Will SOG be open 2020?

As expected, sporty's haven't heard a peep from DFO or SFAB regarding ANYTHING to do with our Chinook !
Why is this?
Are we waiting for another in season announcement for 2020? The final nail in the coffin I guess.
 
You have not head anything because no one will know till the meetings coming up in the next few months.

Expect it tho to be the same as last year or worse.

I know the SFAB is pushing to have a hatchery opening In areas but who knows.

The final Fraser numbers are not in yet but the preliminary numbers show a decline from brood so still in decline.

Word is that Harrison wild stock return was poor and we could even see more measures to further reduce harvest.


Who knows tho
 
As expected, sporty's haven't heard a peep from DFO or SFAB regarding ANYTHING to do with our Chinook !
Why is this?
Are we waiting for another in season announcement for 2020? The final nail in the coffin I guess.

There will be opportunities to fish salmon, but you may have to look at being more mobile, and open to other areas. Truthfully way to early to say which way it will go. The odds are really against us with the Fraser slide etc.

On the plus inside VI saw surplus numbers of Chinook make it back to the rivers. That is a good thing. Cowichan, Puntledge, Qualicum systems were all very strong.

No one (DFO or SFAB) is withholding anything so you know. I encourage to make time to sit at your local SFAC spring meeting. I would expect the same this year, but as you know things can also change. It won't be an improvement if anything.

All I know as I wouldn't want to be in the Early timed Fraser Chinook funnel area, and any areas with extremely weak data. One thing SOG has good DNA data from Avid Anglers, and there is great deal of it.
 
Last edited:
Guess the real questions to ask is what has changed since last season? We will IMO see the same measures as 2019 unless we can achieve a few fundamental shifts in relationships with First Nations, and be able to demonstrate through science our capacity to plan fisheries that minimize encounters with stocks of concern so that all key stakeholders have confidence and trust we can deliver successfully. We also need to ask tough questions around the issues driving those 2019 measures, and be realistic about what can change and within what timeline that can be accomplished.

What are the main issues that propelled the 2019 management decisions?

Likely boils down to 3 main ones....
1. Big Bar Slide blocks upstream migration for some Interior Fraser Chinook stocks of concern
2. Stream-Type Chinook Abundance - ocean survival and adult recruitment are performing poorly - most CU's are listed under COSEWIC as Threatened or Endangered
3. FN's claim their FSC Chinook fisheries have been infringed upon, and unless they are fishing to whatever FSC actually means they will threaten legal action to close all recreational fisheries that might impact FSC rights

Big Bar:

Have we repaired the Big Bar slide and made it passable for migration? No.
Are we likely to see a change in 2020 that solves this where we are able to state with certainty the 2020 run will be able to successfully migrate? No
Will DFO managers be able to relax their current precautionary principle approach without knowing if the 2020 run will be able to successfully migrate beyond the slide? No

Stream-Type Chinook Abundance:

Is the outlook for marine survival for stream-type chinook going to improve in 2020? No
Has DFO been able to address productivity for Stream-Type Chinook? No
Did the Department take measurable actions to increase productivity (hatcheries, habitat, predator control)? No Is that likely to be achieved in the short term (3 to 5 years)? No
Did the Department show it was prepared to employ management measures such as MSF or Avoidance to carefully carve out fishing opportunity for the public fishery in 2019? No
Has there been active interest within the Department to more strongly consider MSF or Avoidance? Yes

FSC Rights:

Is the Department likely to proceed with allowing recreational Chinook fisheries and fight potential legal challenges? No (haven't yet)
Is the Department likely to continue the precautionary management approach and carry on with FSC restrictions in 2020? Yes
Will the courts continue to support FSC rights
If the Department proceeds with restrictions to FSC fisheries, will FN's likely continue to take position that no recreational fisheries can proceed if FSC rights are restricted? Yes
Would FN's consider alternative measures such as Avoidance and MSF as measures that do not infringe upon their FSC rights based fisheries? Unknown

Considering all this, it seems to me that our future fishery depends on being able to accomplish some core actions:

1. Achieve MSF as a management option that delivers confidence impacts to stocks of concern are acceptably low or insignificant.
2. Achieve Avoidance as a management option that is supported by FN's and DFO. This will require more support than we have achieve to date from within the Recreational sector in supplying CWT (hatchery heads), DNA sampling, Avid Angler catch logs and Guide/Lodge Logbooks - without robust data it is somewhat more challenging to determine areas and times where stocks of concern are not encountered, and where they are encountered where/when can you put in place fishery restrictions that reduce impacts to stocks of concern to acceptably low incidence.
3. Reach a level of working relationship with FN's where we can find ways to achieve FSC fisheries that do not impact stocks of concern, and also a level of trust and confidence in measures such as MSF and Avoidance as effective in not impacting FSC rights based fisheries.
 
Great summary

I think what also complicates the matter is the new tier 1 management that has now been integrated with First Nations. I believe this coming year will be the first year that that team is inplace.

We also have not seen the full fall out from the Five Nation supreme court decision. We have also not started the new allocation consultations. Also for years First Nations have been asking to replace FSC with a commercial harvest. This has been asked for in many areas many times for the option to sell FSC catch.

Our only real chance for change for this season was to boot the Liberals out and the people that voted for them knew more closures would be coming and our pie was going to be further allocated away. So it is what it is
 
Last edited:
The Allocation consultation process has already started, with ongoing meetings with participants to define terms of reference and narrow/define issues. Some great initial meetings with all key stakeholders in Lower Fraser, including FN's in effort to work together and see if we can achieve a functional process - perhaps similar to the Round Table process in place in a number of other Areas.

Far more to be gained by working together. I remain hopeful we can work through these issues and find meaningful ways we can achieve a balance between protective measures and workable solutions that mitigate fishery related encounters with stocks of concern that allow fishing opportunity.
 
2018 Chinook limit cut in half.
2019 Chinook closed until July15 and Yellow eye's completely closed to sport fishing coast wide. Commercial & FN stay open!
God knows what 2020 will bring for Chinook fishing???
2020 Prawns closed in our area until April1,this will give sportys a little over a month season before the Commercial sector opens & takes everything. AND limits reduced to 125. Commercial & FN have ZERO reduction!
Next on the chopping block is Sporty Tuna limits I hear. Commercials are saying the sport "fleet" are taking their fish!

As said in many other threads, sporty's are the low hanging fruit. Were treated like the red head step child, it needs to end!
Why doesn't sport fishing have lobbyist like the commercial sector?
I really don't understand....
 
2018 Chinook limit cut in half.
2019 Chinook closed until July15 and Yellow eye's completely closed to sport fishing coast wide. Commercial & FN stay open!
God knows what 2020 will bring for Chinook fishing???
2020 Prawns closed in our area until April1,this will give sportys a little over a month season before the Commercial sector opens & takes everything. AND limits reduced to 125. Commercial & FN have ZERO reduction!
Next on the chopping block is Sporty Tuna limits I hear. Commercials are saying the sport "fleet" are taking their fish!

As said in many other threads, sporty's are the low hanging fruit. Were treated like the red head step child, it needs to end!
Why doesn't sport fishing have lobbyist like the commercial sector?
I really don't understand....

WHY ??? Money, money , money ....
 
2018 Chinook limit cut in half.
2019 Chinook closed until July15 and Yellow eye's completely closed to sport fishing coast wide. Commercial & FN stay open!
God knows what 2020 will bring for Chinook fishing???
2020 Prawns closed in our area until April1,this will give sportys a little over a month season before the Commercial sector opens & takes everything. AND limits reduced to 125. Commercial & FN have ZERO reduction!
Next on the chopping block is Sporty Tuna limits I hear. Commercials are saying the sport "fleet" are taking their fish!

As said in many other threads, sporty's are the low hanging fruit. Were treated like the red head step child, it needs to end!
Why doesn't sport fishing have lobbyist like the commercial sector?
I really don't understand....


Even bigger would be lawsuits...we need to get some lawsuits going...that gets their attention.
 
2018 Chinook limit cut in half.
2019 Chinook closed until July15 and Yellow eye's completely closed to sport fishing coast wide. Commercial & FN stay open!
God knows what 2020 will bring for Chinook fishing???
2020 Prawns closed in our area until April1,this will give sportys a little over a month season before the Commercial sector opens & takes everything. AND limits reduced to 125. Commercial & FN have ZERO reduction!
Next on the chopping block is Sporty Tuna limits I hear. Commercials are saying the sport "fleet" are taking their fish!

As said in many other threads, sporty's are the low hanging fruit. Were treated like the red head step child, it needs to end!
Why doesn't sport fishing have lobbyist like the commercial sector?
I really don't understand....

How much have you donated to the few groups that have tried to get an affective advocacy going? Most anglers are cheap SOBs if its outside their boats and tackle boxes.
 
People on this forum 100% more active and donate more then most.

It’s reaching those that are not on forums or participating in discussions that’s hard.
 
Last edited:
WHY ??? Money, money , money ....
Nailed it....and, I would add - Very very few people in the rec sector actually do anything about it. If we did a poll asking everyone on here how many of them took the time to write a simple letter to the Minister in the last 12 months, I'm willing to bet my boat its likely less than 25%. How against the backdrop of that can we expect people to take an even bolder step of joining an organization and donating cash towards the cause? There are many who are generous with their time and money, but they are the exception not the norm.
 
Those god damn commercial trollers on the north coast caught all the Chinook, yah that must be it. They never get cut back or have any restrictions because they have a bunch of lobbyists in Ottawa. Oh but wait, their start date last summer when they could actually keep a chinook was AUGUST 20TH. Thats right, no retention of chinook until AUGUST 20TH. By that time 99.9% of the run has already swum by and a whole bunch of them are well up the river for christ sakes.
You guys are so used to crying about commies but you have NO IDEA whatsoever about the massive cuts that have taken place for them too.
The north coast trollers have already been informed by their area rep that there is a realistic chance that they will have NO SEASON at all this summer.
Apparently the lobbyists ( you guys are dreaming if you think they exist for anything other than Jimmy P ) are not getting the job done.
 
Last edited:
Those god damn commercial trollers on the north coast caught all the Chinook, yah that must be it. They never get cut back or have any restrictions because they have a bunch of lobbyists in Ottawa. Oh but wait, their start date last summer when they could actually keep a chinook was AUGUST 20TH. Thats right, no retention of chinook until AUGUST 20TH. By that time 99.9% of the run has already swum by and a whole bunch of them are well up the river for christ sakes.
You guys are so used to crying about commies but you have NO IDEA whatsoever about the massive cuts that have taken place for them too.
The north coast trollers have already been informed by their area rep that there is a realistic chance that they will have NO SEASON at all this summer.
As far as I can see the commies need to get lobbyists because they would love to have the minor restrictions that have been placed on the sporties.

Can't say for sure that it was because of the cut back for the North Coast trollers, but fishing in Banfield, Nitinat, Renfrew, Sooke and SOG was the best I have seen in years....when Sport Fishermen were finally allowed to fish.
 
Can't say for sure that it was because of the cut back for the North Coast trollers, but fishing in Banfield, Nitinat, Renfrew, Sooke and SOG was the best I have seen in years....when Sport Fishermen were finally allowed to fish.

Were you able to fish before Aug 20th?

I suspect DFO and the natives ( these appear to be one group these days ) were caught off guard by the good fishing everybody had once they got on the water. If I was to place a bet I would suspect further restrictions are coming.
 
Last edited:
Back
Top