Salish sea seals eat 86% of smolts

the science is usually correct or the closest guess to meant to the facts gather at the time of the particular study..politics is what it is.... the leopard cannot change it spots...
 
I agree we should manage by the science but that doesnt mean its not up for interpretation. For example are their to0 many seal if we stop all comercial, sportfishing, aboriginal fishing ect... Or is there just to many seals for our current harvest model?

DFO used to give permits to kill seals around hatcheries such as qualicum hatchery. Why don't we start with the habituated seals first?. Over 100 habituated black bears a year are killed in the lower mainland a year and there is not an uproar.

The science by itself is never going to say we need to cull seals, The science will only say we need to cull seals if we want X based on X. What we want will always be up for interpretation by politics or interest groups.

If we agree to leave it up to nature, nature is not balanced. Nature is full of feast/famine. We could see chinook numbers go to nothing, then SRKW nothing, then seal go to nothing. Then it all turn around and only take like 500 years.
 
This just maybe one of those times perhaps.....do we want to save the whales or ?

as the nature argument goes, nature will adapt perhaps whales may eat seals one day...

I for one don't believe in it but many groups out there do

More food for all seems to be a nice solution tho, More Herring ect, more work needs to be done on bait fish ect
 
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as the nature argument goes, nature will adapt perhaps whales may eat seals one day...

I for one don't believe in it but many groups out there do

Wow.... who are these groups as I'm sure the members could use a good laugh.
 
as the nature argument goes, nature will adapt perhaps whales may eat seals one day...

I for one don't believe in it but many groups out there do

More food for all seems to be a nice solution tho, More Herring ect, more work needs to be done on bait fish ect



u never know perhaps more herring ect will also be part of the solution... its a complex web......I for one believe there will be may layers and recommendation to help work towards a long term solution...
 
Wow.... who are these groups as I'm sure the members could use a good laugh.

I'm surprised you have to ask but many ENGO's

"In a recent article by Wolf Awareness Executive Director Sadie Parr and Paul Paquet, a senior scientist with Raincoast Conservation Foundation, Parr and Paquet say this proposal damages the integrity of scientific inquiry. They write, "We believe experimental wolf kill programs are unwarranted and unethical, and should be replaced with adequate habitat protection." "

https://pacificwild.org/news-and-re...-kill-wolves-government-scientists-admit-wolf

Again this ties into the Grizzly Bears and all apex predators ect...

I would post up hundreds of links of ENGO's that support the no human interference mythology. Basically they save the predators. then when the predators have no food they start attacking humans for habitat destruction/hunting/fishing. Its the let nature be nature philosophy it's really the heart of the mentality of most of these group.

some people out their just have this believe, their called hippies lots on vancouver island, Quadra island, cortes island, Eco bay. You know the type of people that power their homes with rainbows and buttercups.
 
Management by science is the only answer in my opinion, and has worked elsewhere around the world. I refuse to comment on the Raincoast fools. They have a very specific agenda and it has nothing to do with saving or helping any species.

I would like a government that "obeys" listens to and then acts on the recommendations of knowledgeable people within the field of expertise. If its seals, bycatch or sport fishermen then implement actions. Not thinking this will happen in current BC.

HM
 
u never know perhaps more herring ect will also be part of the solution... its a complex web......I for one believe there will be may layers and recommendation to help work towards a long term solution...

Will be nice to read the 2017 salish project results. Then the 2018 report that puts numbers and so forth on there study. Because the government wont go easy with the seal cull idea, I think you will start seeing deep sea releases to avoid the predators. Look at the Seymour smolt study. They release now at point Atkinson and there was a tremendous increase in escapement. Look at the cowichan a 40% increase by releasing smolts 40kms downstream, only to have 40-50% eaten at river mouth. Look at chilko Chinook, 40 tags release all but one die at farewell canyon. Non make it to sea..... Complex
 
There is no doubt that wildlife management will have to be part of the solution to increasing the number of smolts that survive upon ocean entry. I would suggest that we use terms that are used in other areas like predator management to describe what we are thinking as other terms are not public friendly. This is just one tool in box with others like staggered smolt release.
 
Don't for get chemistry and the rest of the food web like macro invertebrates!! The root of it all.

I'm never going to give this up! lol

It certainly could be one piece of the puzzle! The prey species like herring I think are important too. It doesn't seem a coincidence that seals in the Salish Sea became smolt eaters the same time we were vacuuming up herring stocks to commercial extinction in many areas of the SS. Howe Sound stocks were almost wiped out, hopefully now that they are rebuilding a wasteful herring fishery isn't restarted there . Will rebounding herring stocks help ease the pressure on seals eating smolts? Maybe not now that SS seals have learned to key on the hatchery smolt releases, but there are clearly other forces at play as well. Allowing for seal predation there are still 20 million more Chinook smolts venturing out into the SS than there were in 1975 but less adults returning. If some proportion of the 20+ million smolts seals eat in the SS were saved through hunts, they may just die other ways (disease, starvation, parasites, predation by other species) as all the rest of the increased smolt production does compared to the dynamics in the 1975 ecosystem.
 
It should be noted also that seals are both our friends and our enemies when it comes to salmon. The majority of them don't prey on salmon smolts, they prey on fish predators of salmon smolts. So that means wildlife management needs to be very specific to area and individuals.
 
can we not spay and neuter them like wild cats?

Maybe a better option is phocine distemper virus (PDV). Harbour seal populations in the UK and North Western Europe were negatively affected by epidemics in 1988 and 2002. In 2002 an estimated 50% of the seal population died in that epidemic. How do we get an outbreak of that here in BC? It would at least temporarily reduce the population naturally, and the Vancouver Aquarium wouldn't be able to save all the sick seals!

Sterilization is a good thought, there are fertility vaccines that have been used on wild horse populations. (PZP vaccines, SpayVac, GonaCon) some of which can be delivered by dart, although hand injection is more effective. Potentially some could last long enough to last a whole breeding season and may reduce the likelihood of fertilization in subsequent years. I assume they could be effective for any mammal. Maybe that's a route that could be investigated that would not involve killing or even capturing the animals, so could be acceptable for the public, and might be effective at reducing their reproductive rate. The females with young pups could be darted before they go into heat about 6 weeks after pupping and are often out of the water with the young pups. It would be very expensive by the time the vaccines are purchased and the vaccines are administered though as seals are spread out on every rock outcrop in the Salish Sea, and with a harbour seal life span of 25-30 years they would need to be re-vaccinated frequently.
 
It certainly could be one piece of the puzzle! The prey species like herring I think are important too. It doesn't seem a coincidence that seals in the Salish Sea became smolt eaters the same time we were vacuuming up herring stocks to commercial extinction in many areas of the SS. Howe Sound stocks were almost wiped out, hopefully now that they are rebuilding a wasteful herring fishery isn't restarted there . Will rebounding herring stocks help ease the pressure on seals eating smolts? Maybe not now that SS seals have learned to key on the hatchery smolt releases, but there are clearly other forces at play as well. Allowing for seal predation there are still 20 million more Chinook smolts venturing out into the SS than there were in 1975 but less adults returning. If some proportion of the 20+ million smolts seals eat in the SS were saved through hunts, they may just die other ways (disease, starvation, parasites, predation by other species) as all the rest of the increased smolt production does compared to the dynamics in the 1975 ecosystem.

Yes, those herring and other small species are very important too! I'm not so convinced fishing has been the only reason for herring stock depressions. Almost half of B.c. drains into the SS. As low ph fresh water with contamination meets and mixes with salt water there will be a rise in ph that would cause precipitation of those contaminants. I feel this natural effect of chemistry could better explain depressions in many species other than salmon like starfish, shellfish, herring and countless other not monitored that could have low tolerance to contaminated water. In the early 1990's it starts with most of the east VI streams loose there invertebrate populations and salmonid species follow suite. Whatever caused the collapse in those rivers and many more has flowed directly into the SS. And then it goes where??? It goes nowhere fast.
As much as eliminating seals could save a few salmon or steelhead my feelings are it wouldn't do much at all. Seals could be just taking advantage of salmon smolts that were destined to dye from the damaging effects caused in transition from fresh to salt. When a boat enters FW from salt it looses buoyancy so it would be a given that this same effect is confronting salmon smolts along with the challenges of finding food.
Something worth studying is the effects on salmon smolts transferring from fresh to the marine environment and how the continually changing chemistry effects this transition. Just because the water is clear doesn't mean it is suitable for ecology to thrive.
As for enhancement increasing smolt production, yes it could be directly feeding the population of habituated seals but with a few changes to enhancement practices this occurrence could be minimalized.
It seems there is a lot more effort put into studying salmon disease than there is in studying the basics of ecology which starts with suitable chemistry.
My opinion.
 
So we basically have been resigned to the fact we will allow our elected officials to make ****** policy decisions because "we understand" its a hard sell to dim witted millennials and the washed up commie...errr, Green movements.

We really are doomed.
 
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