fish4all
Well-Known Member
I get that Wolf. Just trying to point out that we all are playing a part in this mess.
not for profit vs profit ..outlooks and opinions
- Thread starter trophywife
- Start date
I get that Wolf. Just trying to point out that we all are playing a part in this mess.
wolf
Well-Known Member
YES but the BIG picture is you have to ask WHO is profiting the MOST I can tell you its not us "guides" we are a very small piece of the pie, the ones who benefit from all of us is the GREAT COMMUNITIES we live along our great coastline of B.C.!!!!!!!!!!!! from the gas stations to the corner stores,grocery,B&B, resorts,airlines,taxis,restaurants,Pubs the list can go on forever its a domino effect if it wasnt for all the tourists and ill inculde the Canadians that come from B.C. Alberta Sask,Manitoba and the rest of Canada with or without boats if it wasnt for these people the communities suffer the most.
They are the ones who "profit" the most I know just me personally the clients I bring in for the fish they take home is a lot to the community of SOOKE and im proud to say I live here and want to support this and all communities.......in closing see WE ALL PROFIT from it......
Wolf
They are the ones who "profit" the most I know just me personally the clients I bring in for the fish they take home is a lot to the community of SOOKE and im proud to say I live here and want to support this and all communities.......in closing see WE ALL PROFIT from it......
Wolf
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pescador
Well-Known Member
This idea that we all take 30 fish a year is not accurate. Im a pretty good example. Me and the wife wouldnt take more than 25 Springs between us. Thats less than 50% of our allowance. I suspect many people who dont live right on good fishing grounds are the same. It may be different for people who live in Victoria or the West Coast, but ive got to travel to fish and we can't possible catch 30 each
fish4all
Well-Known Member
I realize most people never hit the 30 mark. I would think most people dont hit the 10 mark but with 250,000-300,000 licenses issued all we need is 3-4 each to hit a million. Again it is not the individual angler or sector it is a combined effort that is taking its affect on the stocks.
Doug
Well-Known Member
I do agree with Wolf, that there are a lot more (15+ to 1) recreational fisherman than charter boats in our area and a lot of those rec fisherman I see fishing everyday I’m out.
Charter Operators may or may not hook up more than the average boat owner but one thing is for sure is, once a fish is on the line during a charter trip it is up to the client to play and land that fish
Using barbless hooks, 30 lb test line, knuckle buster reels and with allot of clients on charters trips having never fished before makes it hard to land a fish. Some days we hook up 10 times yet you only land 2-3 fish because of bent hooks, fishing line breaking at the boat and slack line. Whereas the average fisherman who owns his own boat and is not out as much as a guide has the experience to land the fish. Just look at some of the rec fisherman posts and videos, some are great fisherman
In regards to licenses and 30 fish. I have 7 fish on my license for this year. With 80%+ of my license sold being for one day fishing trips, the most each of those licenses only can have is two fish recorded. So there might be thousand and thousand of licenses sold but how many licenses have 30 fish? Not many and I don’t know of any charter fisherman that has 30 fish on a license at our dock.
There is not much profit in being a charter boat operator and most operator do it because they like to be on the water and it cover some of their expenses and provides them some gear (boat, tackle, insurance) write offs, that is if they make the enough income to write it off. I even know of some low cost charter operator that charge low rates just to be out fishing. They think they are making money but in the end they are not covering any overhead or making profit so when that major breakdown comes their business is shut down or they dig into their loans deeper and deeper.
Being a recreational fisherman and a charter fisherman costs a lot of money and both mainly do it for the excitement , passion and the meat.
Profit VS None Profit we are both in the same boats, it costs a lot of money.
Charter Operators may or may not hook up more than the average boat owner but one thing is for sure is, once a fish is on the line during a charter trip it is up to the client to play and land that fish
Using barbless hooks, 30 lb test line, knuckle buster reels and with allot of clients on charters trips having never fished before makes it hard to land a fish. Some days we hook up 10 times yet you only land 2-3 fish because of bent hooks, fishing line breaking at the boat and slack line. Whereas the average fisherman who owns his own boat and is not out as much as a guide has the experience to land the fish. Just look at some of the rec fisherman posts and videos, some are great fisherman
In regards to licenses and 30 fish. I have 7 fish on my license for this year. With 80%+ of my license sold being for one day fishing trips, the most each of those licenses only can have is two fish recorded. So there might be thousand and thousand of licenses sold but how many licenses have 30 fish? Not many and I don’t know of any charter fisherman that has 30 fish on a license at our dock.
There is not much profit in being a charter boat operator and most operator do it because they like to be on the water and it cover some of their expenses and provides them some gear (boat, tackle, insurance) write offs, that is if they make the enough income to write it off. I even know of some low cost charter operator that charge low rates just to be out fishing. They think they are making money but in the end they are not covering any overhead or making profit so when that major breakdown comes their business is shut down or they dig into their loans deeper and deeper.
Being a recreational fisherman and a charter fisherman costs a lot of money and both mainly do it for the excitement , passion and the meat.
Profit VS None Profit we are both in the same boats, it costs a lot of money.
bigbruce
Crew Member
"Profit VS None Profit we are both in the same boats, it costs a lot of money."
Boy you've got that right, Doug. Or so my wife keeps reminding me every time the Visa bill arrives after I've been making "improvements" on my boat or have been out fishing.
I very rarely have more than 2 or 3 Chinook spots used on my license and the cost per pound of fish is probably somewhat more than I would spend at the local fish store - but man is it fun being out on the water!!
Boy you've got that right, Doug. Or so my wife keeps reminding me every time the Visa bill arrives after I've been making "improvements" on my boat or have been out fishing.
I very rarely have more than 2 or 3 Chinook spots used on my license and the cost per pound of fish is probably somewhat more than I would spend at the local fish store - but man is it fun being out on the water!!
Rum Buddies
Well-Known Member
You can't assume that every liscence will have fish on it, I'd say a HUGE chunk of those never get any fish. There's 10,000's of guys that never catch a thing or even go out more then once.
All the posts above put economics first. I'm not against myself or anyone else making a living but there has to be some thought put towards how do we prevent the decline in fish and fishing opportunity we have seen in the past few decades. After all the fact is...without the fish there is no economic opportunity. All I'm suggesting is that DFO should start researching the areas that still have decent returns to determine what management options they might consider to keep those runs strong. If they don't do this then those fish and everyones fishing opportunties in those areas wil suffer the same fate as everywhere else. At some time in the future the restricting of the free flow of unlimited numbers of guided boats into terminal areas to take advantage of the few remaining "hot spots" might be something they may want to consider.
Purple Hazer
Member
If the guiding is not an issue why did Alaska limit the number of guides there? Just asking.
Aces
Well-Known Member
Because most of the were from out of state. Much more liberal with state residents i believe
wolf
Well-Known Member
Also we are ALL supposed to have the blue decal and conform to all the certificate required, if THIS was ENFORCED we really wouldnt have a problem as it would take out quite a few, WE DONT need more shiat crammed down our throats it just like everything else be it a taxi,airlines,restaurants they all have to conform by the rules if they dont they dont survive seen many a person try this industry and many have come and gone, it works its self out in the long run dont understand why some worry about it....... it all comes down to enforcement ....
ziggy
Well-Known Member
I know what you're trying to say but I disagree about our numbers being small. If as some have stated there are 200 k rec anglers, we are by far and away the largest sector. Not sure what the commercial sectors numbers are, but I don't think they can match those of the rec anglers.
The problem is that those 200 k operate as individuals. If the government were ever to see an organized voting block of 200 k I think things would be different. Money talks, but doesn't buy votes.
Roy to a certain degree I agree with what you are saying about Transport Canada. Too many aren't up to speed even today, as their is very little enforcement. Even you resisted and weren't one of the first to comply. Don't take that the wrong way just using it to back up your argument. However again that has more to do with economics and the cost of doing business. A fish doesn't know the difference between a guide boat in compliance with TC and one that isn't. They both catch fish.
Roy...here is an idea I'm willing to work on with TC to help solve the enforcement issue. What if TC with some industry help developed a single page that could be linked to your website. Each operator would be required to create a page on their website called "What You Should Know About Hiring A Charter Boat in BC" That page would have a TC official logo and would list the requirements for under and over 5 tons and how the customer can protect himself with asking the right questions and what to look for on the boat. Inform them that without the "C" number and the required operator certifications there likely is no insurance, as the policy would be void. This document would be like branding as all certified guides woud have it on their sites and the public over time would be looking for it on their own
So this would help your customers find you the certified guide....but it would also help TC locate those advertising online that don't comply. In other words...no compliance...no website, unless you are a dummy and want to get caught!!!!
So this would help your customers find you the certified guide....but it would also help TC locate those advertising online that don't comply. In other words...no compliance...no website, unless you are a dummy and want to get caught!!!!
fish stalker
Active Member
When I hear conversations and how we have such a huge number and should have a loud voice. Are you lumping in all anglers together? Im not saying freshys shouldn't be standing up with there salt water brothers but if we are 200k strong is that tidal and non tidal?
wolf
Well-Known Member
Well to answer your question I complied WHEN it was mandatory (so they said) I had all the courses and even some you didnt need that you didnt know about I had it all BUT was holding out to fight them,its like getting insurance if it hasnt run out your not going to renew it 6 months in advance.
We know who they are and they do as well ALSO DOT knows and they still do nothing....
So WHY in the word Rollie would you want more Government RED TAPE the solution is easy ENFORCE what is there then you wouldn't have to worry so much. or better yet go back 7 years who has filed "under" as a charter operator then he gets an approved sticker that hes is a legit operator ...... then anyone that is doing "illegal" would get there boat taken FINED 1 time then 2 times then 3rd time take his boat......
uhhh yeah but they would have to ENFORCE that too.
THEN all the communities profit once again
wolf
We know who they are and they do as well ALSO DOT knows and they still do nothing....
So WHY in the word Rollie would you want more Government RED TAPE the solution is easy ENFORCE what is there then you wouldn't have to worry so much. or better yet go back 7 years who has filed "under" as a charter operator then he gets an approved sticker that hes is a legit operator ...... then anyone that is doing "illegal" would get there boat taken FINED 1 time then 2 times then 3rd time take his boat......
uhhh yeah but they would have to ENFORCE that too.
THEN all the communities profit once again
wolf
