water in the oil

[the runt]

Hi gents,i have a problem.I.m getting water in my oil,it's not radiator water it.s flush water.Iv'e changed oil and filter 3 times yesterday.Each time i check the check the oil, it's white.Is it my heat exchanger.is the motor toast.Easy repair? any Advice would be helpful.It's a 351 ford.

thanks the runt

 

[GLG]

TR , I’m no expect on fords but it sounds like exhaust manifolds. If they are more than 5 years old (and salt water use) that might be your problem. Here is a link to another message board that I go to search for answers to my own issues.
http://www.marineengine.com/cgi-bin/discus/discus.cgi?pg=topics
Searching thru the messages is the best way to start. If you don’t find an answer you could join and post a question. If you post give lots of details about you gear, as that will help others help you. Like I said I don’t know too much about fords mostly Volvos. If it were my motor I would start to look from where raw water enters the engine to where it leaves. Good Luck GLG

 

[Brisco]

Sounds like a blown head gasket.

 

[MyEscape]

I agree with brisco....

Cheers ME

 

[GLG]

Correct me if I’m wrong but if it were the head gasket you would get antifreeze in the oil. I don’t think any raw water goes to the head. GLG

 

[salmonkiller01]

Would be worth pulling the exhaust manifolds and risers. Take them to a rad shop and they will clean and inspect them. I have run a few ford engine and found the barr manifolds and risers to be a good replacement for the stock ones and way cheaper.

 

[flytyer]

Runt- first question
1- is it fresh water cooled or do you have a closed system
2- do you see any oil ( a film) on the back of your transom were the exhaust comes out the prop
You say that its not your rad, if that is the case and you are not loosing coolant than your exchanger is shot and it will either need to be retubed or replaced
YOu can test it by removing the lines to it and pressurize the water inlet side of the system. plug the water outlet and see if the pressure drops, you may even be able to hear the air hissing if you put your ear near the fill cap.

Don't worry, it is not your head gasket

 

[wolf]

How old are the risers and manifold if there past 5 years they are more likely done especially if the moter sits your better off puting new ones in as i tried to re plane the manifold and you just loose to much of the walls most times to get a good seal.

good luck Wolf

 

[Island Fish Lifter]

Probably manifolds. I would suggest doing them asap before you have engine damage.
Dave

 

[Brisco]

Hey guys, how does the water get from the manifolds to the engine oil?

 

[wolf]

Most (closed)systems the manifolds are freshwater cooled (antifreeze) and there is a metal gasket in between the riser and maninfold and with most cases the gasket corrodes as the walls on both the risers and manifolds are thin to begin with thats why trying to plane them down is not really worth it as most times they are too far gone.

On a open system you dont put the gasket there so only part of your manifold is freshwater cooled the rest is salt water cooled I opted on my old boat to just run salwater through it as you only get 5 years plus on both systems BUT you do get lucky and goes longer but generally any thing past 5 to 7 year is the norm.


wolf

 

[Island Fish Lifter]

quote:Originally posted by Brisco

Hey guys, how does the water get from the manifolds to the engine oil?

What happens is this: In most cases, raw water is pumped through your heat exchanger,(sometimes throught an oil cooler too, usually for your power steering), then out with your exhaust via the riser.

Sometimes raw water circulates through the whole manifold/ riser assembly, other times just through the riser itself as the manifold is part of the closed cooling system. Obviously I dont know what system you have.

So: lets say you have a rotten sea water (raw water) cooled manifold. Water will actually leak through the damaged portion of your manifold, through an open exhaust valve into your cylinder, through the end gap in your piston rings and finally into your engine oil.

This can also happen; If your timing is out, or whatever, to cause your engine to "run on" after the key's shut off, Whats actually happening in most cases is your engine is running backwards. During this period raw water wil be drawn into your exhaust side.

Dieseling, or running on in a marine application can really suck, as you are now aware.

Dont forget to check if it has an engine oil cooler in line, this could very well be your problem.

Good luck, Im sure you'll get to the bottom of it.

 

[Island Fish Lifter]

quote:Originally posted by Brisco

Hey guys, how does the water get from the manifolds to the engine oil?

What happens is this: In most cases, raw water is pumped through your heat exchanger,(sometimes throught an oil cooler too, usually for your power steering), then out with your exhaust via the riser.

Sometimes raw water circulates through the whole manifold/ riser assembly, other times just through the riser itself as the manifold is part of the closed cooling system. Obviously I dont know what system you have.

So: lets say you have a rotten sea water (raw water) cooled manifold. Water will actually leak through the damaged portion of your manifold, through an open exhaust valve into your cylinder, through the end gap in your piston rings and finally into your engine oil.

This can also happen; If your timing is out, or whatever, to cause your engine to "run on" after the key's shut off, Whats actually happening in most cases is your engine is running backwards. During this period raw water wil be drawn into your exhaust side.

Dieseling, or running on in a marine application can really suck, as you are now aware.

Dont forget to check if it has an engine oil cooler in line, this could very well be your problem.

Good luck, Im sure you'll get to the bottom of it.

 

[daddystoy]

I would do a compression test first. If compression is down on 1 or more cylinders, or two cylinders that are next to each other then it could be a cylinder head gasket is leaking. If compression is all pretty equal it would possibly be a riser or exhaust manifold is corroded thru. If you get a low compression reading on a cylinder, squirt some oil into the cylinder and see if this changes the reading. If the compression comes up then it is bad rings, not the source of the problem. If the compression doesn't come up then you probably have a stuck valve, not necesarrily the source of the problem. A leaking head gasket could show 2 adjacent cylinders with low compression which could allow anti freeze into the combustion chamber which will dilute the oil turning it milky.

I'm not sure what you mean by "not radiator water. It's flush water" How do you know this?

I've got the 302 ford, same engine as yours (basically) fresh water cooled

 

[daddystoy]

I would do a compression test first. If compression is down on 1 or more cylinders, or two cylinders that are next to each other then it could be a cylinder head gasket is leaking. If compression is all pretty equal it would possibly be a riser or exhaust manifold is corroded thru. If you get a low compression reading on a cylinder, squirt some oil into the cylinder and see if this changes the reading. If the compression comes up then it is bad rings, not the source of the problem. If the compression doesn't come up then you probably have a stuck valve, not necesarrily the source of the problem. A leaking head gasket could show 2 adjacent cylinders with low compression which could allow anti freeze into the combustion chamber which will dilute the oil turning it milky.

I'm not sure what you mean by "not radiator water. It's flush water" How do you know this?

I've got the 302 ford, same engine as yours (basically) fresh water cooled

 

[hardtimes]

I have a 350 chev engine in mine. It got big time overheated last year. Now am having to get engine rebuid. Water i 2 pistons, and 2 valves seized up. Salt water damage. $7500 dollars worth.

 

[hardtimes]

I have a 350 chev engine in mine. It got big time overheated last year. Now am having to get engine rebuid. Water i 2 pistons, and 2 valves seized up. Salt water damage. $7500 dollars worth.

 

[the runt]

Thanks guys,it's sounds like manifold problems.Daddys toy the answer how i might come up withflush water is my rad. water is still full.Fly tyer odd you said that.Pulled pugs drained water[nice eh]new plugs,fired up sounded good.went to the garage still running.engine pitch changed boat was engulfed in a cloud of smoke.shut it down black oil residue inside prop hub and on transom.Checked rad water still full.checked oil whie and about 2 inches higher on stick.Will call mechanic on new risers,let you know what it costs,if motor isn't shot.Thanks for all your help

thanks the runt

 

[the runt]

Thanks guys,it's sounds like manifold problems.Daddys toy the answer how i might come up withflush water is my rad. water is still full.Fly tyer odd you said that.Pulled pugs drained water[nice eh]new plugs,fired up sounded good.went to the garage still running.engine pitch changed boat was engulfed in a cloud of smoke.shut it down black oil residue inside prop hub and on transom.Checked rad water still full.checked oil whie and about 2 inches higher on stick.Will call mechanic on new risers,let you know what it costs,if motor isn't shot.Thanks for all your help

thanks the runt

 

[daddystoy]

The other test you could try is a vacuum test. Take a vacuum gauge and hook it to a vacuum line that would be coming out of the intake manifold. Without getting into a long winded explanation on this the vacuum test and the compression test are probably THE 2 best tests to perform on a older carburated engine such as this one. Any repair manual,such as seloc or clymer will explain how to do this and will also explain what the readings mean. You can learn tremendous amounts about any engine with these two simple tests. Good luck.