Salish sea seals eat 86% of smolts

I am no scientist, I am sure that there are many reasons for low fish numbers province wide, but I can guarantee that the main issue in 1 river close to where I hunt was the snagging, spearing and killing of steelhead and chinook. Some taken out of the counting cage. Asinine in todays world.

As for the cull, I suggest there is no way this government will even look at as an option, emotional management does not comprehend killing a species. They would willingly and easily close all sport fishing that impact chinook and steelhead. I actually expect this. I do know that there are more of us (users) and less of them (chinook) today than I can remember, they are also smaller I think.

HM
 
That's pretty naive. If any government were to go to the last resort lengths of instituting a seal hunt, they would have to also impose severe restrictions on fishing activity to help justify it. From a political perspective how could they justify shooting seals and let a relatively small number of sport fisherman continue to catch Chinook at present levels, fish all winter in a fishery where 80%+ of the catch is juveniles that have to be shaken off. Watch what you wish for, if you think those decisions would be made in isolation I think you could be very disappointed.
I can see them shutting down the winter fishery because from a political perspective it has very little impact(kind of like it does on real conservation)As part of the faux conservation that's becoming so common, it is the low hanging fruit , it gives the impression of doing something while really doing very little. Does it make sense to try and solve a coast wide conservation problem by addressing something that has a minimal impact, no! But let's face it the government takes on easy stuff. I can't see them addressing ant of the real issues because it's just too hard. Solve the salmon shortage by stopping a handful of people from fishing in winter who obviously have almost zero impact (everything has some), makes sense to a politician and perhaps some special interest groups, but face it that's not when the pressure on the stock is really coming from and at best a minimal concern. I wonder how many people fish in December as opposed to August?
 
I can see them shutting down the winter fishery because from a political perspective it has very little impact(kind of like it does on real conservation)As part of the faux conservation that's becoming so common, it is the low hanging fruit , it gives the impression of doing something while really doing very little. Does it make sense to try and solve a coast wide conservation problem by addressing something that has a minimal impact, no! But let's face it the government takes on easy stuff. I can't see them addressing ant of the real issues because it's just too hard. Solve the salmon shortage by stopping a handful of people from fishing in winter who obviously have almost zero impact (everything has some), makes sense to a politician and perhaps some special interest groups, but face it that's not when the pressure on the stock is really coming from and at best a minimal concern. I wonder how many people fish in December as opposed to August?

You are correct, in that there is a lot of politics in these decisions. Looking at the post from cohochinook, I did not know that the Aquarium releases their rehabilitated seals them out near net pens. Those seals were going to die of natural causes and nature should be allowed to take its course, they don't really need any help surviving as a species. We are at the opposite end of the spectrum of a seal hunt from a political and public perception standpoint. The Aquarium spends significant resources saving seals that were supposed to die because the public likes to see them do that, and its good PR for them. It should be like in yellowstone park, as a protected species the seals should be off limits to interference, fine anyone who interferes like that idiot in yellowstone who put the bison calf in his van and took it to the ranger station. They took it back out in to the forest and fined him.
 
Some of my experience. There are a few streams on the coast that have not suffered as much in salmon depression. I have been visiting many streams from estuary up over the last thirty years. One of the most consistent streams has a large population of seals in the mouth where as ten miles away another excellent stream has nearly none. In my travels there seamed to be more of a correlation with dungeness crab populations and seals than salmonid species and seals. Some estuaries like "Atta" in Thompson sound had the largest seal concentration Ive ever seen. There is a couple streams in the bay but water falls restrict any large population of salmon from using them. Never a salmon run there yet enough of a food source to keep a massive population of seals going. Crabbing was unreal there in 1995!! In contrast is Gold river. I have visited the Gold river estuary since mid 1990's. Back in the early years when I would run the estuary into the river to guide for the day I would never see many seals. There always was one or two but never any large amount. Even the last couple years while heading out hunting there I still do not see any exploded seal population that could have killed all the Gold river steelhead. Gold river is void of stream invertebrates though.

If seals are mopping up juvenile salmon in areas of concern it would seem sensible to regulate the population to some extent or somehow divert them from the practice. If only First Nations could use them for heritage reasons and harvest them from problem areas. It is in their history to use and barter seal products. I for one would pay good money for a pelt or set of seal skin bindings from a gift store. Could be a "win-win" situation if marketed correctly to politicians.
 
I am no scientist, I am sure that there are many reasons for low fish numbers province wide, but I can guarantee that the main issue in 1 river close to where I hunt was the snagging, spearing and killing of steelhead and chinook. Some taken out of the counting cage. Asinine in todays world.

As for the cull, I suggest there is no way this government will even look at as an option, emotional management does not comprehend killing a species. They would willingly and easily close all sport fishing that impact chinook and steelhead. I actually expect this. I do know that there are more of us (users) and less of them (chinook) today than I can remember, they are also smaller I think.

HM
science is now showing us from California to Alaska that this is happening..the pinipeds are out competing the resident Killer whales for there favorite food 4 and 5 year Chinook... just one large piece of other pieces of this puzzle...
 
I can see them shutting down the winter fishery because from a political perspective it has very little impact(kind of like it does on real conservation)As part of the faux conservation that's becoming so common, it is the low hanging fruit , it gives the impression of doing something while really doing very little. Does it make sense to try and solve a coast wide conservation problem by addressing something that has a minimal impact, no! But let's face it the government takes on easy stuff. I can't see them addressing ant of the real issues because it's just too hard. Solve the salmon shortage by stopping a handful of people from fishing in winter who obviously have almost zero impact (everything has some), makes sense to a politician and perhaps some special interest groups, but face it that's not when the pressure on the stock is really coming from and at best a minimal concern. I wonder how many people fish in December as opposed to August?


Favorite food of the local killer whales is the 4 & 5 year Chinooks...
 
Favorite food of the local killer whales is the 4 & 5 year Chinooks...
Yeah,but that would mean shutting down the summer and commercial fishery! Like I said closing down winter fishing is the low hanging fruit, gives the appearance of doing something while basically doing nothing.
 
Yeah,but that would mean shutting down the summer and commercial fishery! Like I said closing down winter fishing is the low hanging fruit, gives the appearance of doing something while basically doing nothing.

Not necessarily.... Closing down a fishery is a gesture not a solution & historically this has failed .. we want favourable solutions for our friends the SRKW ...Something we must always remember that we the angling community desire to help the endangered SRKW
 
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The best scientific reason I can see for why fish are not surviving at sea is the Alaskan pink hatchery effect. There's twice as many smolts going to sea but fewer adults are returning. One billion extra AK pinks are eating the lunch of chinook, steelhead and coho stocks.

https://www.biv.com/article/2017/5/whats-destabilizing-bcs-wild-salmon-stocks/

Bit off topic but we have covered this it's not all that it seems. If your interested here is a link.
http://www.sportfishingbc.com/forum...s-required-for-wild-salmon.64572/#post-807639
 
Favorite food of the local killer whales is the 4 & 5 year Chinooks...
And if I remember correctly it's Harrison and Thompson springs that the key on.
 
Not necessarily.... Closing down a fishery is a gesture not a solution & historically this has fail .. we want favourable solutions for our friends the SRKW ...Something we must always remember that we the angling community desire to help the endangered SRKW
100% correct on this one Derby.... there are many tools in the box, as DFO likes to say, but we need to be careful what tool we use and where it is used as this dissertation suggests.
Variability of harbour seal (Phoca vitulina) foraging behaviour during out-migrations of salmon smoltsAllegue, Hassen2017
https://open.library.ubc.ca/cIRcle/collections/ubctheses/24/items/1.0348378
 
We must all remember that BC is not managing by science.

Derby

I have no doubt that there are more pinnipeds now than I can remember, I know for a fact that they are eating salmon, lived in Comox when the problem was rampant and on the news about all the things that were being done to stop the fat buggers from entering the river mouth and lazily gobbling up all the Puntledge Salmon as they drifted past to sea. Nothing worked, fence, gates, grates, noise, or harassment. I do know what would have stopped them but??? That's illegal. This problem seams like an excellent opportunity for an increase in transients.

I still think the issue has many reasons and not a specific one could be fully blamed. Are the chinook stocks still not reduced from rivers without seals?

HM
 
yes there is many variables to this complex issue of the SRKW..pinnippeds are just one of them ..like all issue there is always more then one variable....over the next month or so, many more of these variables will be uncovered ...
 
We must all remember that BC is not managing by science.

Derby

I have no doubt that there are more pinnipeds now than I can remember, I know for a fact that they are eating salmon, lived in Comox when the problem was rampant and on the news about all the things that were being done to stop the fat buggers from entering the river mouth and lazily gobbling up all the Puntledge Salmon as they drifted past to sea. Nothing worked, fence, gates, grates, noise, or harassment. I do know what would have stopped them but??? That's illegal. This problem seams like an excellent opportunity for an increase in transients.

I still think the issue has many reasons and not a specific one could be fully blamed. Are the chinook stocks still not reduced from rivers without seals?

HM


Although the Governments & DFO at times do not Always manage by science..we should be always striving that we do need to be managed bye the science..
 
Then one has to wonder if science is really correct or being controlled by politics.



Although the Governments & DFO at times do not Always manage by science..we should be always striving that we do need to be managed bye the science..
 
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