All Things COVID-19

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absolon said:
That overlooks every other consequence to the environment, labour standards, financial transactions, food quality, drug safety and a multitude of other areas where regulation takes the longer view that self-interested individual actors don't.

Just because someone has an opinion doesn't mean it's informed, well considered or even based on fact. Accepting those opinions as having equal value to the opinions of people who are informed, who have considered the broader picture and who base them on the best information available at the time is equivalent to the media practice of giving equal coverage to unsubstantiated fringe perspectives.
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I'm not going to get into a point by point debate on a hypothetical, but obviously anyone that would argue for ending lockdowns and massive economic deregulation could make an array of arguments that the end results of deregulation are beneficial to society and offset those concerns, and this is exactly my point: don't assume that people who disagree with something have no legitimate basis for that position.

They may well NOT be ignorant of those factors. They may well take those factors into account, and know more about the long term downstream consequences of the position for which they advocate than their detractors.

It's not that nobody is ever wrong but starting from the position that there is any kind of consensus on a range of "valid" opinions and excluding anything outside that is a huge mistake IMO.
 
Burrow boy said:
I keep seeing ambulance attendants not wearing masks while together in cab of ambulance on north island .snapped a photo of one duo.
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I’m an RN when the paramedics show up on my floor for patients or with patients they always have on industrial N95’s with cartridges.

To the bigger picture of the pandemic. At the best of times we don’t have enough rooms and staff to run our hospitals properly. The current pandemic will devastate the healthcare system if even 10% of staff get it, especially when combined with the increased patient flow. Please where a mask (I do it for 12hrs with maybe 15mins of eating drinking time)
and keep your social outings few and far between.

And of course wash and sanitize your hands.
 
cracked_ribs said:
I'm not going to get into a point by point debate on a hypothetical, but obviously anyone that would argue for ending lockdowns and massive economic deregulation could make an array of arguments that the end results of deregulation are beneficial to society and offset those concerns, and this is exactly my point: don't assume that people who disagree with something have no legitimate basis for that position.

They may well NOT be ignorant of those factors. They may well take those factors into account, and know more about the long term downstream consequences of the position for which they advocate than their detractors.

It's not that nobody is ever wrong but starting from the position that there is any kind of consensus on a range of "valid" opinions and excluding anything outside that is a huge mistake IMO.
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Making an array of arguments doesn't mean that any of those arguments are valid, particularly when history suggests differently. Part of the process of winnowing down the vast array of opinions to the realistically possible invariably involves making some assumptions about validity, not really a difficult task for a critical thinker. Anything outside those assumptions doesn't neccesarily get discarded but quite correctly has a greater burden of proof. Accepting every opinion as equal leads to paralysis because the goal gets obscured by and lost in the process.

Having said that, only a fool doesn't keep an open mind.
 
absolon said:
Making an array of arguments doesn't mean that any of those arguments are valid, particularly when history suggests differently. Part of the process of winnowing down the vast array of opinions to the realistically possible invariably involves making some assumptions about validity, not really a difficult task for a critical thinker. Anything outside those assumptions doesn't neccesarily get discarded but quite correctly has a greater burden of proof. Accepting every opinion as equal leads to paralysis because the goal gets obscured by and lost in the process.

Having said that, only a fool doesn't keep an open mind.
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My experience is that most people believe that "history suggests" the opinions they hold are valid, whether they're arch-right capitalists or dyed-in-the-wool socialists.

All parties tend to overlook the weaknesses and failures of their own team, and instead search the extremely short list of successes for information that confirms what they already believe.
 
That's where the critical thinking part comes into play. I'll buy someone's opinion if it can be demonstrated that it is based on objective critical reasoning. Selective interpretation of history, intentional or not, is good reason to move on to the next idea.
 
absolon said:
That's where the critical thinking part comes into play. I'll buy someone's opinion if it can be demonstrated that it is based on objective critical reasoning. Selective interpretation of history, intentional or not, is good reason to move on to the next idea.
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If I ever see anyone argue on the basis of objective critical reasoning I'll certainly make a note of it.
 
It may not show up often in this sort of venue but it isn't that rare in the real world. The presentations tend not to be as spectacular as the fringe perspectives so not as easily noticed but they are out there.
 
Fish_whistle_express said:
I’m an RN when the paramedics show up on my floor for patients or with patients they always have on industrial N95’s with cartridges.

To the bigger picture of the pandemic. At the best of times we don’t have enough rooms and staff to run our hospitals properly. The current pandemic will devastate the healthcare system if even 10% of staff get it, especially when combined with the increased patient flow. Please where a mask (I do it for 12hrs with maybe 15mins of eating drinking time)
and keep your social outings few and far between.

And of course wash and sanitize your hands.
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I truly appreciate the hard work snd the service that you and your colleagues are providing to the people of this province. Thank you!
 
EnoG_FDVoAAGaN0


B.C. shattered its single-day record for new COVID-19 cases, confirming another 941 on Tuesday and 10 more deaths within the last 24 hours, as the province continued to urge everyone to put a pause on social interactions.

The Fraser Health region continued to drive the spike in new infections with 72 percent of the new cases occurring in that health region.

There are currently 284 people in hospital, up from 198 last Tuesday. Of that number, 61 are in intensive care.

The death toll now stands at 358, up from 310 a week ago, with 7,732 active cases of people infected with the disease in B.C.

Public health is actively monitoring 10,283 people across the province who are in self-isolation due to COVID-19 exposure.

In total, there have now been 28,348 confirmed cases of COVID-19 in B.C. since the pandemic began, and 19,605 people have recovered.

More here:
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/bc-coronavirus-update-november-24-2020-1.5814873
 
Aces said:
It’s idiots like this that make me want to lose my ****. Protesting wearing masks in Vancouver yesterday
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Agree 100%
When I see this it reminds me of this quote
“Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.” - Isaac Asimov
 
Our Blackface leader has **** the bed on a vaccine. My doctor says we will be lucky to have 8% of the population vaccinated by END of March. Mean while the USA & UK will be kicking off vaccine roll outs in 2 weeks. With millions of doses in December alone.

That @$$hole proroged parliament when he should have been working for us. He is more worried about fake climate change and destroying capitalism in our country.

Everyone loved to dump on Trump but he is the reason the USA has vaccines and an economy that will be roaring back way ahead of us. The media said no way we would see vaccines this year....

The federal government is the reason we will be stuck in this **** show longer than any other western country. The private sector and small businesses owners will be a endangered species in this country. That is were the anger needs to be pointed.
 
www.google.ca

Trump scores a long-awaited coronavirus win with vaccines on the way

President Donald Trump finally has something legitimate to take credit for in his coronavirus response: A vaccine that appears poised to reach Americans in record time.
www.google.ca www.google.ca

Ya you are right Scott. Typical left wing response. Write off anything positive the other side has done. Soon Biden will claim he is the reason for the vaccine and every liberal moron in North American will likely believe him.
 
Pineapple Express said:
So you're implying that you're an anti-masker (and climate change denier) but don't like society's rage directed at you?
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What??? Never said anything about being an anti-masker or a climate change denier.

As for Mask, I always wear one and have since the spring.

As for climate change, I dont deny that the climate is changing. I just am critical at how much man is affecting it. Today climate change has been so politicized and is used for anti capitalist agendas. But regardless climate change has nothing to do with covid.
 

The public lab that could have helped fight COVID-19 pandemic​

March 11, 2020


Canada once had a publicly owned pharmaceutical company that could have made a difference in the current coronavirus crisis — except that we sold it.

Connaught Labs was a superstar in global medicine. For seven decades, this publicly owned Canadian company performed brilliantly on the national and international stage, contributing to medical breakthroughs and developing affordable treatments and vaccines for deadly diseases.

Hated by its corporate competitors, Connaught was unique among pharmaceutical companies in that its focus was on human need, not profit.


It would have come in handy today.

In fact, Connaught got its start amid a diphtheria outbreak in 1913. Toronto doctor John Gerald FitzGerald was outraged that children were dying in large numbers even though there was a diphtheria treatment available from a U.S. manufacturer. But, at $25 a dose, it was unaffordable to all but the rich. FitzGerald set out to change that — and did.

After experimenting on a horse in a downtown Toronto stable, FitzGerald developed an antitoxin that proved effective in treating diphtheria, and made it available to public health outlets across the country. Then, with lab space provided by the University of Toronto, he and his team went on to produce low-cost treatments and vaccines for other common killers, including tetanus, typhoid and meningitis.

Connaught developed an impressive research capacity, with its scientists contributing to some of the biggest medical breakthroughs of the 20th century — including penicillin and the Salk and Sabin polio vaccines. It also played a central role in the global eradication of smallpox.


“It was a pioneer in a lot of ways,” says Colleen Fuller, a research associate of the Canadian Centre for Policy Alternatives. “It did things commercial companies wouldn’t do because they weren’t willing to take the financial risks.”

Fuller argues that if a publicly owned Connaught were still operating today, it could be contributing to the development of the coronavirus vaccine — and ensuring a Canadian supply if there was a global shortage.

Yet, tragically it isn’t.

Succumbing to corporate pressure and a misguided belief that the private sector always does things better, Brian Mulroney’s Progressive Conservative government privatized Connaught Labs in the 1980s. Today, what remains of this once-dazzling Canadian public enterprise has been taken over by a giant French pharmaceutical company.

The coronavirus outbreak may finally help expose the fallacy of the notion that the private marketplace is innately superior — which has been the guiding principle in Anglo-American countries (including Canada) for the past four decades, leading to the constant denigration of government and its functions.

Fortunately, Canada’s public health care system, established in the 1960s, has been so popular that it has survived, despite attacks of “socialized medicine” — although our political leaders have quietly whittled away funding for the system in recent decades.

https://www.thestar.com/opinion/con...d-have-helped-fight-covid-19-pandemic.html?rf
 
GLG said:
The coronavirus outbreak may finally help expose the fallacy of the notion that the private marketplace is innately superior
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That's just wishful thinking. That truism is as deeply ingrained as Adam Smith's idea that all economic decisions made by individuals are made rationally, based on full information and result in optimal outcomes for that individual.
 
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