Great memories of fishing on the "red docks"!
Upset about the Chinook Closures? What to do next?
- Thread starter cohochinook
- Start date
tincan
Well-Known Member
I am pissed off about the decision to close chinook retention in the way that DFO did as well. However, as mentioned in the Pacific Angler letter, the non-retention measures are not to 'reallocate chinook from rec/comm to FN" as has been stated here. Rather, the shutting down of the commercial troll and rec fishing retention is the requirement needed in order to make sure there are no nets in the river prior to July 15th, a date which the majority of these stocks of concern will have reached their respective spawning grounds. Based on the data I've seen the rec sector takes a very small single digit (if that) % of these stocks of concern. The commercial troll fleet also has a small % of these stocks in their catch. The larger impact on these Fraser stocks of concern comes from the terminal fisheries in river by FN fisheries.
Based on the priority of access to chinook ....
1) conservation (constitutionally protected)
2) FN FSC, etc. (constitutionally projected)
3) Rec Sector
4) Commerical troll.
... and hearing from some of the FN groups that IF the rec guys or commercial had any access to these early fraser stocks that they would go ahead with their constitutionally protected right to FSC fisheries, the DFO made their decision to essentially screw over the south coast rec sector AND the commercial troll fleet in order to ensure that FN fisheries would not go ahead until July 15th. Restricting FN fisheries is not as easy as restricting rec or commercial ones... from a legal perspective at least. I don't agree with the decision. I don't have confidence in the monitoring and enforcement in the decision. However, I do see this as a way DFO could explain their decision.
Rec fishers has good reason to be angry over this decision. But to say (as some have claimed) that the rec sector is being shut down to reallocate chinook to FN or commercial is not accurate. All sectors (rec, FN, commercial) are being curbed hard in this decision. I am fully on board with fighting back to help provide access to sustainable fishing for all sectors but we (as the rec sector) need to understand that it doesn't help our cause/credibility when we say things that clearly aren't supported by our Canadian laws of the best available science.
Based on the priority of access to chinook ....
1) conservation (constitutionally protected)
2) FN FSC, etc. (constitutionally projected)
3) Rec Sector
4) Commerical troll.
... and hearing from some of the FN groups that IF the rec guys or commercial had any access to these early fraser stocks that they would go ahead with their constitutionally protected right to FSC fisheries, the DFO made their decision to essentially screw over the south coast rec sector AND the commercial troll fleet in order to ensure that FN fisheries would not go ahead until July 15th. Restricting FN fisheries is not as easy as restricting rec or commercial ones... from a legal perspective at least. I don't agree with the decision. I don't have confidence in the monitoring and enforcement in the decision. However, I do see this as a way DFO could explain their decision.
Rec fishers has good reason to be angry over this decision. But to say (as some have claimed) that the rec sector is being shut down to reallocate chinook to FN or commercial is not accurate. All sectors (rec, FN, commercial) are being curbed hard in this decision. I am fully on board with fighting back to help provide access to sustainable fishing for all sectors but we (as the rec sector) need to understand that it doesn't help our cause/credibility when we say things that clearly aren't supported by our Canadian laws of the best available science.
ziggy
Well-Known Member
I’m confused as to why if the reason for the closure is to keep nets out of the river until July 15, why my area remains closed until July 31st? Doesn’t really add up!
wildmanyeah
Crew Member
Its actually not, The process we have to deal with conservation is the SARA process and for that "social and economical reason" trump conservation as will see with the chum fishery taken place doing the IFS steelhead migration.
So you can tell the future and will be taking part in the inseason negotiations with the fraser river first nations? This chapter has yet to be written
The relocation will also come more apparent when this fishery opens back up and FN have access but we won't.
There are already FN gil net opening for Chinook this month. How does that Fit into your view of the world? Not saying you’re wrong or what, just need to understand how these recent FN openings align with This theory?
Islander57
Well-Known Member
I question that I have been wondering, is; does the retention limit dropping from 30 to 10 have an affect on those who make their living through the sport fishery? Or does this just affect those who are looking to fill up the freezer?
fogged in
Well-Known Member
[QUOTE="tincan, post: 927547, member: 576" make sure there are no nets in the river prior to July 15th, a date which the majority of these stocks of concern will have reached their respective spawning grounds. .[/QUOTE]
I agree with most of your post, but the idea of closing the Chinook fishery until July 15 or Aug. 1, depending on the area, is to get the Chinook to the River
If you are going to make any gains, ALL Fraser River fisheries need to be closed much longer.
Like, NO CHINOOK SALMON HARVEST IN THE RIVER ALL SEASON!
I agree with most of your post, but the idea of closing the Chinook fishery until July 15 or Aug. 1, depending on the area, is to get the Chinook to the River
If you are going to make any gains, ALL Fraser River fisheries need to be closed much longer.
Like, NO CHINOOK SALMON HARVEST IN THE RIVER ALL SEASON!
gon fishin
Active Member
I could be wrong but . If DFO said that there was to be no fishing in the Fraser river and somebody on this forum said they saw nets in the river. Would those people with the nets in the river not be poaching . And if they were poaching would it not be our responsibility to call the poacher hot line.And if everyone that saw that action called every time they saw it Could that not amount to a ton of calls that could not ignored by DFO or am I dreaming I for one would be happy to call every single day Also would that poaching action be news worthy
fogged in
Well-Known Member
Go for it...I only wish I lived in an area to help with photo's.
Be sure to post your observations and photo's
Jencourt
Well-Known Member
Funny you would post this. I just jumped on to ask what it is that some of you would be protesting. Then I read this.
I know what you are saying . At face it is all very legit and all bases have been covered by the minister.
By you saying this is not a reallocation I respectfully think you are confused between what has been done and why, as it compares to what will take place and what it will end up becoming.
You are very correct in stating that DFO has followed the law and that in order to keep FN off they first must keep us off.
The trade off that was made was that we could continue with a “non retention “ instead of full closure, and FN would continue to have limited FSC openings.
So, yes you are also correct from a point of law and technically it is not a reallocation.
Let us not all forget that we also took a 50% reduction of daily limits in much of the east coast VI approaches last year and it will continue. Also no fin-fish areas in south areas. To add we have now bin hit with a 66% percent cut on our allowable annual limit. Whether one feels 10 is enough or 30 was way too many or not, It was a 66% reduction in allowable take. Worth mentioning the troll fleet has lost the entire spring quota. I suspect that will never be made up in the late summer opener.
I would suggest that those few things alone equate to a reallocation as our access to what we are allowed starts as the supposed FN reductions come to an end. The commercial troll later than that .
This all has worked out very well for the minister as he was able to make these restrictions that create huge ramifications, thus giving the appearance of doing a significant amount of good for the fish.
It also allowed him to appease the ENGO groups by removing retention for well over half of our traditional spring/summer season. Combine that with the sabotage of the troll fleets spring season and this is significant.
It also worked out as he was able to tell everyone that FN fishing during the non retention will be very minimal .
Then it worked out for the portion of FN that will continue to fish as much, wen ever, and where they please.
We will see at a very minimum these same regs for at least 5 years as stated by the minister. I would expect longer and likely heavier, or more closures.
History has shown that a portion of the Fraser FN do not believe they need to comply and they will fish. Make no mistake. A good portion of the small percentage we will contribute to entering the river will meet the fate of gill nets and black market sales.
Combine all these cuts (that are so easily justified) and the public fishery and commercial troll fleets allocation of Chinook looks significantly different than it did a short time ago. Hence we have the reallocation that is not a reallocation.
I stated above that the minister was able to appease the NGO. This is only true to a point.
Make no mistake the ENGO see this as a half measured beginning The notice was not even public yet and some where crying foul and said it must be a closure. Not non retention. They then immediately went after catch and release as is some FN and others I am told.
These actions taken by the minister are about things that reach far beyond the early timed upper Frazer Chinook and SRKW.
This is my take after taking time to consider the ton of stuff that I have read and has been said by many who are far more knowledgeable in all this than I.
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cohochinook
Well-Known Member
Great summary of what transpired! This is why I feel we need a protest!
So after july 15....all of the Fraser stocks will get absolutely **** kicked and netted out even worse than in years pasts.
Sweet..on a **** sockeye year and a year where the returning Thompson Chinook stock got hammered on in 2014 the river will be wall to wall nets so DFO can appease special interest. Absolute ******** as usual, with conservation only after thought once the runs go extinct.
On the bright side....I would be more than happy to stay off the water all year if there actually was NO netting.
Then magically when the 2019 brood returns come back in a few years we will have strong runs again.
Weird strong returns happen after no netting. Who would have thought!
Will be at the rally and **** DFO
Sweet..on a **** sockeye year and a year where the returning Thompson Chinook stock got hammered on in 2014 the river will be wall to wall nets so DFO can appease special interest. Absolute ******** as usual, with conservation only after thought once the runs go extinct.
On the bright side....I would be more than happy to stay off the water all year if there actually was NO netting.
Then magically when the 2019 brood returns come back in a few years we will have strong runs again.
Weird strong returns happen after no netting. Who would have thought!
Will be at the rally and **** DFO
Aces
Well-Known Member
Yes but you know it’s nearly impossible to stop the netting. We tried for many years to try and save the Thompson Steelhead but there were too many of them.
littlechucky
Crew Member
Even if it can’t be stopped, I would be good if it became public knowledge what is going on so the blame can be put in the right place.
fishin solo
Crew Member
This is huge and needs to be videoed and put on the news and every social media outlet across Canada. ALL Canadians need to know what’s going on and what’s happened to our coast.
scott craven
Well-Known Member
A protest will get us nothing, a protest fishery might bring it to the forefront.
pick a day, all area's , any day that people can fish,and kill one fish per person.
mark them on your license as a protest against the regulations.
Make it known this will happen to DFO.
The people that get busted take it on the chin.
It will soon be known that the rec. fishing community have backbone and won't be
steamrolled.
