum migrate in April and May, while the Sockeye migrate later during June and July. I do not believe that happened.

There was so much “heat” concerning the Broughton… I believe all the focus was there and I do not think anyone was really watching or was concerned with (and/or forgot) what was happening in Campbell River? After you read the fish health reports take a look here: http://www.marineharvestcanada.com/farming_fish_health_sea_lice.php and again start reading. Now go to this site: http://www.marineharvestcanada.com/pdf/sea_lice/05_10_09_cyrus.pdf The upper chart tends to indicate everything is in tolerances, now page down and look at the 6-Jul-09and 27-Jul-09 count of “CALIGUS”, that would be 16.53 and 12.20 respectfully, (lice) per fish?, on an inventory of 507,792?. Treatment was Not given until 8-Aug-09. Am I reading this right? In addition, this does not count all the lice floating around, not counted and right in the middle of the Sockeye out migration! This is on the Fraser River Sockeye migration route! How many Fraser Sockeye, do you think that migrated in July, got through there in 2009, without being “lethally” infested with sea lice or other diseases?

If you look -RIGHT IN THE FRASER, the Harrison sockeye did very well, the rest of the Fraser sockeye declined by 92%. What is the difference between the Harrison and other Fraser sockeye? A paper by DFO says they migrate out through Juan de Fuca, while the others are known to go north right through the fish farms at Campbell River.

DFO what are you thinking? “there has not been a salmon collapse in the Fraser,” “while this year's sockeye return is the lowest in 50 years, Rosenberger said, “they've rebuilt stocks from worse cases in the past.” Barry Rosenberger, B.C. Interior area director for the DFO's Pacific region, is quoted in The Record: http://www2.canada.com/newwestrecord/news/story.html?id=0d908438-f4e8-4ca8-8ac6-6fd447340ce8 While on the very same day Stephen Hume in the Vancouver Sun published the DFO return numbers for the Fraser River and many creeks are showing "zero"? http://www.vancouversun.com/sports/worst+years+history+salmon+still+killing+them/2099674/story.html

You cannot rebuild a genetic stock back from "zero"! ONCE THEY ARE GONE... THEY ARE GONE!

Is everyone in DFO blind to the fact you are losing your "Wild Salmon" and what is actually transpiring? On the other hand, has Canada just written off the "Wild Salmon" in favor of Aquaculture "farmed salmon"?

Here are some things I know and some that I believe.

“Open Net Cage’ Salmon Farming”
“Fish Farms situated in estuarine waters seem to be implicated in the decline of wild fish in both places (Scotland and Canada). The problem is that the dense stocking of farmed salmon in ‘open net cages’ allows the numbers of sea lice to increase dramatically. In natural conditions the fish are much more widely distributed and the parasites, while present, do not usually cause major problems. Young wild salmon and sea trout hatch in freshwater streams and then pass down through the estuaries to reach the sea. As they pass the salmon farms these young fish ‘pick up’ the parasites, which are thought to cause them serious problems.”

“DNA Studies”
“When a wild fish is captured and found to be carrying sea lice it is difficult to be certain where these parasites came from. They might be from the ‘natural’ pool of parasites in the open sea, or possibly from one of the ‘unnatural’ populations that flourish around fish farms. Recent studies in Scotland focused on the ‘Genetic Fingerprinting’ of Lepeophtheirus salmonis attached to wild sea trout and salmon as they returned to freshwater to breed. This work shows that many of the sea lice came from the populations that surround fish farms.”

Fish farms are required to and do keep sea lice data, per site! And, from everything I am gathering, they keep very accurate records. What appears to be happening is a combined report is generated, per sub-zones, which is what is used in the “Fish Health” reports. According to the Fish Health Report, everything is well within tolerances? So, they say… I might have a different opinion. Read the reports and you will see my concerns: http://www.agf.gov.bc.ca/ahc/fish_health/ The individual site data is not in the reports, nor really discussed. Just a few comments if the sea lice count exceeds the “trigger” it is being “monitored” and treated as necessary… or words to that effect.

As far as I can tell, MHC has been keeping these records since 2003, posting on the webpage since 2004. But, if you go and start looking, the information isn’t there! Why? I was told the farms were “fallow” and they only post current data and remove the information when a farm is fallow. I have that in writing from MHC and I am okay there… but, why are they not willing to release their data per site for 2007? They have the information, why don’t they want others to see it?

If you don’t believe “sea lice” are killing salmon you need to start doing some reading – they are! Here are some places you can start! These are not in any particular order:
http://www.promedmail.org/pls/otn/f..._BACK_PAGE,F2400_P1001_PUB_MAIL_ID:1010,79449
http://www.davidsuzuki.org/files/Leggatt_reportfinal.pdf
http://www.fs.fed.us/pnw/pubs/pnw_gtr697.pdf
http://www.pewtrusts.org/uploadedFi...ing_ocean_life/env_pew_oceans_aquaculture.pdf
http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/cgi-bin/fulltext/122208323/PDFSTART?CRETRY=1&SRETRY=0

I believe under the right circumstances one (1) farm can completely devastate the entire out migration of an entire run. That has been pretty much proven from reports from Norway, Scotland, and Ireland. That is why I am asking for the individual disease and sea lice counts – per site! Everyone else should be doing this also and the farms need to make them a matter of public record! This is the “ONLY” thing that is going to save our Pacific Northwest indigenous salmon from extinction!

I also believe it was "proven" ISAV can be transmitted within eggs... you might want to read up on how a "virus" can mutate??

Here is a quote to keep in mind:
“Whether ours shall continue to be a government of laws and not of men is now before Congress and ultimately the American people”. Special Prosecutor Archibald Cox - after his firing, by Richard Nixon, Oct 20 1973.

Oh, btw... If anyone really thinks Alaska has "fish farms"... they really need to do their homework! And... if anyone can "prove" my beliefs are wrong... I will be very happy!

Charlie
 
quote:Originally posted by Charlie

Well actually I wish I would have read your response before I replied? You bring up some valid points, I wish I had included!
There's no limit to the # of letters you, or anyone else here on this forum, can write to the fisheries minister. You could write another, if you wish.

Another point: you write: "You cannot rebuild a genetic stock back from "zero"! ONCE THEY ARE GONE... THEY ARE GONE!"

Actually population decline and failure happens long before zero is reached. You need enough exchange of DNA to keep the remaining members of that population from inbreeding. The methodology used in estimating the overall numbers of any population from being inbreed is called "Population Viability Analysis" or PVA. Look it up and Google it.

Check-out:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_viability_analysis
http://www.ramas.com/pva.htm
http://www.canids.org/PUBLICAT/EWACTPLN/EWAP Chapter 6 Population Viability Analysis.PDF
 
quote:Originally posted by agentaqua

quote:Originally posted by Charlie

Well actually I wish I would have read your response before I replied? You bring up some valid points, I wish I had included!
There's no limit to the # of letters you, or anyone else here on this forum, can write to the fisheries minister. You could write another, if you wish.
People don't have a clue how many letters I write? And, it is also scary how many go to your PM! :)

quote:Another point: you write: "You cannot rebuild a genetic stock back from "zero"! ONCE THEY ARE GONE... THEY ARE GONE!"

Actually population decline and failure happens long before zero is reached. You need enough exchange of DNA to keep the remaining members of that population from inbreeding. The methodology used in estimating the overall numbers of any population from being inbreed is called "Population Viability Analysis" or PVA. Look it up and Google it.

Check-out:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_viability_analysis
http://www.ramas.com/pva.htm
http://www.canids.org/PUBLICAT/EWACTPLN/EWAP Chapter 6 Population Viability Analysis.PDF
Been there, done that! :)
That was directed towards DFO's statement they have rebuilt the stocks from "lower numbers" in the past! hmm...? But, I do concede, if they have "eggs" they can be rebuilt to an extent? That's a big "IF" and "CAN", as you know. We are currently doing that... and that has been proven to be a "very long" process.

I would be okay... If everyone started writing and sending emails and using any information I post, just to let the PM and DFO "they are watching" and will not tolerate a "Salmongate"

Just so everyone knows... there is no doubt, there is a need for "fish farms" especially if we continue to eat as much salmon as we do and I am not opposed to the farms... But, "NOT" at the expense of "our" Pacific wild salmon. Things NEED FIXED!!!!!!
 
Some good questions to ask the DFO Regional Director in your next letter would be;
"Is there a contingency plan if ISAV is detected in wild Pacific salmon? If so, what is it?"
 
quote:Originally posted by cuttlefish

Some good questions to ask the DFO Regional Director in your next letter would be;
"Is there a contingency plan if ISAV is detected in wild Pacific salmon? If so, what is it?"
Yes, there is... But, may I ask? Why don't you write and ask?
 
Hey guys, this may come as a shock, but I agree with you that we should not be considering the importation of eggs from a ISA positive area. All the companies in BC grow sufficient brood fish every year to be self sufficient in egg supply and do not need to import any eggs.

Although it sounds like DFO would allow such an import under the prescribed conditons history has shown that they will not even entertain such a suggestion.

You are also quite correct agent, Iodophore disinfection on a water hardened egg only effects the outside surface. Viruses and some bacterias (most notably the agent which causes BKD) can be translitted vertically from parent to offspring via inclusion within the egg. In Alaska, it is routine to water harden sockeye eggs in 100 ppm iodophor solution as a preventative against transmission of IHNV. Foer those of you who do not know, water hartdening is the process during which freshly spawbned eggs swell and become hard by taking up water. Theory is that they would also take up some iodophor which would kill the virus. I have never heard of this process used on any other eggs but Sockeye.

I do believe that ISAV can be carried by Oncho. species, but does not kill them. Unike Salmo's to which it is lethal, but only in a farmed situation.
 
hello to all sorry I have been away for so long =( I warms my heart to see you all continuing the fight =D Check out this garbage http://www.canada.com/Marine+Harvest+tells+city+good+news/2300917/story.html


If Marine Harvest has made so much money and given so much to BC in the last few years? Can someone please tell me WHY do they need taxpayer money to fund closed containment pilot projects? This article is a bunch of bull !!!

"Major investments in the works include a new waste water treatment plant worth more than $3 million for their Port Hardy processing plant. More will go into Sayward.

"Next year we will make a big investment in Sayward," Erenst said. "We have a hatchery there which we will rebuild and make much more efficient in order to use less water and produce bigger and stronger smolts. That will be a five or six million dollar investment.

now look at this

As for closed containment, Erenst said Marine Harvest has a small-scale pilot project waiting for funding assistance from the federal and provincial governments.

They have no real intention of pushing for closed containment and wont until the people of BC make them change.



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Welcome back Gimp! Wondered where you went.

"Some could care less if there's any fish left for our kids!"
 
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