ReelAffair
Active Member
Where have you been?????
Have you not been reading
Halibut - The Hammer Falls
- Thread starter IronNoggin
- Start date
Where have you been?????
Have you not been reading
Little Hawk
Active Member
Howdy,
I sent a letter to Chris Bos and asked him to forward it to Gerry, the new SFAB Pres., and therein suggested that the SFAB - although I do understand is strictly an 'advisory' body to the DFO - take some $$$$ out of the 'quota-kitty' that's left over and SUE the DFO (perhaps the Sport Fishing Institue could be acting Plaintiff) for misappropriation of a Public Resource.
Clearly this is not being done.
To my mind, Pacific Halibut are a public resource and utilization of this resource should me managed in the best interests of ALL CANADIANS.
Holding them accountable in a court of law is the only way anything will change.
I sent a letter to Chris Bos and asked him to forward it to Gerry, the new SFAB Pres., and therein suggested that the SFAB - although I do understand is strictly an 'advisory' body to the DFO - take some $$$$ out of the 'quota-kitty' that's left over and SUE the DFO (perhaps the Sport Fishing Institue could be acting Plaintiff) for misappropriation of a Public Resource.
Clearly this is not being done.
To my mind, Pacific Halibut are a public resource and utilization of this resource should me managed in the best interests of ALL CANADIANS.
Holding them accountable in a court of law is the only way anything will change.
ReelAffair
Active Member
DFO has a booth at the boat show...we can all stand there and wait for answers
walleyes
Crew Member
Just lettin you guys know that some of us just east of you are doing our best to help out in this fight.
Here is a link to a very popular outdoors forum here in Alberta. You will notice that we have a few members on it that are from the west coast as well as many of us that frequent the west coast every year. Many of us are very concerned with this fight and are helping out as best we can. Wolf recently sent a letter my way that I passed on to a few people to sign and forward on again. As you will read I am trying to drum up more interest on the subject and get more momentum behind this.
http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showthread.php?t=28105
As I have stated before this is a fight for all Canadians as these are Federal waters and as such affect us all these are my fish as well as yours and be assured we are trying to help you guys out..
Your freind in Alberta...
Here is a link to a very popular outdoors forum here in Alberta. You will notice that we have a few members on it that are from the west coast as well as many of us that frequent the west coast every year. Many of us are very concerned with this fight and are helping out as best we can. Wolf recently sent a letter my way that I passed on to a few people to sign and forward on again. As you will read I am trying to drum up more interest on the subject and get more momentum behind this.
http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showthread.php?t=28105
As I have stated before this is a fight for all Canadians as these are Federal waters and as such affect us all these are my fish as well as yours and be assured we are trying to help you guys out..
Your freind in Alberta...
T
The Fish Assassin
Guest
Good idea L/H. The lawyers would have a field day spending all the money while your trying to protect your privilege. You can't really be serious? You have to have a share in something before you can try to prove it was misappropriated, wouldn't you think? Don't confuse your privilege with somone's inherent right. A privilege can be revoked in some cases. In modern democracies, a privilege is conditional and granted only after birth. By contrast, a right is an inherent, irrevocable entitlement held by all citizens or all human beings from birth. You'd think the apppropriate group whose inherent resources have been misappropriated should be the ones in court.
Take only what you need.
scott craven
Well-Known Member
Then go for it !
It is for all of us a PRIVILEGE to have access to such a great resource and the right to that privilege is shared by all. The continued harrassment here regarding the distinction between right and privilege as used to refer to FN rights does nothing to help the resource that we share. And we do share it.
Has anyone else noticed that when DFO wants to protect a specific run they close both FN and recreational fisheries? Always! The slot limit on the S. West Coast is a good example. As I understand it, this fishery is aprox 95% US origin hatchery fish and our fishery has almost no impact on the run being protected, but it is closed to ensure the FN restrictions on the Fraser River. This is how DFO has recognized the right as provided by the courts. They close both. I'm OK with this (though I recognize that my privilege - and therefore our economy - may be restricted unnecessarily.)
The continued distinction between Rights and Privilege serves only to promote hatred. Our Elders (and we all have them) certainly would not approve. I would make a motion that from here out on this board Right and Privilege are understood to be interchangeable as used to discuss our rights as Canadian Citizens concerned about our recreational fishery (not to be confused with inherent court sanctioned FN rights) so that the posters can carry on with their intelligent discussions.
Has anyone else noticed that when DFO wants to protect a specific run they close both FN and recreational fisheries? Always! The slot limit on the S. West Coast is a good example. As I understand it, this fishery is aprox 95% US origin hatchery fish and our fishery has almost no impact on the run being protected, but it is closed to ensure the FN restrictions on the Fraser River. This is how DFO has recognized the right as provided by the courts. They close both. I'm OK with this (though I recognize that my privilege - and therefore our economy - may be restricted unnecessarily.)
The continued distinction between Rights and Privilege serves only to promote hatred. Our Elders (and we all have them) certainly would not approve. I would make a motion that from here out on this board Right and Privilege are understood to be interchangeable as used to discuss our rights as Canadian Citizens concerned about our recreational fishery (not to be confused with inherent court sanctioned FN rights) so that the posters can carry on with their intelligent discussions.
wolf
Well-Known Member
T
The Fish Assassin
Guest
I'm not sure what you’re referring to as my fishing rights NEVER "close". I could fish 24/7 365 for what ever I desired if I so choose. I am still "able to hunt and fish as before settlement"
As for the difference between rights and privilege, it is such a basic lack of respect for inherent rights, by some members of this forum, that makes me point this out and in this particular case I think it has a very valid point. I just have a hard time of grasping the concept that somebody would actually think that a conditional privilege gives them a legal claim to the resource. Some out there that fish on their conditional privilege seem to think that the resource owes something to them for some reason. I totally understand the frustration expressed towards DFO all to well. All of our voices fall upon deft ears all the time. I know that we also share a common goal of enough fish everywhere for everyone. We also share a love for the Ocean and all of it bounties and beauty. I'm sure it wasn't little Hawk's intention to alienate the rights of F/N's by stating he views the Pacific Halibut as a Public Resource, but that being said I just had to make my point about the difference. I personally do not view conditional privleges as eqaul to inherent rights and when it all gets lumped into a "public resource" I feel I have to protect my rights.
Is the SFAB funded by DFO? And if so is that the appropriate vessel for getting the message to them? It would seem to me that a stronger message must be sent and this organization might be limited in what it can do to get the message out. You know what they say about the squeaky wheel...
Are the sports fishermen actually catching 12%? How do we actually know?
Take only what you need.
wolf
Well-Known Member
Why do you always have to play the race card. its got nothing to do with it this has to do with </u>US ALL as canadien people. if you did some insight you would know SFAB is NOT by any means funded by DFO.
Just think about it dfo gives people money to fight against them !!!!!!!!WTF
Just think about it dfo gives people money to fight against them !!!!!!!!WTF
Little Hawk
Active Member
F/A;
Please, my FN Brother, be advised that your average Canadian Sport-fisherman has no issues with the FED's FN (food & ceremonial) priority allocation, nor have I personally implied that I do.
Your peoples used the resource for several millennium until the European's showed up and we managed to decimate the fishery in less than 100 years.
In our squabblings we sometimes forget that we are ALL in this together and the sooner we can unite our common energy and work together to battle incompetent fisheries management and ensure there will be fish for our children and grandchildren, regardless of our skin-colour or ethnic origins, the sooner there will be peace.
Please, my FN Brother, be advised that your average Canadian Sport-fisherman has no issues with the FED's FN (food & ceremonial) priority allocation, nor have I personally implied that I do.
Your peoples used the resource for several millennium until the European's showed up and we managed to decimate the fishery in less than 100 years.
In our squabblings we sometimes forget that we are ALL in this together and the sooner we can unite our common energy and work together to battle incompetent fisheries management and ensure there will be fish for our children and grandchildren, regardless of our skin-colour or ethnic origins, the sooner there will be peace.
T
The Fish Assassin
Guest
Here here!!!
That's exactly the type of attitude I like to see. We all have the same common goals really. And you've showed your respect for the FSC fishery. I totally agree that the sooner we can unite and make DFO accountable the sooner things will be the way they should.
Wolf, I don't "play" the race card. There are definate differences between your conditional privilege and my inherent rights. I can go catch a Halibut today if I wanted. And my fear is that if the Halibut Resource was indeed seen as a public Canadian resource how might that infringe upon those rights? I personally feel that the 88/12 split is a little extreme, and I agree that sport fishing brings in more $$$$ into the economy per pound than the Commercials do. Why not 80/20 if it helps the guides stay afloat. The guides need the Halibut fishery due to the declineing salmon stocks. I totally get that, but I can not support it if it costs me the opportunity to fish for FSC Halibut.
Take only what you need.
T
The Fish Assassin
Guest
so WTF you think about that Wolf?
That's why I said..
Is the SFAB the appropriate vessel for getting the message to DFO? It would seem to me that a stronger message must be sent and this organization might be limited in what it can do to get the message out. You know what they say about the squeaky wheel...
Take only what you need.
Just so we are ALL working with the correct information ....
DFO does not pay the elected delegates for their time to visit SFAB meetings, it is ALL voluntary. Zero per diems, no wages and no conpensation ... Nothing Zilch Zero! But they do reimburse people for their out-of-pocket travel expenses as meetings are centrally located and volunteers travel from far and wide to attend.
No one's getting rich on the government or taxpayers dollar giving advice to the fisheries minister from the sport fishing sector.
However DFO used to let the commercial sector go catch fish beyond their license needs to raise money to fund their own sectors requirements. Certain science and monitoring plus stock assessment programs and I think the CFAB too. Until the Supreme Court of Canada said bad DFO you can't do that.
God never did make a more calm, quiet, innocent recreation than angling - Izaak Walton
DFO does not pay the elected delegates for their time to visit SFAB meetings, it is ALL voluntary. Zero per diems, no wages and no conpensation ... Nothing Zilch Zero! But they do reimburse people for their out-of-pocket travel expenses as meetings are centrally located and volunteers travel from far and wide to attend.
No one's getting rich on the government or taxpayers dollar giving advice to the fisheries minister from the sport fishing sector.
However DFO used to let the commercial sector go catch fish beyond their license needs to raise money to fund their own sectors requirements. Certain science and monitoring plus stock assessment programs and I think the CFAB too. Until the Supreme Court of Canada said bad DFO you can't do that.
God never did make a more calm, quiet, innocent recreation than angling - Izaak Walton
You know FA, I know nobody here on this forum who has an issue with true and honest FSC fishery. What annoys a lot of members here is your arrogant way of expressing your specialness and entitlements and your apparent feeling of superiority over other Canadians while they suffer from unfair restrictions. Maybe you want to think about for a second before you fire off again your same old and not-improving slogans... You may actually achieve the opposite of what you are hoping for - instead of raising awareness of FN rights you may actually raise anger and disrespect for the same.
But in any case, FN halibut quota is deducted off the total Canandian halibut quota - therefore before the 88/12% split and thus any adjustments to the unfair 88/12% split would not have any impact on the FN share. Maybe that makes you sleep a bit better FA..
But in any case, FN halibut quota is deducted off the total Canandian halibut quota - therefore before the 88/12% split and thus any adjustments to the unfair 88/12% split would not have any impact on the FN share. Maybe that makes you sleep a bit better FA..
S
SnapperAttacker
Guest
Conservative ********, can i recant my vote for those ignorant f@cks.
T
The Fish Assassin
Guest
Well chris with comments like
I already know where your coming from buddy and it is obvious that you are the one who really doesn't get it!! After the whites wiped out the salmon runs why would you even consider that F/N,s are the ones who should cut back. If anything we should have at least 35% of all TAC for commercial sales. The day that F/N's don’t fish will be the day we get compensated for the decimation of OUR stocks. I mean in this day and age what is 8 billion dollars, to go towards compensation, for god’s sake there giving it out to auto companies. Why not make amends with F/N's instead of bailing out these large mis-managed organizations? We are the ones who's rights are supposed to be protected by law, and that includes DFO's Fiduciary responsibility, so technically they where supposed to manage the stocks in order to protect our access to the fish. You think they have done their jobs well? It is about time that the F/N's took control of the resources in thier traditional territories. Each F/N should be the ones making coin off the resources in thier respective area. I take my hat off to the Ahousaht and Hesquiaht Nations as they have laid claim to all the resources in thier traditional territory. Here is a copy of the letter once again.
It will be interesting to say the least how this precedent plays out.
Take only what you need.
I already know where your coming from buddy and it is obvious that you are the one who really doesn't get it!! After the whites wiped out the salmon runs why would you even consider that F/N,s are the ones who should cut back. If anything we should have at least 35% of all TAC for commercial sales. The day that F/N's don’t fish will be the day we get compensated for the decimation of OUR stocks. I mean in this day and age what is 8 billion dollars, to go towards compensation, for god’s sake there giving it out to auto companies. Why not make amends with F/N's instead of bailing out these large mis-managed organizations? We are the ones who's rights are supposed to be protected by law, and that includes DFO's Fiduciary responsibility, so technically they where supposed to manage the stocks in order to protect our access to the fish. You think they have done their jobs well? It is about time that the F/N's took control of the resources in thier traditional territories. Each F/N should be the ones making coin off the resources in thier respective area. I take my hat off to the Ahousaht and Hesquiaht Nations as they have laid claim to all the resources in thier traditional territory. Here is a copy of the letter once again.
It will be interesting to say the least how this precedent plays out.
Take only what you need.
Tailspin
Active Member
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