Halibut opening

I have contacted DFO as to why the minutes of meetings are not published in the past, as per their transparency mandate.The answer I got is that they can't post them to an official site because they can't get them translated into French. I think that's a pretty lame response for a Federal Department, who claims transparency is important and whose political masters tout the benefits of bilingualism. The reality is because they can't translate them they languish in some bodies in box.

A few things are in play on this issue.

Minutes from SFAC's are created by the SFAC where there is no budget for anything like meeting space, coffee or translating minutes. It's all done by volunteers that donate their time and effort on behalf of the local anglers.
Minutes from SFAB South Coast, SFAB North Coast, Main Board are taken by a contractor at the meeting and is paid from the DFO budget that is given to the process that we have. Travel, accommodations, meals, meeting space, DFO representatives etcetera all come out of this budget that seems to shrink every year.

To add translation to this would need an increase in the budget and that's something that is difficult to do when most would like less government.

Some would ask ..... I see on the website that there are minutes from past years. Yes that is correct however there was a policy change (2010-2012) back then that was touted to bring more information to websites. The info posted had to be of equal quality in French and English before it could be posted. This means that the translation can't be done by just that employee that's bilingual. Whether by design or missintention the effect was to bring less information not more. The sceptical among us believed back then this was by design to stop the flow of information. Part of a new way of doing business with the past government. You be the judge.

How do we get around this? You can request a copy of the minutes from DFO or contact the Chair of your local SFAC.
 
Not asking you SG !..... every single person on this thread KNOWS what your thoughts are & you have made it very clear in the last 7 pages .... (Its a approx.. 43lb fish & 15lb fish ) I'm just asking a honest questions to the masses.. . but I'm guessing we won't find out as you would most likely jump all over any poor sole that would think about give a honest answer eh.. its still a good question ?... what would this thread look like?.... Yes Washington is relative... you just need to think a little farther out the box u are in.........
 
An example. Alistair McGregor. MLA on island. The repeal of fisheries act had a lot to do locally with his help, and many others. Sure people I know base it on the internet again including NGO groups. But Alistair brought that issue up over and over again in House of Commons. That MLA was engaged face to face with some of our groups on island. From my experience until you have MLA bringing it up in house of commons daily you won't get any traction. But what do I know.:rolleyes:[/QUOTE]

You mean "MP" Alistair McGregor dont you ???
 
I myself have guided on the west coast years ago and saw the size of halibut drop in several areas but I've only been living in and fishing out of victoria for two years and I have yet to find a halibut under 28 lbs. In areas like Port Renfrew, Uclulet, Tofino and further up the coast there are many areas that house the young halibut as they are feeding and growing on the fertilite food sources which we call chicken ranches. I beleive that with each different body of water along the coast we have such a difference in life cycles for the growth and reproduction of the halibut that we are unable to group anyone area into the same regulations we need to make a difference by making sure that the regulations reflect the different areas and what they provide to each of the sportsman in that area.
 
It is indeed a sad day for halibut anglers in BC, but it has nothing to do with the SFAB process. It worked the way it was supposed to - a democratic process with representation from the entire coast that offers recommendations based on a majority vote from all areas. It was obvious based on the fact that the group was unable to achieve consensus that there was no way we would be able to make everyone happy, but I assume that because about 70% of the votes were in favour of the 115/83 option that the majority of halibut anglers in BC were able to accept what is now the recommendation as the least painful of a bunch of painful options.

It became clear pretty fast that given what in fact represents an 18% reduction in our TAC, and most important about a 35% reduction from what we would have caught in 2017 at 133/83 had we fished until December, that in order to remain under our 2018 TAC it was going to require drastic cuts. Remember, 133\83 caused a shut down on Sept 6th. It wasn't even close to achieving a full season. The idea that a 1\1 at 133 or even 124 would reduce catch enough to deal with the current TAC is far from the truth.

There was a tremendous amount of debate regarding the comparative costs\benefits associated with 1/1 vs 1/2 and it was once again obvious that individual values differ amongst different regions and types of fishery. There wasn't even clear consensus amongst lodges or charters or individual anglers as representative fishery types. At the end of the day you're looking at a 2 fish possession with one at 43 lbs and one at 15 lbs. Something to note is that based on the numbers of halibut landed in BC every year, that both of these weights fall well within the range of capturing the average size of the vast majority of halibut retained.

By the time the final recommendation was debated and voted on yesterday, the combined analysis and discussion of the SFAB was exhaustive, focussed, representative and as well informed by data as it can be. Please don't confuse attempts to manage the recreational fishery as some kind of pure science that is totally driven by data. Attempts to predict catch based on different parameters are quantified using a catch prediction model, but part of the inputs to that tool are attempts to predict angler behavior which is all based on expert opinion, long term knowledge, and not data. Every year the model improves based on performance. To attempt to ensure that individual preferences and values are incorporated as accurately as possible into the analysis, every year the process seeks grass roots advice and knowledge to help us understand what key values and guiding principles anglers want us to represent in the fishery through our local SFAC groups. The result is a set of halibut regulations that pleases no one, but is grudgingly accepted by the majority. The root of the problem isn't with the SFAB process or the skill set at that table, it lies in the fact that the recreational fishery in BC has been arbitrarily assigned a TAC in a domestic catch sharing plan that doesn't allow the fishery to achieve its social and economic potential.

If you didn't get the exact plan that meets your business needs or preference of fishing location and style then that is unfortunate, but please don't waste your time and energy trying to blame anyone or take shots at what is admittedly the most popular of a suite of unpopular options. The time has come for all of you internet heros, and all of your fishing buddies\suppliers\clients to step up to the plate by using either your wallet or your time and experience, or preferably both to create and fund a focused effort to gain an allocation amount that actually reflects the value of that fishery to BC coastal communities and the rest of Canada.

CP

CP post sums up what happened not sure if it was missed by some but they seem to think that something else took place?

"There was a tremendous amount of debate regarding the comparative costs\benefits associated with 1/1 vs 1/2 and it was once again obvious that individual values differ amongst different regions and types of fishery. There wasn't even clear consensus amongst lodges or charters or individual anglers as representative fishery types. At the end of the day you're looking at a 2 fish possession with one at 43 lbs and one at 15 lbs. Something to note is that based on the numbers of halibut landed in BC every year, that both of these weights fall well within the range of capturing the average size of the vast majority of halibut retained."

Looks like the guys that fish for the big boys were just out voted
 
CP post sums up what happened not sure if it was missed by some but they seem to think that something else took place?

"There was a tremendous amount of debate regarding the comparative costs\benefits associated with 1/1 vs 1/2 and it was once again obvious that individual values differ amongst different regions and types of fishery. There wasn't even clear consensus amongst lodges or charters or individual anglers as representative fishery types. At the end of the day you're looking at a 2 fish possession with one at 43 lbs and one at 15 lbs. Something to note is that based on the numbers of halibut landed in BC every year, that both of these weights fall well within the range of capturing the average size of the vast majority of halibut retained."

Looks like the guys that fish for the big boys were just out voted


Big boys? Half the fish out of Vic will be over slot. Enjoy your 2 ping pongs.
 
On a Personal note I agree on the 1/1 a based on aver weight and what data I got to look at....... some steps have been taken to put more options in the hands of the SFAC allowing more options to be modeled for the next fall meeting .... Sea run and many others are correct, until we get a fair share of the allocating of halibut we will be looking and a even smaller allowable tac for 2019.... for the reg for 2018 its in the books ..we have a 1/2 full season to fish and I will have to change how I fish but we have a opportunity to retain fish for a season..un like Washington next store................. I will put this question out there which we haven't seen.... how many people out there that travel for one or 2 trips a year to the coast to fish don't have a problem with the 1/2 and would we be at the other end of stick if we hade went 1/1.. wondering out loud what this thread would have looked like????

I will bite. Even though I live on the Island, I still have to travel to fish Halibut where I like to as well as hopefully having a good chance at catching. I have all the same issues minus the ferry and a big chunk of the travel time. Time off work, fuel, gear, launch, trailer storage, moorage,accommodation etc etc. So ya I travel to fish for Halibut.

My answer. Personally a 1/1 larger fish would have been my choice as well. Both for personal reasons as well as my belief in how going too small affects over all experience for average do it your selfers.

To note. I was able to pass that on to my local SFAC chair prior to the meeting. The decision was made by majority vote based on the available TAC. Now, if I still decide to try my luck I will work within it, and then do what I can to get my thoughts heard again for next years season.
 
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Serengeti for f*cks sake put up or shut up, i for one am tired of your constant ********, do something or shut the f*ck up. Derby thanks for all you do obviously it is a thankless job as shown by a select few on this site. Mods i hope i don't get a timeout for this but if i do it was certainly worth it!
 
There were no big fish options offered in the 2 pages of options that I saw. All the options that resulted in us not going over the TAC had a smaller sized fish. It was more about when would the season start and if it would be 1-1 or 1-2. I think if you want the longest sesson possible and the largest fish possible as well the only way to get there would be to close down July and August. Those two months would save the most poundage and increase the likelyhood of not closing early. But I would not throw the north coast under the bus and advocate that. In turn I hope they continue to underatand that March and April is areas19/20 July and August and they will continue to give us the same considerations.
 
Serengeti for f*cks sake put up or shut up, i for one am tired of your constant ********, do something or shut the f*ck up. Derby thanks for all you do obviously it is a thankless job as shown by a select few on this site. Mods i hope i don't get a timeout for this but if i do it was certainly worth it!

Well said Jackel!
 
we definitely need area regs and timing for closures and openings/closures that suite those needs.
for customer and personal reasons i would rather see less anual, far bigger fish and 1/1.
put the sport back in sport fishing. hali is about hunting and size.... not throwing back to fit a slot to increase morts. so against releasing, i hate it.
 
Big boys? Half the fish out of Vic will be over slot. Enjoy your 2 ping pongs.

First of all their are no Halibut in my area, along with lings and rockfish. If I want a taste of that fishing I have to waste considerable amount of boat gas. Not to mention the 45 min car ride pending their is no traffic and the 12 launch fee. So I for one wish I could live on the island.

The people voting I believe had to take in a lot of different considerations not just on halibut but what the whole season on 2018 would look like for the individual angler and the their business. What if there is Chinook closures? yellow eye closures? no pinks this year? what if there's no sockeye this year? Coho ect...

Ultimately it looks like they chose to have the longest season possible probably to insure that at least there will be Halibut to fall back onto.

What would the fishing season as a whole look like if the Halibut was reduced to a 2 or 3 month derby. Would there be that situation where because something is made rare and limited to a time frame would it actually result in more angular s fishing? What kind of fishing pressure would that put on other stocks?

An increase in 85/15 is the only option. Also I have not heard anyone bring up a conservation concern over why the total TAC is shrinking? Why is Halibut TAC shrinking if commercials aren't using all the TAC? are we concerned that the current model is not taking enough conservation into it?
 
First of all their are no Halibut in my area, along with lings and rockfish. If I want a taste of that fishing I have to waste considerable amount of boat gas. Not to mention the 45 min car ride pending their is no traffic and the 12 launch fee. So I for one wish I could live on the island.

The people voting I believe had to take in a lot of different considerations not just on halibut but what the whole season on 2018 would look like for the individual angler and the their business. What if there is Chinook closures? yellow eye closures? no pinks this year? what if there's no sockeye this year? Coho ect...

Ultimately it looks like they chose to have the longest season possible probably to insure that at least there will be Halibut to fall back onto.

What would the fishing season as a whole look like if the Halibut was reduced to a 2 or 3 month derby. Would there be that situation where because something is made rare and limited to a time frame would it actually result in more angular s fishing? What kind of fishing pressure would that put on other stocks?

An increase in 85/15 is the only option. Also I have not heard anyone bring up a conservation concern over why the total TAC is shrinking? Why is Halibut TAC shrinking if commercials aren't using all the TAC? are we concerned that the current model is not taking enough conservation into it?
It looks like you should plan on a 2-3 month season next year because the quota will be going down next year
 
we definitely need area regs and timing for closures and openings/closures that suite those needs.
for customer and personal reasons i would rather see less anual, far bigger fish and 1/1.
put the sport back in sport fishing. hali is about hunting and size.... not throwing back to fit a slot to increase morts. so against releasing, i hate it.
I agree with everything you said. We manage salmon by using area specific regulations why not Halibut. If I can only have a possession limit of say 60 lbs why not do it with one fish.
 
I would encourage everyone that is interested in these issues find out who their local SFAB rep is and get on their email distribution list. I belong to area 14 and 25 boards and the emails going back and forth are very informative and will give you an idea just how hard people work on these issues on our behalf.
 
I think DFOs PLAN is working perfectly , the only way to put pressure on them is to all stick together , every one is accountable, this regulation that has been accepted all it has really done is put one area against the other , no likes it, no agrees with it. its going to cause wastage in certain areas . We should have said one and done and throw it back to DFO, if it dries up early every one is in the same boat and will MAYBE unite US and maybe then we will work together. I don't agree with scare tactics, that is not fair bargaining. We should have not let our selves go down this road. Again we have allowed our self to fight with each other when our fight is really with DFO and the TAC. Their using the oldest negotiating trick in the book against us divide and concur !!!!
 
ALLOCATION ISSUE.
We need a good lawyer. It can't be legal to be spending public funds on privatizing a public resource and supporting an Experimental Quota Transfer Program.
Pipe Dream I know. It would just cost too much.
And even taken to court who's going to follow through. See... Cohen Commission.

Until then, I'd take 1 possession and take the shoulder months of Feb and Dec out.
I'd like a larger slot size but happy to release fish over 90lb. I will anyways.
I also like the talks of management by area.
 
An example. Alistair McGregor. MLA on island. The repeal of fisheries act had a lot to do locally with his help, and many others. Sure people I know base it on the internet again including NGO groups. But Alistair brought that issue up over and over again in House of Commons. That MLA was engaged face to face with some of our groups on island. From my experience until you have MLA bringing it up in house of commons daily you won't get any traction. But what do I know.:rolleyes:

You mean "MP" Alistair McGregor dont you ???[/QUOTE]

I fixed it. Does that make you happy? I am sure you can figure it out. Dam I love this forum.
 
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I agree with everything you said. We manage salmon by using area specific regulations why not Halibut. If I can only have a possession limit of say 60 lbs why not do it with one fish.

i have suggested personal or family max poundage, in the past.
 
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