Where to now?

Islandgirl

Well-Known Member
What we have had for the past few years has been...

A PM that supports Norweigen salmon farms in our waters, and the private ownership of Canada's Halibut

A fisheries minister that supports private ownership Canada's Halibut, individual transferable quota, and no interest in sportsfishing as being a fundamental right to a Canadian citizen.

A north island MP that has REFUSED to listen to the concerns of his constiuents and bring them forward to be addressed.

Now these people have a strong mandate to continue in the direction they have been heading.

Any idea's???
 
I hate to say it in a way (because of the amount of time, effort and $ it takes) but I agree with ThistledewII on this. We (the people) will need to take the Conservatives to court if we want them to change their stance on important fisheries issues (e.g. net pen fish farming, halibut allocation, common property fishing rights, DFO incompetance, etc.). They only understand power, they only respond to power, even more so now that they have their majority in government. Now we need to find some good lawyers, start some fundraising and/or get some partners with deep pockets (e.g. Bob Wright, et al). That's my 2 bits. :mad:
 
Bob Wright, last I spoke with him a couple of years ago, supports salmon farming. Tried to get him on board the WSA to no avail. Good on him for seeing me though.

I'm in for any action against the Fed to start putting long overdue resources back into Pacific salmon enhancement and habitat restoration and getting the salmon-farmers out of our waterways. It seems the Fed just don't get it.

I am of the firm opinion that investment of public funds into salmon enhancement/conservation/habitat restoration initiatives will pay huge dividends in years to come. So many things - besides people - depend on Wild Salmon.

Harper needs to be convinced of this, soon!
 
What we have had for the past few years has been...

A PM that supports Norweigen salmon farms in our waters, and the private ownership of Canada's Halibut

A fisheries minister that supports private ownership Canada's Halibut, individual transferable quota, and no interest in sportsfishing as being a fundamental right to a Canadian citizen.

A north island MP that has REFUSED to listen to the concerns of his constiuents and bring them forward to be addressed.

Now these people have a strong mandate to continue in the direction they have been heading.

Any idea's???


Well, there is still one avenue to explore before the legal option. Duncan has promised to sit down with all sectors and to see if a compromise can be reached. We need to hold him to that. We have nothing to loose if its all smoke and mirrors, and a lot to gain if he does follow through on his promise. So how do we do it??
Since he specifically mentioned working with HIS constituents, it would seem that we need to put a workable sized committee together that comprises guides, tin boat fisherpersons, lodges and fishing suppliers .

It should not get too caught up on where the committee members are located on the north island either. We should also make sure that we have a VERY strong connection to the south island halibut anglers as they have many of the resources and knowledge that will be needed to counter the commercials who will object to every suggestion we put forward.

The SFACs from the north Island are the logical place to start putting a committee together, so that we can speak with ONE voice.... Comments and other ideas? Time frame??

From the CR Mirror:

Duncan, meanwhile, expects to return to the House of Commons “very soon” and is ready to get back to work.

“I don’t know what my role will be,” said Duncan, who was Minister of Indian Affairs in the previous government. “But there are some obvious issues I want to deal with. Because we have half of the B.C. coastline in this riding, there’s always marine issues and fisheries issues and we have an environmental review process going on at Raven Coal Mine (near Fanny Bay).”

Duncan said he wants to work with the forest sector, which he says is on the rebound, and make some investments in the riding. He also said he has been mandated by Prime Minister Stephen Harper to work on a B.C. solution to the halibut allocation issue.

“It’s something I said I would do and I will be dedicating significant time and priority to that issue,” said Duncan.
 
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And guys, if we need a voice right in Ottawa, minus the summer months, I'm there from Sept to April, and more than willing to hand deliver or talk to Duncan on any of these issues, while young I feel I am decently well versed on the issues at hand and more than willing to help in any possible way.
 
Great idea C.L. to from a committee to HOLD duncan to his promises.
It should include working/fishing commercial fishermen as Holmes said, if any of them are willing. The individual ownership of fish is not working for anyone other than a few slipper skippers.

Can you get the ball rolling on this?
I think it would be good if you sat on the committee with your background.
Thumbs up on Nog too if he is willing.

With halibut closures possibly coming mid August OR sooner (from SFAB meeting minutes april 02/03) getting this going ASAP is important. Parliament normally has a 3 month summer recess..
 
Sure- I have already contacted the head of the area 14 SFAC to suggest we start talking to other SFAC committees on the north island. Areas 14, 13, 12 and 25. Did I miss any?

It may well turn out that the SFACs take a somewhat of a lesser role if it is felt that the Sport Fish Coalition will be more effective. For 10 years DFO has been ignoring the SFAB suggestions on halibut and the Coalition CAN be more forceful than the SFAB can be under their mandate.

I have also been talking to Governor and, as part of the Coalition, he can give us some guidance too-- same as Nogg.

But those guys will need some feedback from us too, so be prepared to speak up everyone.

As far as commercial representation-- I am willing to bet that the PHMA already has one of their members lined up. Stay tuned!!
 
Great Work C.L.
Thanks for taking the lead.
Loosing our RIGHT to fish is TOO important to many of us to sit back and let it happen!

Our right to go out and fish, keep a hali, a few prawns or oysters is something that I know we are going to have to fight Very Hard to keep!

It is easier to fight to keep our rights than have to fight to get them back ..IMHO!
 
If we are looking for a political solution to this problem why in the world would we want commercial halibut fisherman onboard. This is all about the average Joe losing his access to halibut. We get our fair access back and let the commercial suck up the dregs. I suggest we find someone that knows how to negotiate with politicians. We need a strategy and a common principal that we can all get behind. It has to be basic so the public and the politicians can understand. Keep it simple and refrain from using pet names like “Slipper Skipper”

And the most important thing is to keep this private. I don’t play poker but it seems to me that you don’t show your cards while you play the game.

GLG
 
GLG;
i believe the best way to find a solution here is to sit with other stakeholders and work out a "made in bc answer". you can take this to court and tie it up for the next 10-20 years or we sit together and find a fix. I also think that it is time to make some changes. the commercials have made huge changes in their fishery in monitoring, accountability and fleet size. If we are expecting to sustain 300,000 participants on this coast with no enhancement, and no real habitat restoration in the near future, than that leaves only a few options.
 
Where exactly does the commercial enterprise fit in with a public resource? Should the publics needs be meet before the commercial sector exports the bulk out of the country for profit. How do you reconcile your need for money against my need for food? When I go fishing, and catch a fish, is see a wonderful creature that will feed my family with healthy food. You sir, see dollar bills coming over the side.
GLG
 
Where exactly does the commercial enterprise fit in with a public resource? Should the publics needs be meet before the commercial sector exports the bulk out of the country for profit. How do you reconcile your need for money against my need for food? When I go fishing, and catch a fish, is see a wonderful creature that will feed my family with healthy food. You sir, see dollar bills coming over the side.
GLG

Where exactly does your "need" for food end? 5 fish 10 fish 20fish... are your trying to feed your neighbours, friends, extended family. Do I think a local resident here in bc should have reasonable access to the fish on this coast....yes. Do I think every Canadian should be able to come to bc and take what they want and go home.... with limitations. Do I think the yanks that come here with full fuel tanks and a full fridge sit off hardy and ship fish home through hardy boys so they can continue to fish should have unlimited access.... not a fricken chance.
 
Where exactly does your "need" for food end? 5 fish 10 fish 20fish... are your trying to feed your neighbours, friends, extended family.
Matter of fact, I am trying to feed my family and friends. I have sisters that appreciate getting a few pieces of fish ever now and then. Heck they like it so much they even go buy it in the grocery store. Sadly at 17 bucks a pound it’s only for special occasions. Wouldn’t it be funny if it came from your boat? Yep you bet I bring a piece or two over to the old lady across the street. She doesn’t speak very good English but I know she needs it. It can’t be easy living on a military widow’s pension. You see its part of my heritage to hunt and fish and to share it with my family and neighbours. It’s been like that in my family for hundreds of years in this country. I suspect it’s the same way in your family, part of your heritage too.
Do I think a local resident here in bc should have reasonable access to the fish on this coast....yes. Do I think every Canadian should be able to come to bc and take what they want and go home.... with limitations.

Well we almost agree on this. Except I don’t see any difference between someone from BC and someone from anywhere else in Canada. Are you saying we are special Canadians and should have special privileges based on our postal code? I don’t get that concept. Perhaps because you have lived the life of the “selected few quota holders” it’s something only you understand. As for limitations, I’m all for that, how about two per day and four in possession with the season as it was before.
Do I think the yanks that come here with full fuel tanks and a full fridge sit off hardy and ship fish home through hardy boys so they can continue to fish should have unlimited access.... not a fricken chance.

No worries there as that would be against the law and our neighbours down south respect our rules. If you know of some shady operators I’m sure DFO would be happy to investigate. They don’t take kindly to poachers, local or visitors.


You commercial fishermen should be harvesting to help feed the people of this country. I have no problem with that. I do have a problem when I am reduced on my allowable catch and you are exporting the vast majority of the fish out of the country. You see the needs of Canadians are not being meet with that situation. After all it’s the Canadian peoples resource not your private domain. Magna Carta settled that question long ago

GLG
 
Well put GLG. I agree completely, and on the same note. A handful of halibut charters pulls in more income than one damn commercial boat does for our economy, especially for those of us who live on the west coast. They have proved this 12 years ago when we had to defend against the commercial boys trying to get the first strike on Springs/Coho before they opened retention for the rest of us. The guilds out here bring in a ton of revenue to a few of us small business operators, and in more ways than most people would think of. Tourism is a huge part of our economy on the west coast and if this Halibut issue isn't taken seriously it could be more damaging than worrying about a few of us sporties filling our freezers.
 
so i am assuming then that you feel every canadaian should have unlimited access to every canadian resource then. Free oil from the sands, free lumber, free fish, free gold......... where do i sign up.
 
so i am assuming then that you feel every canadaian should have unlimited access to every canadian resource then. Free oil from the sands, free lumber, free fish, free gold......... where do i sign up.

In a way yes.

We are the biggest subsidizer of most resources in Canada. We subsidize Nat Gas, Hydro, Oil, Lumber and the list goes on. It is a fact that people pay less for Nat gas in California than up here in BC, although the gas comes from here, same as hydro.

But even the fish are not free. There is no way that a fish caught in BC is worth $17/lbs, but folks do pay it, because that is what subsidizes the owners and processers so they can sell it cheaper outside the country. Yes it is supply and demand, but if there was more supply of the same amount of commercial caught fish for Canadians, then prices would be much cheaper. It is the same BS as lobster.

I do find it funny that you would compare a nat resourse like fish to timber, oil and other Nat resourses. If you were to dig a little deeper you would find that there is permits you can get, that are free, to pan for FREE gold (hell you can even set up a sluice box for a few dollars), you can have a FREE mineral claim that can cover hundreds of ha, cut FREE lumber, fence posts or firewood, even provide your own energy. So why not for another common resourse....fish?????

You are barking way up the wrong tree on this comparison.

Islandgirl, sorry to hijack your thread. I will wait and see what answers come about, but will get it back on topic.

Cheers

SS
 
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GLG,

I think that fish4all has a valid point in inviting commercial fisherman to the table against the DFO on the halibut issue. Before all of you bite my head off and think I've gone to the dark side let me explain.

I personally do not have an issue with the commercial fisherman who are actually fishing for halibut. We all have a problem with the slipper skippers and the gifting of public Canadian resources to select individuals. In this regard we are trying to get the quota adjusted more equitably to 80/20.

It is actually in the best interest of the commercial fisherman actively involved in the harvesting to eliminate or at the least reduce the involvement of slipper skippers and the lease-back of the fishing rights. By removing quota from the SS's, and redistributing the allocation to both sport and commercial fishermen, everyone benefits.

We get the increased quota we want without buying in to the Experimental Halibut BS proposed by the Feds and the Hard working Commercial guys do not have to buy quota, thereby increasing profits by not paying lease fees while catching fewer fish. It's a mathematical issue of balancing the economical benefits to both parties. In this manner we all get our needs met, are all on the same side, and are approaching the Feds as a united front against the Slipper Skippers. If we are able to approach the Feds in this fashion they cannot apply "divide and conquer" tactics as we are all in agreement of making this system work.

Now we are talking about two industries and the public working against the inequitable favouritism to under 300 people. Now you can get the general public on our side. As long as it is us against them, with the risk of financial loss to those that are actually performing the service in the industry, we are at a disadvantage in arguing the case to the Feds. I don't think you would get an argument out of any commercial fishers if you were presenting a plan that protected their investment and livelihoods while at the same time totally benefitted the sporting sector.

I do not understand why there is so much resistance to this idea on here. As far as I'm concerned Anyone that is against the Slipper Skippers and the Feds/DFO should be welcomed in the fight from our side. It makes economic sense, mathematical sense, and political sense.

Going to Parliament with a plan supported by both industries and the general public has a way better chance of receiving the attention it deserves to have the change made. As far as compensation to the Slipper Skippers for the lost quota, they don't deserve any. They were Given the resource at no up front cost and have profited from it since its introduction. They have already received more than fair compensation. If they want to maintain quota it should be up to them to BUY it. Not us or the Commies that actually do the work on behalf of the Canadian consumers. Most of these guys have ample money to purchase quota back as an investment anyway and more than likely it was their political financial support and glad-handing that got them the quota in the first place.

If the general public in Canada doesn't support a ratification like this, and is prepared to accept a government that hands over the country's resources in exchange for political favours, then we truly are lost as a culture as far as our rights go.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, "The enemy of my enemy is my friend". Until we are prepared to work in this fashion, the odds of a win for our side are reduced. IMHO.
 
B.B. you and I are from the same school of thought on this one, guess that puts me there with fish4all, at least on this issue.
 
Hello, did you all forget why we are at the % we are?
That is due to the Commercial sector and their paid lobbyist's.
They still are using them and guess how they are paid for, through halibut sales.

So, the commercial group is not interested in discussing this. Certainly not the ones in power.
Fish4all is not in power.
 
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