All Things COVID-19

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SerengetiGuide said:
Maybe. But if in fact they have large herd immunity they won’t be worried about any second wave or third wave etc ....
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Coronavirus lockdown: Lessons from Hokkaido's second wave of infections
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-52305055
Second wave of COVID-19 could be worse than first in Canada: Research
https://torontosun.com/news/nationa...-could-be-worse-than-first-in-canada-research
LESSONS LEARNED REVIEW:
https://www.canada.ca/content/dam/p...orts-rapports/2010-2011/h1n1/pdf/h1n1-eng.pdf
Foxsea said:
What a load of elitist, neo-liberal nonsense.

"Prosperity is born of the creative crucible of markets and economic competition. The wealth we have enjoyed in this country is not God-given, natural or inevitable. Prosperity is born of the creative crucible of markets and economic competition. The wealth we have enjoyed in this country is not God-given, natural or inevitable."

The wealth of this country has been given away to the already wealthy. We socialize risk and privatize profit. We are living in a period of the greatest inequality in history. Prosperity has been enjoyed by the very few, well born or well connected.
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Thanks for the accurate critique, Foxsea. I find right-wing media and neo-liberal proponents seem to use nice-sounding motherhood catch phrases liberally in the hopes that they will catch people who like to self-identify with those words. Words like: "Prosperity" or "creative crucible" (whatever that is). And then they paint anyone who disagrees with their vision as "anti" - including health experts whom are trying to stem this pandemic. Worse than silly - irresponsible IMHO. Thanks for catching that.
 
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Foxsea said:
What a load of elitist, neo-liberal nonsense.

"Prosperity is born of the creative crucible of markets and economic competition. The wealth we have enjoyed in this country is not God-given, natural or inevitable. Prosperity is born of the creative crucible of markets and economic competition. The wealth we have enjoyed in this country is not God-given, natural or inevitable."

The wealth of this country has been given away to the already wealthy. We socialize risk and privatize profit. We are living in a period of the greatest inequality in history. Prosperity has been enjoyed by the very few, well born or well connected.
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Yah I think Chuck has you nailed to a tea lol.


Right, doing just fine. You are funny!! Sounds like what a public employee would say! Too many sheep being led around cuz, it's just easier!
 
And...we are veering off topic. Not really interested in having to post a daily reminder to keep this on track and away from the politics. Posting opinion pieces that relate to this thread because they contain one or two lines about the "Virus," but are mostly dedicated to talking about one's political leanings or agenda, are not sticking to the guidelines we have laid out for avoiding the inevitable derailment and fights that always occur, once we head down the ideological mantra path that accompanies these opinion pieces. Stick to things that are directed to the fight we are all in to deal with this virus and keep it focused on the latest updates that are at based on factual information.
And, I will add, we don't really care what political leaning you have, just not interested in hearing about it here.

Edit

In the time it took me to write the initial part of this post, the rebuttals have already proven my point of derailment and we are heading into the labelling of others that is inevitable.
 
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agentaqua said:
Coronavirus lockdown: Lessons from Hokkaido's second wave of infections
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-52305055
Second wave of COVID-19 could be worse than first in Canada: Research
https://torontosun.com/news/nationa...-could-be-worse-than-first-in-canada-research
Thanks for the accurate critique, Foxsea. I find right-wing media and neo-liberal proponents seem to use nice-sounding motherhood catch phrases liberally in the hopes that they will catch people who like to self-identify with those words. Words like: "Prosperity" or "creative crucible" (whatever that is). And then they paint anyone who disagrees with their vision as "anti" - including health experts whom are trying to stem this pandemic. Worse than silly - irresponsible IMHO. Thanks for catching that.
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What is the point of full scale lockdowns if the virus starts up again as soon as you resume any kind of normalcy? Locking down until there is a vaccine is not fiscally possible without consequences that will end up putting a huge number people, businesses, and whole countries into bankruptcy. Economic stability is directly correlated to long term health/wellness. People will die because of lockdown measures, we just won't have a worldmeter body count. Could the Sweden approach be correct? From a logic/reason view it appears that they are way closer to the 'right' approach than anywhere else. Balanced measures. If you look at Swedens deaths per day they appear to be flattening the curve and don't have an overwhelmed health care system. Please stop looking at linear graphs, they only point in one direction. According to our own Dr Bonnie Henry - 'Sweden is doing quite well.' My guess is her statement is a pre-cursor to the copycat game that will start sometime in the next couple weeks, with BC and Canada mimicking the same approach.
 
tightlines said:
What is the point of full scale lockdowns if the virus starts up again as soon as you resume any kind of normalcy? Locking down until there is a vaccine is not fiscally possible without consequences that will end up putting a huge number people, businesses, and whole countries into bankruptcy. Economic stability is directly correlated to long term health/wellness. People will die because of lockdown measures, we just won't have a worldmeter body count. Could the Sweden approach be correct? From a logic/reason view it appears that they are way closer to the 'right' approach than anywhere else. Balanced measures. If you look at Swedens deaths per day they appear to be flattening the curve and don't have an overwhelmed health care system. Please stop looking at linear graphs, they only point in one direction. According to our own Dr Bonnie Henry - 'Sweden is doing quite well.' My guess is her statement is a pre-cursor to the copycat game that will start sometime in the next couple weeks, with BC and Canada mimicking the same approach.
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The money says we need to open up and the money never looses.
 
agentaqua said:
Coronavirus lockdown: Lessons from Hokkaido's second wave of infections
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-52305055
Second wave of COVID-19 could be worse than first in Canada: Research
https://torontosun.com/news/nationa...-could-be-worse-than-first-in-canada-research
LESSONS LEARNED REVIEW:
https://www.canada.ca/content/dam/p...orts-rapports/2010-2011/h1n1/pdf/h1n1-eng.pdf
Thanks for the accurate critique, Foxsea. I find right-wing media and neo-liberal proponents seem to use nice-sounding motherhood catch phrases liberally in the hopes that they will catch people who like to self-identify with those words. Words like: "Prosperity" or "creative crucible" (whatever that is). And then they paint anyone who disagrees with their vision as "anti" - including health experts whom are trying to stem this pandemic. Worse than silly - irresponsible IMHO. Thanks for catching that.
Click to expand...

you can’t compare Sweden and japan. Completely different approaches. One going for here immunity (maybe missed that part of the post :confused:) and the other complete prevention. :rolleyes:
 
tightlines said:
What is the point of full scale lockdowns if the virus starts up again as soon as you resume any kind of normalcy? Locking down until there is a vaccine is not fiscally possible without consequences that will end up putting a huge number people, businesses, and whole countries into bankruptcy. Economic stability is directly correlated to long term health/wellness. People will die because of lockdown measures, we just won't have a worldmeter body count. Could the Sweden approach be correct? From a logic/reason view it appears that they are way closer to the 'right' approach than anywhere else. Balanced measures. If you look at Swedens deaths per day they appear to be flattening the curve and don't have an overwhelmed health care system. Please stop looking at linear graphs, they only point in one direction. According to our own Dr Bonnie Henry - 'Sweden is doing quite well.' My guess is her statement is a pre-cursor to the copycat game that will start sometime in the next couple weeks, with BC and Canada mimicking the same approach.
Click to expand...
I would say that the point is so we can reopen in a controlled fashion and build a herd immunity in a way that doesn’t overwhelm our already overwhelmed medical system. If we can slowly reopen into a socially distant ‘normal’ and keep the infections to a manageable amount then we are winning. I see that as road we’re on. Most businesses should be able to operate with fairly minor adaptations (mandatory mask use, sanitizer stations, strict distance policies). Tourism, restaurants, and sports will have the hardest time and will suffer for years to come I’m afraid.
 
I think the comparison for me goes: immunity might be chasing a rainbow; while complete prevention is chasing the pot of gold @ the end of that rainbow. In any event - the one with the least deaths is - to me - the most "successful" but comes with economic costs. Well actually, all approaches do - in one form or another eventually.

It is going to be tricky knowing when and how to slowly reopen. Those lessons are yet to be learned...
 
IronNoggin said:
This one directly effects me.
I am currently on one of the most powerful blood thinners ever developed...

Though novel coronavirus symptoms thus far have presented chiefly within the respiratory system, the infection is swiftly showing to be an all-out, system-wide assault that reaches far past the lungs. Doctors in hot spots across the globe have begun to report an unexpected prevalence of blood clotting among COVID cases, in what could pose a perfect storm of potentially fatal risk factors.

https://abcnews.go.com/Health/covid-19-patients-blood-clots/story?id=70131612
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Nog- Given that you are on blood thinners ( me too) perhaps that will provide a higher degree of protection from COVID associated blood clots.
 
tightlines said:
What is the point of full scale lockdowns if the virus starts up again as soon as you resume any kind of normalcy? Locking down until there is a vaccine is not fiscally possible without consequences that will end up putting a huge number people, businesses, and whole countries into bankruptcy. Economic stability is directly correlated to long term health/wellness. People will die because of lockdown measures, we just won't have a worldmeter body count. Could the Sweden approach be correct? From a logic/reason view it appears that they are way closer to the 'right' approach than anywhere else. Balanced measures. If you look at Swedens deaths per day they appear to be flattening the curve and don't have an overwhelmed health care system. Please stop looking at linear graphs, they only point in one direction. According to our own Dr Bonnie Henry - 'Sweden is doing quite well.' My guess is her statement is a pre-cursor to the copycat game that will start sometime in the next couple weeks, with BC and Canada mimicking the same approach.
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Sweden is sacrificing their older population with their policies. They had 172 people die yesterday and are at 192 deaths/million and Canada is at 50/million. As an older person i'm glad Canada is trying to protect us
 
Cuba Libre said:
Nog- Given that you are on blood thinners ( me too) perhaps that will provide a higher degree of protection from COVID associated blood clots.
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My thoughts as well.
Setting up to chat with my Sawbones soon, and will be bring that up as it is in direct contrast to earlier thoughts on this matter.
Letcha know what he says...

Nog
 
I believe we are almost 38 million in Canada right now. Sweden population is just over 10 million. Canada right now total deaths 1728, and Sweden is 1765.
We here 3 times population, so social distancing is working. Getting tired of this argument that we should just let the old people deal with it. . It is coming mostly from the US because they want to re-open now, and it's being pushed by industry/not health workers. Comparing any place in the US to place like Sweden is ridiculous. No way in hell should we be taking risks here.
 
U.S. DIPLOMATIC MISSION TO CANADA

Message to U.S. Citizens in Canada:  Recent COVID-19 Developments in Canada

April 21, 2020

Location:  Canada 

Event: Recent COVID-19 Developments in Canada

Information:

Border Restrictions Extended

The U.S. and Canadian governments agreed to extend cross-border travel restrictions to non-essential travel for an additional 30 days from April 21. Non-essential travel includes tourism, recreation, and entertainment. Essential travel still permitted includes: work and study, critical infrastructure support, economic services and supply chains, health, immediate medical care, and safety and security. Land borders are operating at reduced capacity and with limited hours. Travellers entering Canada must present a credible 14-day quarantine plan. Visit CBP and CBSA for details.

Face Coverings on Flights

All passengers on flights departing or arriving at Canadian airports are now required to wear a non-medical mask or face covering that covers their mouth and nose. Face coverings are required at all screening checkpoints, when physical distance cannot be maintained, and as directed by a public health official. Check the Canadian Government's COVID-19 travel restrictions and exemptions page for additional information. Note: Canadian authorities continue to ask the public to reserve medical masks for healthcare workers and first responders.


Protect Yourself from Fraud

The Canadian Anti-Fraud Centre warns of an increase in fraudulent actors seeking to exploit businesses, individuals, and institutions during the COVID-19 pandemic. Schemes include email phishing, fake telephone calls for assistance, and unproven treatments to “cure” COVID-19. Please contact local police if you think you are a victim of a fraud scheme. Visit the Canadian Anti-Fraud Centre for more information. You can also visit the FBI’s COVID-19 page for fraud prevention information.
 
SpringVelocity said:
I believe we are almost 38 million in Canada right now. Sweden population is just over 10 million. Canada right now total deaths 1728, and Sweden is 1765.
We here 3 times population, so social distancing is working. Getting tired of this argument that we should just let the old people deal with it. . It is coming mostly from the US because they want to re-open now, and it's being pushed by industry/not health workers. Comparing any place in the US to place like Sweden is ridiculous. No way in hell should we be taking risks here.
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Chinese scientists have found that Europe and America’s East Coast have been infected by some of the most aggressive Covid-19 strains, as they discovered dozens of virus mutations. These destroy a host’s cells faster than others.
The ability of the novel coronavirus to mutate has been previously vastly underestimated, a team from China’s Zhejiang University, led by Professor Li Lanjuan, says in a new study. The group found as many as 33 virus mutations in just 11 coronavirus patients they examined in the city of Hangzhou.

The researchers say that 60 percent of the strains they discovered turned out to be entirely new. In a worrying development, they also discovered that the virus’s mutations directly affect its deadliness. Their research revealed that the most aggressive type of Covid-19 could create a virus load 270 times greater than the least potent one
 
terrin said:
Chinese scientists have found that Europe and America’s East Coast have been infected by some of the most aggressive Covid-19 strains, as they discovered dozens of virus mutations. These destroy a host’s cells faster than others.
The ability of the novel coronavirus to mutate has been previously vastly underestimated, a team from China’s Zhejiang University, led by Professor Li Lanjuan, says in a new study. The group found as many as 33 virus mutations in just 11 coronavirus patients they examined in the city of Hangzhou.

The researchers say that 60 percent of the strains they discovered turned out to be entirely new. In a worrying development, they also discovered that the virus’s mutations directly affect its deadliness. Their research revealed that the most aggressive type of Covid-19 could create a virus load 270 times greater than the least potent one
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They also don't no if this virus is going to be like some a lay dormant in your system for years and reactivate at some point. They really don't no anything about the virus yet. They don't no how infectious it is, they don't no how many people have been infected, they dont no if it gives you immunity or how long you have immunity for.
 
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wildmanyeah said:
They also don't no if this virus is going to be like some a lay dormant in your system for years and reactivate at some point. They really don't no anything about the virus yet. They don't no how infectious it is, they don't no how many people have been infected, they dont no if it gives you immunity or how long you have immunity for.
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Agreed. Good reasons to be rigorous in responding to Covid 19 and very cautious in easing up on the social restrictions presently in place.
 
Not an expert by any means, but studied alot, know my statistics, and think logically. Not what some left or right media tries to shove down my throat.

Sweden - herd immunity? As I understand, you need 80-90% infection without a vaccine for this to be effective. While that 'may' work in Sweden with a younger population (and over 50% are single households), here...US...others? Just don't see it. How exactly do we 'protect' our elders? Say they are at a care home - ok, someone has to take care of them! Good chance they are a parent themselves. Now what? Kids back in school - they get infected, pass on to parent = pass on to the worker = infect the care home! Are they expected to isolate indefinitely from their child? Who feeds the child? Who takes the child to school? etc etc They could sift through workers that don't have family, but that wouldn't be enough I'm sure!

Remember also, Sweden is a rural country (besides Stockholm) - they are much more younger than us in NA, healthier, and thinner (ie, obesity as a known underlying condition concern is not so much an issue there). Their model would have been and would be too dangerous here.

I mean we talk about the herd immunity thing, but H1N1? There were only 45000 cases in Canada from most sources although I see others stating up to 10% of our population got it. It went away and 10% is no where near the immunity threshold. Can we not assume same potential and no need to 'attempt' to infect all of us? I don't want to gamble on which strain I get when there are mild or severe ones out there, but like 9 to choose from!

Just my thoughts here!
 
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