P.E.I. fish lab loses international credentials

[Whole in the Water]

One can't help but wonder if this was politically motivated to scare off other labs from finding results the CFIA, Fish Farms and the Govt. don't want to see as it may hurt the very well protected salmon feedlot industry?

P.E.I. fish lab loses international credentials


Lab said it found evidence of infectious salmon anemia in B.C.

CBC News

Posted: Jul 8, 2013 8:29 AM AT

Last Updated: Jul 8, 2013 9:50 AM AT

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AVC lab credentials in jeopardy after foreign complaint


The fish health lab at Charlottetown's Atlantic Veterinary College has lost its designation as a testing centre for infectious salmon anemia from the World Organization for Animal Health, the Canadian Press is reporting.
The lab came under scrutiny in 2011 when it said it found evidence of infectious salmon anemia in B.C. The Canadian Food Inspection Agency said researcher Fred Kibenge’s results weren’t corroborated and it sent its results to the World Organization for Animal Health, known as the OIE.
Researchers say they are stunned by the move, as the lab is one of only two in the world recognized by the world body to test for the salmon virus. Critics say the government went after Kibenge’s work to protect B.C.'s salmon exports.
Rick Routledge, a professor at Simon Fraser University, says the loss of the special status might put a chill on research.
The OIE audited the lab last August, and AVC dean Don Reynolds said deficiencies were found. A report recommended the lab's designation be suspended, Reynolds told CBC News in November, but that recommendation still needed at that time to go the OIE director.
The OIE says inadequacies were found and the decision to suspend the designation was not political.

 

[Gunsmith]

Sure feels like some kind of influence exercising a heavy hand.

 

[trophywife]

Communism.

 

[Bows Up]

Closer to fascism, perhaps ?

 

[ClayoquotKid]

Let me get this straight:

- There are 178 countries in the OIE and they all voted to revoke the AVC lab's credentials as an ISA reference facility in order to protect the BC salmon farming industry?

- They took this incredible action to protect it from trade sanctions that would harm the export of a product that supposedly has a virus which kills 90% of the farmed Atlantic salmon that have it?

Seems to me like the presence of the virus itself is something that would harm the BC salmon farming industry far more than the trade sanctions.

If it was actually here - they would all be dead.

It would be pretty bad for business and I'm sure the shareholders would not be happy.

Maybe that is why it hasn't been found in thousands and thousands of samples in both wild and farmed salmon in BC.

Also, what about the Atlantic provinces that farm salmon and encounter the ISA virus - causing culls and everything else that would apply here in BC...

Doesn't the CFIA care about them?

 

[GDW]

Farmed salmon don't live out their full life cycle so impossible to know if the virus would have killed them when farmers kill them first.

Maybe the culls on the east coast are because farms infect wild atlantics which wipes out runs while here we are lead to believe pacific salmon are immune to this crap so why cull the farmed fish let em grow to market size and then sell to Costco.

 

[Andrew P]

Let me get this straight:

- There are 178 countries in the OIE and they all voted to revoke the AVC lab's credentials as an ISA reference facility in order to protect the BC salmon farming industry?

- They took this incredible action to protect it from trade sanctions that would harm the export of a product that supposedly has a virus which kills 90% of the farmed Atlantic salmon that have it?

Seems to me like the presence of the virus itself is something that would harm the BC salmon farming industry far more than the trade sanctions.

If it was actually here - they would all be dead.

It would be pretty bad for business and I'm sure the shareholders would not be happy.

Maybe that is why it hasn't been found in thousands and thousands of samples in both wild and farmed salmon in BC.

Also, what about the Atlantic provinces that farm salmon and encounter the ISA virus - causing culls and everything else that would apply here in BC...

Doesn't the CFIA care about them?

CK:

What is this vote that you speak of? Source? Google finds nothing of a vote containing all 178 countries. Please enlighten.
This supposedly came as a result of ONE country's complaint. It sure would be interesting to know what country that was...any ideas?

On a side note, I was recently cruising through Clayoquot Sound and while passing a fish farm, we couldn't help but notice that all of the salmon were jumping like crazy. We slowed down to take a closer look and it was like a full on frenzy. It didn't seem like they were being fed at the time. What would cause the fish to be constantly jumping? They looked quite mature. Any insight into this?

 

[ClayoquotKid]

Farmed salmon don't live out their full life cycle so impossible to know if the virus would have killed them when farmers kill them first.

Maybe the culls on the east coast are because farms infect wild atlantics which wipes out runs while here we are lead to believe pacific salmon are immune to this crap so why cull the farmed fish let em grow to market size and then sell to Costco.

"These experiments demonstrated that the Pacific
salmon species, chum, coho, chinook and steelhead,
were relatively resistant to ISAV when compared
with Atlantic salmon. Thus it appears that Pacific
salmon species are at relatively low risk should ISA
spread to the west coast of North America where
these species are endemic."

http://salmonfarmscience.files.word...resistance_of_pacific_salmon_to_isav_2003.pdf

Also, the Atlantic salmon tested in this experiment suffered 96-100% mortality within about a month of infection - it would be incredibly difficult and rare to have an instance where you could let an outbreak run its course while waiting to harvest.

 

[GDW]

So maybe - maybe it's not true farms harvest and sell infected fish from BC but it looks like I was correct your not worried about outbreaks because the thinking is pacific salmon are relatively resistant.

Lol what the hell does relatively resistant mean anyways? To me its either all or nothing either they are not effected or they are. Sounds like pacific salmon ARE effected but for now not as badly as atlantics. Farms will carry on business as normal the Pacifics are relatively resistant so it's all good.

What if the virus mutates and they are severely effected ? Ahh worry about that when it happens and only after you deny it for awhile right CK?

 

[ClayoquotKid]

CK:

What is this vote that you speak of? Source? Google finds nothing of a vote containing all 178 countries. Please enlighten.
This supposedly came as a result of ONE country's complaint. It sure would be interesting to know what country that was...any ideas?

On a side note, I was recently cruising through Clayoquot Sound and while passing a fish farm, we couldn't help but notice that all of the salmon were jumping like crazy. We slowed down to take a closer look and it was like a full on frenzy. It didn't seem like they were being fed at the time. What would cause the fish to be constantly jumping? They looked quite mature. Any insight into this?

"The OIE designates reference laboratory status based on a laboratory's ability to maintain the highest technical and operational standards. The OIE undertook an independent audit of the AVC after another OIE member country also reported issues related to ISA test results from this laboratory. The OIE audit, performed by an international panel of scientific experts, found a series of weaknesses affecting the quality of diagnoses performed at the AVC laboratory. The decision to delist this laboratory as an OIE reference laboratory was approved unanimously by the General Assembly of the OIE in May 2013."
http://www.inspection.gc.ca/animals...nt-2013-07-05/eng/1373038790217/1373041710849

Here's the member countries: http://www.oie.int/index.php?L=3&id=103

Looks like it may have actually been more than one complaint...

As for the jumping - I actually took a tour out last week and one gentleman was also quite interested in the activity of the fish.

They like to jump.

I don't know what to tell you there - they do it from when they are really small at the hatchery all the way up to harvest size.

"The name, Salmo salar, is from the Latin salmo, meaning salmon, and salar, meaning leaper" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlantic_salmon

 

[ClayoquotKid]

So maybe - maybe it's not true farms harvest and sell infected fish from BC but it looks like I was correct your not worried about outbreaks because the thinking is pacific salmon are relatively resistant.

Lol what the hell does relatively resistant mean anyways? To me its either all or nothing either they are not effected or they are. Sounds like pacific salmon ARE effected but for now not as badly as atlantics. Farms will carry on business as normal the Pacifics are relatively resistant so it's all good.

What if the virus mutates and they are severely effected ? Ahh worry about that when it happens and only after you deny it for awhile right CK?

You still seem to be operating on the premise that our fish are positive for the ISA virus?

The same virus that has up to a 100% mortality rate for farmed Atlantic salmon?

 

[Andrew P]

Ck- that link says nothing about 178 nations voting. It also stated that this was brought to the OIE attention by the gov....and one other nation who also was not happy with the results...again, would be interesting to know who.

And regarding the jumping...I googled it after posting and found some interesting results about jumping farmed salmon...and how it isn't just an all natural trait like you state above. This has nothing to do with lice treatment?

 

[Andrew P]

The jumping was no where close to any natural jumping that I have ever witnessed. We were quite shocked by it. Unfortunately the camera was packed away...or I would have taken a video.

Anyways, do any of your farms modify/enhance this jumping behavior for the treatment of sea lice?

http://animalsci.highwire.org/content/89/12/4281.full

Also quite interesting that they are giving the farms a nice grace period until "The CFIA expects to begin the collection and testing of farmed Atlantic and Pacific salmon this fall."

 

[ClayoquotKid]

The jumping was no where close to any natural jumping that I have ever witnessed. We were quite shocked by it. Unfortunately the camera was packed away...or I would have taken a video.

Anyways, do any of your farms modify/enhance this jumping behavior for the treatment of sea lice?

http://animalsci.highwire.org/content/89/12/4281.full

Also quite interesting that they are giving the farms a nice grace period until "The CFIA expects to begin the collection and testing of farmed Atlantic and Pacific salmon this fall."

Interesting stuff - but no, we use SLICE for sea lice when required.

I think the answer you were looking for (and the one that makes the most sense to me) was in there though, "Our results indicate that removal of surface access for short periods may lead to loss of air from the physostomous swim bladder and cause negative buoyancy. This creates a behavioral drive for salmon to jump, swallow air and fill their swim bladders once surface access is reinstated."

So, there you go - a perfectly natural cause for salmon to jump.

I'm not sure what you mean by "a nice grace period" - we've had thousands of tests run for ISA over the years and it has never been seen.

I still don't understand why people are so willing to believe that a virus which causes a disease that kills nearly all the farmed Atlantic salmon it infects is present in BC.

 

[ClayoquotKid]

Ck- that link says nothing about 178 nations voting. It also stated that this was brought to the OIE attention by the gov....and one other nation who also was not happy with the results...again, would be interesting to know who.

The General Assembly approved unanimously: http://www.oie.int/eng/session2013/information.htm

"The 81st General Session of the World Assembly of OIE Delegates will be held from 26 to 31 May 2013, bringing together representatives of 178 OIE Members and observers from international organisations that have signed an official agreement with the OIE, as well as other international and regional organisations and invited guests."

 

[Ripcurl]

Approved what unanimously????? This website is nothing but a link to their event they held in May?

Also all the delegates are just representatives appointed by member countries. It would work as well as our Senate does. It's party politics plain and simple.

It's not hard to know what 2 countries made complaints. 1 was the DFO, 2 was Norway who has a 98% interest in salmon farming in BC and most of the world.

Salmon farming methods are sloppy and dangerous to the environment and anyone who eats it. There is Zero containment of any Anti biotics or Lice killer that is used. Theres plenty of footage from both coasts of this stuff just being dumped in the pens to be then be carried in the current. There is Zero management or containment of the enormous amount of feces these farms produce and there is ZERO accountability for any side effects these farms have on any species affected at all.

Look on Youtube of people who dive under fish farms. They are barron waste lands of fish **** and if you look up chile, the environment never recovers from it.

Move the farms to contained facilities and be done with it. No jobs lost. Just slightly less profit for a couple companies for a year or two.

 

[agentaqua]

The General Assembly approved unanimously

u·nan·i·mous(y-nn-ms)
adj.
1. Sharing the same opinions or views; being in complete harmony or accord.
2. Based on or characterized by complete assent or agreement.

Is it the english language you have trouble with CK - or just understanding things in general?

NO most likely the vote was NOT "unanimous" but the vote passed on whether the "yeas" outweighed the "neas. Were you there CK for the vote and recorded all 178 delegates voting "yea", unanimously?

I Friggen doubt it. Nothing on the link you sent displays the minutes for the 2013 convention, but there is minutes for the 2012. As usual - you don't read through your links and references.

I am willing to believe that the OIE did find enough to withdraw the OIE designation after the Canadian delegate from CFIA made the motion, after he has a good talk with the American delegates and horse-traded with them so they wouldn't oppose the motion. That's after Walling and her paid lobbiests had a private talk with DFO/CFIA officials.

I have no problem with the proper oversight and functioning of the OIE - including removing OIE designation where appropriate...BUT...

Why weren't ALL the labs in Canada - including DFO's in Moncton, Vancouver, Nanaimo, and elsewheres also put through the wringer with someboby complaining to the OIE about them?

Did CFIA inspect DFOs lab with the same vigour? Shouldn't we all be striving for perfection in science - including DFO?

NO - the message is that we should be striving to get all the same negative results - and anyone who disagrees get the jackboots on the lab floor, and their samples seized and not returned. Why is it that the only lab that was inspected was the only independent lab in Canada?

This is unacceptable.

Canada also made a $2MILLION donation to the OIE coffers - no strings attached, right?

 

[ClayoquotKid]

u·nan·i·mous(y-nn-ms)
adj.
1. Sharing the same opinions or views; being in complete harmony or accord.
2. Based on or characterized by complete assent or agreement.

Is it the english language you have trouble with CK - or just understanding things in general?

NO most likely the vote was NOT "unanimous" but the vote passed on whether the "yeas" outweighed the "neas. Were you there CK for the vote and recorded all 178 delegates voting "yea", unanimously?

I Friggen doubt it. Nothing on the link you sent displays the minutes for the 2013 convention, but there is minutes for the 2012. As usual - you don't read through your links and references.

I am willing to believe that the OIE did find enough to withdraw the OIE designation after the Canadian delegate from CFIA made the motion, after he has a good talk with the American delegates and horse-traded with them so they wouldn't oppose the motion. That's after Walling and her paid lobbiests had a private talk with DFO/CFIA officials.

I have no problem with the proper oversight and functioning of the OIE - including removing OIE designation where appropriate...BUT...

Why weren't ALL the labs in Canada - including DFO's in Moncton, Vancouver, Nanaimo, and elsewheres also put through the wringer with someboby complaining to the OIE about them?

Did CFIA inspect DFOs lab with the same vigour? Shouldn't we all be striving for perfection in science - including DFO?

NO - the message is that we should be striving to get all the same negative results - and anyone who disagrees get the jackboots on the lab floor, and their samples seized and not returned. Why is it that the only lab that was inspected was the only independent lab in Canada?

This is unacceptable.

Canada also made a $2MILLION donation to the OIE coffers - no strings attached, right?

Written By: Bertrand Charron
Category: ISA in BC?
Date Posted: 21/06/2013 6:23 AM


AVC lab stripped from OIE ‘ISA reference lab’ status; Unanimous vote by OIE World Assembly Delegates


UPDATED @16.00: The Positive Aquaculture Awareness (PAA) organisation in British Columbia (BC) hailed last night [June 20, 2013] the ‘scoop’ via Twitter (@BCAquaculture) according to which: “As of today, the OIE has pulled its reference designation for Fred Kibenge’s lab at the Atlantic Veterinary College on Prince Edward Island, leaving Dr. Knut Falk’s lab at the National Veterinary Institute in Norway as the only OIE-designated reference lab in the world for Infectious Salmon Anemia (ISA).” PAA said the story was based on ‘reliable sources’ and on the World Organisation for Animal Health (OIE)’s edited webpage, which doesn’t show anymore Dr Kibenge’s lab as a reference lab for ISA. However, another OIE page was still listing Dr Kibenge as a reference lab. Following our repeated enquiries at OIE headquarters in Paris, that latter ‘remaining’ OIE page was edited* on Friday (June 21) afternoon to remove any mention of Dr Kibenge’s lab; and the OIE told SeafoodIntelligence the following: “In May 2013 The World Assembly of national Delegates of the OIE (178 countries) approved by unanimity the delisting of the OIE Reference Laboratory for Infectious Salmon Anaemia located at Atlantic Veterinary College (AVC) in Canada on the basis of the results of the OIE audit conducted with independent experts from 31 July to 2 August 2012.” [*PS: Interestingly, if one types ‘Kibenge’ in the OIE website search engine, the three results will lead to the now-edited OIE ‘reference lab’ page, thus still & despite his name’s deletion…]
http://www.seafoodintelligence.com/...86&mid=767&def=News Article View&ItemId=34071

No need to get snarky there Aqua - I'm simply re-stating what was written. (In a number of articles)

The lab was audited and it failed to meet the standards of the OIE in regards to acting as a reference lab for ISA.

 

[agentaqua]

Ya - I'm snarky about the cover-up, hype and propaganda verses the lack of responsible science and follow-through by our regulators that cater to the industry needs by protecting trade rather than our resources.

It may be that in the smaller sub-group on aquatic animal health - that the even smaller number of representatives that made it to the session on delisting Kibenges lab - that there were no "neas" and for the ones that voted - were "yeas after extensive lobbying by Canadian CFIA reps. I'd believe that.

I DON'T believe that all 178 delegates voted "unamiously" to remove OIE delegation from fred's lab - no matter what all the BS artists from the industry would like you to think. I'll wait for the minutes from the OIE before I make any declarations of unaminity.

 

[GDW]

You still seem to be operating on the premise that our fish are positive for the ISA virus?

The same virus that has up to a 100% mortality rate for farmed Atlantic salmon?

Nope, but I am operating on the premis that if/when ISA is found (actually it already was) it will be covered up and ignored because as you indicated pacific salmon are "relatively resistant" according to salmon farmers.

ISA was found and the lab that found it was attacked. Sounds about right.