the popemobile is getting tired

[Thunder21]

I have a 17’ center console like this with the same problem. It’s an older hull and when we repowered with a 115 Yamaha the scuppers sat a hair above water. Any weight in the back and water would make its way into the boat, then some would get into the bilge below deck which would drop the scuppers even lower. First night it went in the water overnight it almost sank. We just welded ours shut but that’s not the solution you want obviously . It’s hard on small boats to have a properly functioning self bailing deck and still keep some freeboard. I had a bunch of solutions typed out but they are all band aids really. They worked for me but my entire package with the newer Yamaha was like 13k so not a big deal if it isn’t perfect. You need that same boat but with 6 inch taller sides and a deck that sits very high above the water. Those little boats are really affected by weight. If you are fishing riggers you could have two guys at the back plus a bunch of gear.

 

[tubber]

post 145 has a picture of the stern.
It's a great boat. Hopefully an engineer can calculate the amount of flotation a wider (and longer?) pod can provide. Ideally the builder can salvage the existing one for another project.
Meanwhile shuffle some lead or sandbags to the bow and see how many big-boned friends it takes to put the scuppers under.

 

[advTHXance]

You need that same boat but with 6 inch taller sides and a deck that sits very high above the water.

Im afraid youre probably right.

 

[Bifmalibu]

Damn. That's not the fairytale ending I hoped to enjoy when I clicked this thread. I have followed it from day one and have marvelled at the craftsmanship of the builder. I'm very sorry it's going this way for you advTHXance. I wish the best for you and the builder as this is resolved. I feel you are leaning this way already, but please don't compromise because he has done a fine job. He will learn from this one, just as we all do from out mistakes in life. Best of luck.

 

[advTHXance]

post 145 has a picture of the stern.
It's a great boat. Hopefully an engineer can calculate the amount of flotation a wider (and longer?) pod can provide. Ideally the builder can salvage the existing one for another project.
Meanwhile shuffle some lead or sandbags to the bow and see how many big-boned friends it takes to put the scuppers under.

It really is a great boat. I should have taken some pics of the finished interior because its really impressive. Its just that 1 major issue that I dont think I can get over. If somebody comes along that wants to buy it and have the scuppers sealed off that would be ideal, but I feel bad asking that of the builder. Hes been a pleasure to deal with and aside from the deck height the boat is literally a dream.

 

[advTHXance]

post 145 has a picture of the stern.
It's a great boat. Hopefully an engineer can calculate the amount of flotation a wider (and longer?) pod can provide. Ideally the builder can salvage the existing one for another project.
Meanwhile shuffle some lead or sandbags to the bow and see how many big-boned friends it takes to put the scuppers under.

The problem with shifting the weight around is that itll change the stance of the boat and the way it rides. Even if the pod can provide enough floatation to keep the stern deck dry (i doubt it), itll push the bow end down to compensate. Im not a boat engineer but I cant think of a good solution and ive thought about nothing but this since I talked to him on friday and he mentioned how it was sitting when he did a trial on the lake.

 

[Aquaholic]

This has been such an enjoyable thread, so it is not an easy read right now. I sincerely hope there is a path to a solution for you and the builder. This is a teachable moment to many of us. Naval architects have these calculations and design change solutions all in their systems to retain the original required floating specifications.

 

[scott craven]

I know you really want the self bailing deck, but you might be able to knock $3-5K
off the build by welding those scuppers shut.
Just a thought......

 

[advTHXance]

I know you really want the self bailing deck, but you might be able to knock $3-5K
off the build by welding those suppers shut.
Just ai thought......

The reason I chose to go with a custom aluminum and paid all this money is so I could have exactly what I wanted. The self bailing deck is pretty high on the list. Welding the scuppers shut would be a fine solution if somebody else wanted to buy it but I dont think its the solution for me

 

[Aces]

The reason I chose to go with a custom aluminum and paid all this money is so I could have exactly what I wanted. The self bailing deck is pretty high on the list. Welding the scuppers shut would be a fine solution if somebody else wanted to buy it but I dont think its the solution for me

Bang on! I wouldn't own a boat that wasn't self bailing

 

[RiverBoy]

this is such a crappy situation. i would try and keep things as friendly as possible with the builder and try to work with him. he’s probably just sick about this. he probably has a pretty good idea what he’s into it for as far as his labour is concerned. if you could somehow “raise the deck” and console etc as well as the bow rails, to make it truly “self bailing” it might be worth HIS while to do so and take the loss. you could save a big chunk of change. like, thousands. in the long run it’s gonna be waaaaay cheaper for him over building you a new sled.

having said that, you could go thru all that work and might still not be self bailing enough. i wouldn’t “settle” on my dream boat.

 

[advTHXance]

this is such a crappy situation. i would try and keep things as friendly as possible with the builder and try to work with him. he’s probably just sick about this. he probably has a pretty good idea what he’s into it for as far as his labour is concerned. if you could somehow “raise the deck” and console etc as well as the bow rails, to make it truly “self bailing” it might be worth HIS while to do so and take the loss. you could save a big chunk of change. like, thousands. in the long run it’s gonna be waaaaay cheaper for him over building you a new sled.

having said that, you could go thru all that work and might still not be self bailing enough. i wouldn’t “settle” on my dream boat.

The problem with raising the deck is then the gunnals are too low. Its opening a huge can of worms no matter what you do. Changing the floatation, or shifting weight around the boat will change the stance of the boat and how it performs. The more I think about it the more it seems like its not fixable aside from welding the scuppers shut and scrapping the self bailing deck.

My builder is a really nice guy, hes passionate about his job and he puts everything he has into his work. I feel awful about it and Im sure he does too. Hes a self-admitted perfectionist and Im the same way about certain things. Ive had a few sleepless nights lately and Im sure he has as well. Its just a ****** situation all around.

If you look at the bridgeviews and silverstreaks etc with self bailing decks, in hindsight its obvious to me that the sides are substantially higher and the deck sits substantially higher on the hull.

 

[Viking]

Just a idea. Take the main engine off. Refloat the boat and see how much higher it sits. Maybe a lighter kicker and main setup with the wider pod is the answer.
Crappy deal but there has to be a solution.

 

[Aces]

The problem with raising the deck is then the gunnals are too low. Its opening a huge can of worms no matter what you do. Changing the floatation, or shifting weight around the boat will change the stance of the boat and how it performs. The more I think about it the more it seems like its not fixable aside from welding the scuppers shut and scrapping the self bailing deck.

My builder is a really nice guy, hes passionate about his job and he puts everything he has into his work. I feel awful about it and Im sure he does too. Hes a self-admitted perfectionist and Im the same way about certain things. Ive had a few sleepless nights lately and Im sure he has as well. Its just a ****** situation all around.

If you look at the bridgeviews and silverstreaks etc with self bailing decks, in hindsight its obvious to me that the sides are substantially higher and the deck sits substantially higher on the hull.

I originally thought the gunnels were too low. What about cutting off the gunnels, weld in a section to raise the height of them then the floor could be raised

 

[advTHXance]

Just a idea. Take the main engine off. Refloat the boat and see how much higher it sits. Maybe a lighter kicker and main setup with the wider pod is the answer.
Crappy deal but there has to be a solution.

Realistically its gotta float a good 4 inches or so higher, maybe more. All the other self bailing decks ive looked at lately sit way out of the water. I dont think a couple more inches of pod and 50kg less motor is going to cut it.

 

[advTHXance]

I originally thought the gunnels were too low. What about cutting off the gunnels, weld in a section to raise the height of them then the floor could be raised

I had my suspicions when I first saw the boat in person but he assured me it would be good, so I quickly put that out of my mind. It wasnt until last friday when i spoke to him and he told me how it sat on his test drive that I really started to panic.

I dont want to spend 80k on a frankensteined boat. If he were to do that, which i wouldnt be happy with at all, he'd have to re-wrap it, redeck it, rip out the console and bench, redo the under gunnal storage, apply new nonslip paint, possibly rerun the wiring and cables, it opens a huge can of worms. Its a great boat as it is, its just not a self bailing deck.

 

[advTHXance]

I appreciate everybodys feedback a ton. Id like to keep this honest and realistic about what to do next without sounding like Im throwing my builder under the bus. He did an incredible job with everything else, but the deck is not functionally self bailing and I dont believe it can be made to be self bailing in a way that Ill be pleased with. As @Thunder21 said earlier, the gunnals need to be 6 inches higher all around to accomodate for a properly laid self bailing deck.

In a perfect world, somebody else will buy the boat he already built with the scuppers sealed off and he would build me one nearly exactly the same but with higher gunnals and a higher floor. I havent spoken to him since the sea trial yet, he wanted some time to talk to other builders and see what they think, and its all ive really thought about since. Obviously Im not a naval architect but I dont see a good fix for it that everybodys happy with.

 

[CIVANO]

You need to stand firm. He sells the current boat or eats it and you get the boat he told you he could make. period! If you fold and close the scuppers, you will be forever unhappy with the boat.
My take

 

[Fins -n- Skins]

What about just removable plugs for the scuppers ? I have seen this with boats that sit low in the back and water comes in and if your not wearing boots your feet get wet. Can remove the plugs anytime you want ? Or can he build the ping pong ball system like where water goes out but not in ? How much water are you really going to be taking over the bow and into the boat ? Not like its going to be taking on 20 gallons at a time..

 

[Lucky Streak]

It really is a great boat. I should have taken some pics of the finished interior because its really impressive. Its just that 1 major issue that I dont think I can get over. If somebody comes along that wants to buy it and have the scuppers sealed off that would be ideal, but I feel bad asking that of the builder. Hes been a pleasure to deal with and aside from the deck height the boat is literally a dream.

You need to stand firm. He sells the current boat or eats it and you get the boat he told you he could make. period! If you fold and close the scuppers, you will be forever unhappy with the boat.
My take

It's a very unfortunate situation. I have been following this build thread and what I understand is that you really did your homework before going with this builder to build your "forever" boat. I really don't think you should have to compromise by having the scuppers welded shut or having the boat modified at this point. Make this clear to the builder and be firm not forceful and I'm sure this will be resolved between you and the builder.
Plan and simple not many people would have a center console open boat without a self bailing deck. You shouldn't have to feel bad when you force that issue.