Alberni Inlet springs

This whole thing really pisses me off, every time I open this thread, within a minute or two, all that I can see is RED!!!!!and my head starts to pound.

The latest info, I have a hard time believing.

I would rate this information:

Bullshit_.jpg
 
How do you really feel FH?............
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The SSS is but one.......
 
How do you really feel FH?............
emo-coffee.gif


The SSS is but one.......

I miss somtin???? What tis SSS????

The way I feel is hard to put into words because it is not good for my health to try and think about this whole bloddy debacle long enough to put it out in logical and understandable format for all to read. In summary they completely Fu@%ed this fishery and now they will fabricate and pull magical fricken numbers out of their butt to try and apease all of us that care about future runs. Fact is they screwed up and somebody needs to be held accountable for their actions, will that happen,,,, well it appears by the smoke and mirror show that is being set up for our benefit, that in fact nothing will be done about it. And to put salt into the wound, if the tables were turned and this happened, you can be damned sure that someone would be nailed to a cross and set afire. Fact is that DFO does not want to touch this political hot potatoe, and hell even if they did want to what could they really do??? They fricken well sat by on the sidelines and watched this bloody crime unfold before their eyes and did nothing, they are just as guilty as the purpetrators of this criminal act, and now they are in full damage control.

On the bright side,,,,, "It's fabulous for Port Alberni," said HFN chief councillor Steven Tatoosh. "All our kids will have clothes for school." at least for this year,:mad:.

I know that it may seem that I take this personally, well in fact I do, because their actions on this fishery will have an effect on all of us down the road, and a precedent has now been set, these actions will now be accepted and most likely supported by the law, if they don't do anything about it.

Time for me to go take my frustrations out on some firewood.

FH
 
I miss somtin???? What tis SSS????

The way I feel is hard to put into words because it is not good for my health to try and think about this whole bloddy debacle long enough to put it out in logical and understandable format for all to read. In summary they completely Fu@%ed this fishery and now they will fabricate and pull magical fricken numbers out of their butt to try and apease all of us that care about future runs. Fact is they screwed up and somebody needs to be held accountable for their actions, will that happen,,,, well it appears by the smoke and mirror show that is being set up for our benefit, that in fact nothing will be done about it. And to put salt into the wound, if the tables were turned and this happened, you can be damned sure that someone would be nailed to a cross and set afire. Fact is that DFO does not want to touch this political hot potatoe, and hell even if they did want to what could they really do??? They fricken well sat by on the sidelines and watched this bloody crime unfold before their eyes and did nothing, they are just as guilty as the purpetrators of this criminal act, and now they are in full damage control.

On the bright side,,,,, "It's fabulous for Port Alberni," said HFN chief councillor Steven Tatoosh. "All our kids will have clothes for school." at least for this year,:mad:.


FH

My thoughts exactly... what a sham and scam!
 
"Conservation measures are required to protect salmon in the Somass River due to extremely low water.

Effective October 15, 2012 until November 30, 2012, the Somass River from the boat launch at Clutesi Marina, approximately one (1) kilometre downstream to the power-line crossing situated near the Catalyst Paper Port Alberni Division mill is closed to all angling for salmon and fin fish. Variation Orders: 2012-396 and 2012-397."


Conservation measures that SHOULD have occurred immediately following the Rape & Pillage Fishery would have been a complete closure for springs system wide - if we were living in a sane world that is.

Note the area of closure: well below Papermill, in the tidal section below the Marina. While there was the odd angler tossing a line to stacked coho, chums and moldy springs there, the closure was imposed much more to stop the FN Triple-Hookers from inflicting even more damage on an ongoing basis (my opinion of course). Now that this section is closed, let's see if The Dino suddenly develop the intestinal fortitude to enforce it...

One might also note the timing - AFTER the rains had come and the fish were beginning to travel in serious numbers.
"Low Water" is always a concern, however that situation was well on it's way to self rectification.

I have heard Nothing back from the Official Fisheries Critics in Ottawa, nor BC, nor the MLA, nor anyone from DFO in this regard. it strongly appears they all simply want to sweep this one under the carpet.

Nor have I received any further information regarding escapement numbers since the 25th of last month. While that may be simple oversight, the suspicious side of me tends to wonder...
Sent in a direct request for those today, so I guess I'll find out one way or the other in short order now...

What a complete CIRCUS! :mad:

Nog
 
Salmon conservation measures that were required to protect fish holding and waiting for river flows to return to normal are hereby revoked on the following waters; Subarea 23-1: Effective 00:01 hours, October 19, 2012 until 23:59 hours December 31, 2012 the closure on the Somass River from the boat launch at Clutesi Marina, downstream approximately one (1) kilometer to the power line crossing located near coordinates 49 15.051N latitude and 124 48.717W longitude, for coho salmon; and until March 31,2013 for chinook and chum salmon. Variation Orders: 2012-406 to 2012-410 inclusive.
http://www-ops2.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/x..._notice&lang=en&DOC_ID=146896&ID=recreational

Alrighty then, Close it Monday, Open it Friday. Allow springs to be retained (as IF there are any!!
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) in light of around 1/2 of the required escapement.

Is it just me, or do the Lunatics appear to be Running The Asylum??
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Nog
 
On the bright side,,,,, "It's fabulous for Port Alberni," said HFN chief councillor Steven Tatoosh. "All our kids will have clothes for school." at least for this year,:mad:.


FH

Maybe Steven should by those clothes himself?

http://www.sunnewsnetwork.ca/video/1741805410001

I assume the comments "at least for this year" means they need to rape and pillage future stocks next year too?

And DFO is too SCARED to touch this issue of poaching and overfishing quota ( because of the color of a persons skin)
...sad days for sure IMHO
 
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The measures aren't necessary - those fish (coho) moved up into the creek as soon as the rain hit. We will get the full data on chinook count shortly. I haven't seen all the info but was lead to believe the escapement in numbers isn't as bad as feared, and the fecundity of spawners this year is greater than usual due to higher proportion of age 5 females. Again, just rumor until I see it in print.

SFI, SFAC, West Coast Aquatic and WCFGA are organizing an open house (public meeting) for Nov 20 at the Barkley Hotel in Port Alberni. It will be a facilitated meeting, and we will be inviting guest speakers with technical data to ensure open transparent process focused on finding opportunities to work cooperatively to identify enhancement opportunities; fishery management options; and to share out how current processes like the Harvest Round Table, SFAC actually work. In other words, get the facts on the table and refocus on solutions instead of wasting time in unproductive banter. From there everyone can do whatever lobbying they want to provide DFO with input in what ever form suits them best. Still putting a finer point on the agenda, topics, guest speakers. I'm sure there will be further announcements from the organizations sponsoring the event once details are fully developed.
 
Somass River Escapement Bulletin
Observations to October 13, 201


OBSERVATIONS:

The Stamp Falls fishway counters have been operational since September 6. Since their inception, cumulative escapement through Stamp Falls is about 13,600 adult chinook, 22,400 adult coho, and 100 adult sockeye. Note that cumulative escapement includes: (1) night-time counts; and (2) salmon which migrated past Stamp Falls prior to operating the counters as estimated from the snorkel survey from the Great Central Lake dam to the Stamp Falls fishway on September 6. Daily escapement counts since the last bulletin ranged between about 320 and 550 adult chinook, as well as 90 and 430 adult coho. Adult sockeye daily escapement since the last bulletin has been negligible. The counters were shut down temporarily due to power supply issues between September 29 and October 1. Compared to past years, Stamp Falls water level is moderate (1.39 m), and temperature is moderate (14°C). Currently, salmon escapement in the Stamp River appears to be unimpeded.
Note: Salmon escapement estimates in this bulletin are preliminary, based on an initial digital video review.
.....................................................................

Just over half of the required spring escapement. Now past mid-October. No way in Hell the numbers will ever be realized this year. Guess we can look forward to Conservation Closures 4 and 5 years down the line - due to "Ocean Conditions" again of course...
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Nog
 
Thanks Nog, lets see what happens in next few weeks with this higher water. I'm not saying its a good situation, just suggesting we need the facts then look at what can be done constructively to deal with what we have. I would rather see us find ways to get the most production out of what fish we get back, than poke each other with pointed sticks for the fun of it. We can't control the past, but we can learn from it...so lets get a handle on what went wrong, what the impact was, and figure out what needs to happen in future.
 
I think that is not enough population. 13,600 adult chinook probably 6800 or less for the females. One female carry about 5000 eggs. Egg approx 34,000,000
probably about 15 million salmon fry and adult chinook will return in 4 or 5 years about 10,000 or less.
 
What you wrote Searun, is exactly the train that we all need to be on. Moving forward, there is only tomorrow and today, we all need to take some time to reevaluate our positions and then work together in order to make some deep, meaningfull commitments to one another in order to help develop a fresh revitalized approach to ensure abundance and fair catch share. Sometimes it's better to let fish live, than to try and kill every last swimmer that there is. Every sector is guilty of greed. It's a human emotion, it is attached to an action that can be changed by working together. If all people could simply see beyond their own needs and help to develop a plan that would ensure fish for the future prior to taking what they think is theirs to exploit, then perhaps we'd all get along much better in the future.

lollypop
Lets call a spade a spade.
The Alberni FN groups were allocated 1900 chinook to havest in a COMMERCIAL fishery.
They KNOWINLY harversted 11 000

Sorry, but No counting error, even if Grade 3 math was involved would make this mistake accidently.
 
Somass River Escapement Bulletin
Observations to October 21, 2012


OBSERVATIONS:

The Stamp Falls fishway counters have been operational since September 6. Since their inception, cumulative escapement through Stamp Falls is about 14,700 adult chinook, 23,800 adult coho, and 100 adult sockeye. Note that cumulative escapement includes: (1) night-time counts; and (2) salmon which migrated past Stamp Falls prior to operating the counters as estimated from the snorkel survey from the Great Central Lake dam to the Stamp Falls fishway on September 6. Daily escapement counts since the last bulletin ranged between about 20 and 630 adult chinook, as well as 20 and 640 adult coho. Adult sockeye daily escapement since the last bulletin has been negligible. The counters were shut down temporarily due to power supply issues between September 29 and October 1. Compared to past years, Stamp Falls water level is moderate (1.87 m), and temperature is moderate (11°C). Currently, salmon escapement in the Stamp River appears to be unimpeded.
Note: Salmon escapement estimates in this bulletin are preliminary, based on an initial digital video review.

"About"??
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Somass River Escapement Bulletin
Observations to October 21, 2012


OBSERVATIONS:

The Stamp Falls fishway counters have been operational since September 6. Since their inception, cumulative escapement through Stamp Falls is about 14,700 adult chinook, 23,800 adult coho, and 100 adult sockeye. Note that cumulative escapement includes: (1) night-time counts; and (2) salmon which migrated past Stamp Falls prior to operating the counters as estimated from the snorkel survey from the Great Central Lake dam to the Stamp Falls fishway on September 6. Daily escapement counts since the last bulletin ranged between about 20 and 630 adult chinook, as well as 20 and 640 adult coho. Adult sockeye daily escapement since the last bulletin has been negligible. The counters were shut down temporarily due to power supply issues between September 29 and October 1. Compared to past years, Stamp Falls water level is moderate (1.87 m), and temperature is moderate (11°C). Currently, salmon escapement in the Stamp River appears to be unimpeded.
Note: Salmon escapement estimates in this bulletin are preliminary, based on an initial digital video review.

"About"??
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:( :( sad
 
Here you go, latest status. Appears plenty of spawners for hatchery brood. Not quite as bad as feared. The "exact" count numbers quoted, so no guess work, no conspiracy. Only issue remaining is how many fish spawned in the river and how many out migrating smolts will this ultimately contribute? Once again, time for us to re-focus on understanding what happened in the fishery this season, determine how things went wrong and why, then determine what needs to be done to ensure we do not have a repeat over harvest situation. I agree - ALL sectors must be accountable for their harvest, but my point is we all need to ultimately work together to make the best of a not good situation this year. Too late to be Monday morning quarterbacks, that won't change anything this season. About the only thing to be gained from looking back is gaining insight on what not to do again next season.

Great Central Lake dam, Somass River flows and Fish
October 19, 2012, no conference call, updates provided via e-mail

Larry Cross, Catalyst
Carol Schmitt, Omega
Steve Emmonds, Robertson Creek Hatchery
Margaret Wright, DFO

Communication objective is to share real time information about the status of water and fish in the Somass watershed.

GCL level/Somass flow - Larry Cross

I pulled the row of logs today (Friday), rather than waiting till Monday, in response to yesterday’s rains. So the Stamp River level has increased to 6.5 feet (about 75 cms) from the combination of rains and stop logs.

So we are now at 3 stop logs / bay which is about where we want to be for late October.

Hatchery chinook brood collection - Steve Emmonds

Water level in river is high and temperature about 12.6C
We have in holding enough chinook for our egg targets.
I see chinook swimming by; the chinook that were just outside of my fence, waiting to come into the hatchery have left; presumably to spawn up the river.
Chinook at the Stamp Dam are actively swimming up the fish ladder into GCL.

Escapement - Jeff Till

We did get a bit of a bump of fish with the rains.
Up to the end of Oct 16 we have:
14498 CN Ad
2044 CN Jk
23622 COAd
2384 COJk

River level was up to about 1.72m at the Falls. Enough that we were able to pull the extension off our micro hydro 'draft tube'. We also installed a new turbine and are producing significantly more power.
Last temperature is from the 14th and we have 13C.

Juvenile stranding - Carol Schmitt

The lake has come up a substantial amount, which will give a bit of reprieve for fish still stranded. The creeks are reaching the lake. Sockeye have moved in to Camp 9 Beach for spawning.
Also seen a few Chinook doing their annual swim by.

As I record the rain up at our hatchery, we may want to do a comparison between our and Larry/Steve’s amount to see if we get more rain up here.

Recommended actions:

Status quo; fish are moving well and dam is being operated to rule curve. Please forward any observations/issues to Margaret if they come up. No further conference calls anticipated.
 
... Appears plenty of spawners for hatchery brood. Not quite as bad as feared...

While I Applaud and indeed Admire your Optimism there searun, I ain't quite buying in to the "Everything's Ducky" line quite yet.
The noted escapement of chinook adults (14498) is still basically 10 Thousand SHY of meeting the Egg Target Requirements for this system. And while the hatchery personnel note they are "holding enough chinook for our egg targets.", we both recognize that number represents the bare minimum to meet those egg targets. Egg targets btw that have been subject to reduction after reduction over the past decade.

I have been up to the hatchery, and seen the holding springs. While they may have enough to meet today's greatly reduced standard, the fish overall are very much on the "small" size, and the holding tanks look damn near empty compared to a "decent" year. The numbers that were holding out side of the fence were the lowest I have ever seen - the Lagoon was damn near empty, and that trend continues up and down the system on the various spawning reaches. I walked a great many of these, and in areas that you usually can not even see the river bed due to the numbers of spawning springs, there are but a handful at each site.

What happened this year was a Travesty. However I STRONGLY Agree that we MUST "determine what needs to be done to ensure we do not have a repeat over harvest situation." I sense there will be No Accountability from either The Dino nor those who participated in the commercial fishery that wantonly slaughtered exponentially more than their allotment. As difficult as it is to me to accept that, IF we actually do manage to instill a system of checks and balances that will prevent future over-harvests (especially of such Magnitude!) then just perhaps something somewhat beneficial may come from the whole Fiasco. While I strongly support such targeted action, given the history here, I won't be holding my breath...

I would have loved to be front and center at the upcoming Open House in November, but with an active Moose LEH and some serious long-term plans in the works for that particular timing, I won't be able to. I do wish you and the others who attend All The Best in working towards prevention of the long established "routine" of over harvests on our salmon stocks here.

To that end, I'd like to suggest a couple of points that should be considered for doing so:
- LIMIT the Number of Participants in any and all local fisheries;
- LIMIT the Areas they can operate in;
- LIMIT the Time they are allowed to fish;
- ENFORCE the Regulations regarding pre-opening Poaching;
- Monitor & ENFORCE the Harvest Limits as established;
- Impose Serious Fines and Equipment Seizures for those who choose to act outside of these confines.

None of that is Rocket Science. All of it can be attained, and should already have been in place had DFO been paying anything more than Lip Service to their job.

Again, Best Of Luck with moving forward. I can't help but think you (and the resource) are going to need it...

Cheers,
Nog
 
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