The orca famine and Puget Sound's poisoned rivers

Discussion in 'Conservation, Fishery Politics and Management.' started by porcupine, Dec 15, 2017.

  1. porcupine

    porcupine Active Member

  2. Dave

    Dave Well-Known Member

    Thanks for posting that, could explain a lot about poor chinook returns to the Fraser as well.
  3. wildmanyeah

    wildmanyeah Well-Known Member

    might as well add Victoria to the list. Dumping raw sewage right into the ocean.

    “The quickest way to end the orca famine would be to end the commercial and sports fisheries for chinook in the Salish Sea”

    Aka chinook closures coming to a town near you!
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2017
  4. Dave

    Dave Well-Known Member

    bones likes this.
  5. terrin

    terrin Well-Known Member

    Thanks Dave you beet me to it. All those smolts neede to make it past the farms too and most obviously don't.
  6. terrin

    terrin Well-Known Member

  7. IronNoggin

    IronNoggin Well-Known Member

    Of course the Pseudo-Scientist Suzuki calls for an immediate cessation of all fisheries - totally opposed to what the REAL Science is suggesting! Effing Goof!

    I do believe they may well have identified another parameter limiting salmon production in these areas.
    And good on them for doing so.
    Although I sincerely doubt that will result in any targeted action to resolve the matter.

    And even when recent studies well point out that seals and sea lions consume 65 % of the annual production of both chinook and coho in the gulf, I have even graver doubts anything at all will ever be done to address that. Even though it is obviously the quickest and surest method to increase these two salmon populations we could ever consider...

    SpringFever552 and bones like this.
  8. ziggy

    ziggy Well-Known Member

    I believe Victoria will be spending close to a billion on sewage treatment. Well not yet up and running it's a good and positive start. I often wonder though about septic fields on waterfront properties. Pat Bay is an example of a place closed for shellfish harvesting due to contamination. No sewer, but I'm guessing septic tanks are the problem?
  9. Fishmyster

    Fishmyster Active Member

    It is not just Puget sounds streams that have been poisoned. The symptoms are in almost every stream in North America. Toxicity has eliminated food web structure all over but because it has been brushed under the rug nobody on this site knows. So might as well keep blaming fish farms, first nation netters and seals! They are the most visible and well solicited entities and easiest to believe in for some.
    Some day it will be realized that poisoning and starvation will cause week immune systems and makes salmon prone to disease. Maybe another ten years or so. lol
    SpringFever552 and StirItUp like this.
  10. california

    california Well-Known Member

    It is an interesting article, and just one more factor likely affecting the survival rates along with warming, overfishing, habitat destruction, fish farms etc.

    One thing striking to me is the increase in Northern resident whales. While I understand the Northern Chinook stocks are in better shape, they have still experienced declines, just not to the extent southern chinook stocks have. If whale reproductive success is so tightly correlated with chinook stocks you might expect the Northern whale population to at best stay stable or show small increases, but it has doubled since 1990. Clearly there is something else going on besides chinook salmon numbers with them. They are thriving despite declining chinook stocks. This is one of the most intelligent species on earth, and adaptable in behaviour. Of all the animal species it doesn't seem like this would be one unable to adapt its diet and behaviour to changing conditions and prey abundance. I have read of Alaskan fisherman complaining about Orcas following their long line boats and helping themselves to the hooked Halibut and Black cod as they bring the lines up. I don't know if these are northern residents or Alaska residents, but these are whales that are willing to eat these species, not just Chinook salmon

    As with all things ecological, it may not be as simple as just the Chinook populations affecting the Orca populations, other factors are likely involved.
    StirItUp likes this.
  11. calmsea

    calmsea Well-Known Member

    The above article speaks about sewage treatment effluent into a river or estuary having a likely impact on salmon survival. Victoria sewage goes straight into the ocean and should therefore not be lumped into this category. Maybe this is one reason why sea penning hatchery salmon is so successful?
  12. bones

    bones Well-Known Member

    and here in vancouver the new sewage plant is being built to the lowest standard. for few more dollars they could just build a plant that treat....... Tertiary treatment. making the water in and aroundvancouver the best it can be.
  13. wildmanyeah

    wildmanyeah Well-Known Member

    Yep vancouverites are enviormental until it effects their pocket book.

    A few less bike lanes and a better water treatment plant could of been built.

    But it’s not fancy and the rest of the world can’t see it.
  14. california

    california Well-Known Member

    If Victoria and Seattle can fill the Ocean full of poop, a great city like Vancouver should be able to do it too!
  15. SpringFever552

    SpringFever552 Well-Known Member

    Here is just 1 example of what you speak and the work to bring the river back to life
  16. SpringFever552

    SpringFever552 Well-Known Member

    I cant think of 1 politician that would take on a "Nice furry critter cull" even if those #s were PROVEN to be near 100%
  17. wildmanyeah

    wildmanyeah Well-Known Member

    Not when we're hell bent on saving the ones even nature is trying to get rid of.

    “Most of the seals, when they come in, they’re emaciated, dehydrated and they’ve been separated from their moms for a variety of different reasons. So they’re really in need of care at that point,” said rescue centre manager Lindsaye Akhurst.
  18. Derby

    Derby Well-Known Member

    The science is slowly showing the dilemma that our furry friends and there ability to out compete the Local killer whales for food and are just one of the many problems for our local friends... if the science can and it will show this perhaps down the road u could see something done ...I believe this will be one the long term solutions but something will have to be done and matter of when it is ... as the science is now showing the exploding population of harbour seals is now linked to the disappearing steelhead population ......
  19. SpringFever552

    SpringFever552 Well-Known Member

    Lol yeah i know..bring them back to health only to release them back to the wild do it all over again..
    instead lets have a cull to stop the slow suffering from starvation..its the most humane thing to do.

    would have an immediate postive effect on salmon stocks if those reports are true and help those stupid starving, but unwilling to eat a seal, killer whales..sarcasm on the killer whale comment ;-)
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2017
  20. nicnat

    nicnat Active Member

    if only the resident orcas would evolve into the eating habits of the transients we would have our problem solved, lol. chinook salmon would thrive and the seal cull would be ongoing, now wouldn't that be a perfect solution. now all we have to do is train the transients to train the residents.

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