Northern Gateway APPROVED

[IronNoggin]

... Frankly it makes you look bad.

From where I'm standing, methinks he doesn't need a whole lot of help in that regard.

Cheers,
Nog

 

[soxy]

From where I'm standing, methinks he doesn't need a whole lot of help in that regard.

Cheers,
Nog

Back at ya all. I could care less what you brainwashed Suzuki, Morton fans think.

Hey Noggin if you are so concerned about the environment why don't you and those cowards over at Rods demand the Cheam band open up their supposedly non toxic dump site which is 1000 times worse than any regulated hazard waste treatment plant. Hmmmmm? I used to bar fish for sturgeon years ago right there and could see them dumping buckets of paint cans and paint pails.

 

[Englishman]

Suzuki, conservative gutter press and climate change deniers

PART 1

http://joannenova.com.au/2013/09/david-suzuki-bombs-on-qa-knows-nothing-about-the-climate/

http://motls.blogspot.ca/2011/04/david-suzuki-wife-despair-huddle-at.html

http://www.quebecoislibre.org/001014-11.htm

http://townhall.com/columnists/davi...vid_suzuki_insults,_but_wont_debate/page/full

http://www.torontosun.com/2013/11/06/david-suzuki-the-fallen-saint

Soxy, unable to meet the challenge of justifying your specious comparison of Suzuki to Levant you link to the above articles. These are some of the most vitriolic and vicious examples of personal attack on an individual I have ever seen. The second one in particular goes after an older man (he is 77), who dares to bare his heart and feelings, in a most vile way and even insinuates he need psychiatric help. It is gutter press at its very worst.
And the truly astonishing and unbelievable thing is you clearly think that by attacking the man and “shooting the messenger” this means the climate change is not true. Instead these typical examples of conservative attack and spin in no way refute the vast amount of scientific evidence and information out there on global climate change. They simply provide you with a convenient rational mind warping way of ignoring the evidence.

Right, left or center aside ... flying continually around the world, 4
houses (one co-owned with an oil company no less) tells us a lot more
about Suzuki than the token Prius he purchased.

Nope this is all lies and false accusations.

http://www.davidsuzuki.org/blogs/pa...gations-pollute-the-well-of-public-discourse/

This article explains in detail how Levant has twisted and spun the true facts.

http://www2.macleans.ca/2013/11/18/the-nature-of-david-suzuki/

The David Suzuki Foundation also received donations from EnCana Corporation, a world leader in natural gas production and oil sands development, ATCO Gas,
Alberta’s principle distributor of natural gas, and a number of pension
funds including the OPG (Ontario Power Generation) Employees’ and
Pensioners’ Charity Trust. OPG is one of the largest suppliers of
electricity in the world operating 5 fossil fuel-burning generation
plants and 3 nuclear plants. Suzuki has left a carbon footprint large
enough for a small town, the hypocrite.

This is an old quote from the gutter press which deliberately leaves out the important words I have highlighted below, which are taken from the link here..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Suzuki_Foundation

“Many years ago, before the Foundation implemented its Ethical Gift Acceptance Policy, corporate donors included EnCana Corporation, a world leader in natural gas production and oil sands development, and ATCO Gas, Alberta’s principle distributor of natural gas….”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Suzuki_Foundation

I feel very sorry for Suzuki. He has to suffer all these personal attacks and act as a lightning rod for all the ill-informed scientifically illiterate media hacks and climate deniers out there. No wonder he is beaten up and sounding despondent and tired. Even this right wing National Post writer admits that anthropogenic caused global warming is taking place near the end of the article but explains how that libellous bully Ezra Levant is conducting a personal vendetta as part of his PR war.

http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com...ra-is-making-media-mincemeat-of-saint-suzuki/

 

[Englishman]

PART 2

http://blogs.news.com.au/dailyteleg...egraph/comments/david_suzuki_drives_me_crazy/

http://www.c3headlines.com/2013/09/...oft-underbelly-of-consensus-scary-ignora.html

Two more examples of gutter press ad hominem attacks on Suzuki the man. Since you have chosen to quote directly from one of the links I will analyse and refute each of them here.

One of the world's "elite" and celebrity scientists, and a major force in global warming alarmism, provided a Twilight Zone interview (details here and here) in Australia.

That interview confirms the worst about most scientists who support the "consensus" science hyping catastrophic global warming/climate change alarmism.

David Suzuki's comments epitomize the vast majority of today's "consensus" scientists in several ways.

The writer clearly does not know what he is talking about and does not know what scientific consensus means. It has nothing to do with ideology based consensus decision making in a political forum about some policy or other. This consensus is about what thousands of scientist from around the world have concluded from 30 years of observation, study, evidence and published results in thousands of peer-reviewed papers. More details here.

http://climate.nasa.gov/scientific-consensus
http://www.skepticalscience.com/global-warming-scientific-consensus.htm
http://www.theguardian.com/environm...n/06/climate-change-climate-change-scepticism

First, the ignorance of the actual global warming and climate change science is legendary regarding the "consensus" community, which Suzuki proved in spades. These alarmist scientists eagerly accept future climate simulations as empirical evidence, bizarrely not realizing the model output is 'simulated', not even possibly qualifying to be considered empirical evidence.

This is such a stupid statement I just shake my head. The writer completely ignores that fact that there is a huge amount of scientific data and evidence out there about the past 30 years (and way before that if you look at ice cores) that clearly shows what is happening. Here are just a few articles of hundreds out there, which in this case refute with the denier myth that global warming has “stopped”.

http://www.smh.com.au/environment/c...l-warming-stopped-in-1998-20130927-2ui8j.html
http://www.skepticalscience.com/global-cooling-january-2007-to-january-2008.htm
http://grist.org/climate-energy/is-global-warming-really-slowing-down/
http://www.slate.com/blogs/bad_astr...ming_new_study_shows_pause_doesn_t_exist.html
http://theenergycollective.com/davidhone/171291/has-climate-change-stopped-global-warming

The scientifically ignorant writer has no idea that models are built on hard data and predictions into the future have uncertainty and margins of error. The general accuracy of the current climate models is explained here.

http://www.skepticalscience.com/climate-models.htm
http://www.epa.gov/climatechange/science/future.html
http://www.theguardian.com/environm...t/01/ipcc-global-warming-projections-accurate

Second, Suzuki's reliance on what the "climatologists to tell us" and "wait for the IPCC report" smacks of the fanatical faith in a religion, accepting the priestly proclamations when properly delivered, instead of acting like an actual scientist who thinks about, questions and challenges the orthodox science. One immediately knows that they are listening to a fanatic when these or similar utterances are heard, and unfortunately, the majority of "consensus" scientists say the same.

Another even more stupid statement. To try and liken someone who accepts all of the scientific evidence out there from THOUSANDS of scientists that has been reviewed by HUNDREDS of international experts in the IPCC as some sort of “religious faith” is so patently ridiculous it beggars belief.

Unlike scientists who do think, examine real EVIDENCE and question all the time, conservative writers like this one themselves ignore all the evidence and denigrate the entire scientific community because it is they whose minds are blinded and twisted by fundamentalist motivated “blind faith”. The above quote Soxy is the most breathtaking example of twisting reality backwards I have ever seen.

Third, the fact that Suzuki does not have even possess a sliver of actual, real world climate science reveals a complete utter contempt for the public and taxpayers. It is they who will have to shoulder a multi-trillion dollar burden of changing from a fossil-fueled civilization that Suzuki and his like-minded alarmist-scientist flock proposes and demands.

David Suzuki has never claimed to be a climate scientist. Instead he has taken on the role of public spokesperson for the scientific community and suffers badly at the hands of conservative climate change deniers as a result. It is the conservatives themselves who show utter contempt for the public and especially the young and those in vulnerable countries. Millions of those will lose their livelihood and the public in richer countries will have to pay trillions in coastal defences in an attempt to mitigate or prevent the effects of climate change and sea level rise.

As with the previous 'Today's Climate Denier-Liar-BSer' personalities, David Suzuki should not be believed or trusted regarding any statement on global warming and climate change. Objectively, anything he says is highly likely to be false. End of story.

On the contrary, David Suzuki promotes the findings of a huge body of science and the work of thousands of scientists. That evidence is the only thing to be believed. Certainly all the “pseudoscience” perpetrated by climate change deniers and called out below is ignorant, ill-informed and promoted by a conservative minority who cling like fundamentalist to their “develop and be damned” ideas.

http://www.usnews.com/news/articles...rming-deniers-wrong-to-reference-polar-vortex
http://www.salon.com/2013/12/18/7_ways_to_shut_down_a_climate_change_denier_partner/
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Global_warming_denialism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_change_denial

It is facts and science that should decide the outcome of this debate. Not scientifically ignorant conservative media hit men who write vile and vitriolic lies like the writers you quote Soxy.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/10/03/opinion/let-science-set-the-facts.html?_r=1&

 

[chris73]

Don't get too worked up about a few clowns, english. That's just the way they click and some of them really think in such distorted ways. Nothing will change their weird ways. All you can do is shake your head, grin and leave them be. Some others are paid to say dumb stuff and as long as the pay is good they will keep doing it no matter what you throw at them. You gotta focus your energy where you can actually make progress.

 

[soxy]

Last I heard Harper had a majority. All clowns and distorted ways of thinking you figure? This board has its share of hogwash anti everything posters including yourself. Go tiptoe through the tulips and escape reality like the rest of the wackos.

 

[Sharphooks]

I think what's going on in the Deniers Camp is a bit more insidious. The decibel level of the anti-science naysayers both in Canada and in the US has grown in direct proportion to the amount of condensate inventories looking for a market in Texas and Alberta's need to purchase that condensate to pump out their own growing bitumen inventories.

The money trail is interesting if you go back a decade or so---it began with Phillip Morris hiring "scientists" who were paid handsomely to start debunking the accepted science of the time regarding the physiological harms of second-hand smoke.

That business model caught the attention of Big Oil ---if a group of "scientists" could stall anti-tobacco legislation by sowing doubt and loathing in the peer-reviewed scientific community, why couldn't they do the same for antagonistic legislation that didn't quite help out Big Oil's bottom line? It wasn't long before that group of "scientists" started getting direct contributions from Exxon to promote that very purpose.

With the Right Wing radio and TV commentators picking up the ball in conjunction with the anti Cap and Trade conservative political parties, the anti-science group is now a rabid dog. People who have zero skin in the game have now jumped into the fray. It's stunning to me how much momentum they have garnered with ABSOLUTELY ZERO scientific evidence offered to counter the peer reviewed scientific data supporting the FACT that Global Warming and the almost certain damages this climate change will cause to various coastal and temperate regions of the globe is absolutely and irrefutably linked to man's use of fossil fuels and further, that mankind as a species is rapidly reaching the point of no return as to whether or not he can even begin to abate the current and potential damages caused by these greenhouse gas emissions.

The following from a Bill Moyers blog

QUOTE

SEPT. 27, 2013

For the first time, the world’s top climate change scientists have endorsed an upper limit on greenhouse gas emissions, establishing a target level for curbing emissions that if not achieved could lead to irreversible and potentially catastrophic climatic changes.

In a report released today by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), the UN’s climate panel, scientists also said that the target is likely to be exceeded in a matter of decades unless steps are taken soon to reduce emissions. To contain these changes will require “substantial and sustained reductions of greenhouse gas emissions,” the scientists said.

The panel hopes that its latest report will help move international policymakers toward agreement on a new climate treaty, as negotiations have stalled in recent years. The report also concluded that many of the observed changes in climate since 1950 were “unprecedented over decades to millennia” and that over half of the temperature increases were man-made.

“Our assessment of the science finds that the atmosphere and ocean have warmed, the amount of snow and ice has diminished, the global mean sea level has risen and that concentrations of greenhouse gases have increased,” said Qin Dahe, co-chair of the IPCC working group that produced the report.

http://billmoyers.com/2013/09/27/action-urgently-needed-on-climate-change/

UNQUOTE

If I were to post the above on an average outdoor sports type website in the Eastern and South Eastern portion of the USA, I would immediately be hooted down with venomous scorn. The reoccurring theme would be---"typical group of brain-dead scientists creating controversy and hysteria where there is none, all in their typical greedy attempt to milk more grant money from the gubment..."

The "scientists" who originally initiated this campaign of fear and loathing must be sitting back in their armchairs, congratulating each other on their stunning coup --- they don't have to lift a finger---they have veritable ARMIES of guys like Soxy to do all the heavy lifting on Climate Change Denial and they don't have to offer one shred of scientific evidence to buttress their "hoax" claims--- it's all just a matter of what decibel level their Denier Minions are willing to use to drown out the chorus coming from the scientific community ( "tiptoe through the tulips" is a song you can sing at a very LOUD LEVEL if you have a guy with a ukelele willing to plug it into an amplifier)

All this Tempest in a Tea Party Pot calls to mind a quote from Lionel Trilling made in the 1950's that could just have easily have been made today to sum up this anti-science/anti-scientist/anti scientific data stance:

QUOTE

...."In the United States at this time Liberalism is not only the dominant but even the sole intellectual tradition.

For it is the plain fact that nowadays there are no conservative or reactionary ideas in general circulation. This does not mean, of course, that there is no impulse to conservatism or to reaction. Such impulses are certainly very strong, perhaps even stronger than most of us know.

But the conservative impulse and the reactionary impulse do not, with some isolated and some ecclesiastical exceptions, express themselves in ideas but only in action or in irritable mental gestures which seek to resemble ideas...."

UNQUOTE

As Rome smolders, Ottawa burns books and New Jersey blocks bridges.

 

[Foxsea]

...The money trail is interesting if you go back a decade or so---it began with Phillip Morris hiring "scientists" who were paid handsomely to start debunking the accepted science of the time regarding the physiological harms of second-hand smoke.

That business model caught the attention of Big Oil ---if a group of "scientists" could stall anti-tobacco legislation by sowing doubt and loathing in the peer-reviewed scientific community, why couldn't they do the same for antagonistic legislation that didn't quite help out Big Oil's bottom line? It wasn't long before that group of "scientists" started getting direct contributions from Exxon to promote that very purpose.
...

DOUBT
[YhDacrl1aSA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YhDacrl1aSA&feature=youtu.be

 

[soxy]

Oh yeah.....
http://www.sunnewsnetwork.ca/video/...2237001/professional-protesters/3029461198001

 

[SerengetiGuide]

I like to think I'm non partisan, typically economically slightly right, socially middle of the row. Will not be voting Conservative this upcoming election, probably anti Conservative vote (aka whoever can beat them), but with that being said, David Suzuki is one of the largest hypocrites to walk this Earth. Just as there is Conservative propaganda, do you really think Mr Suzuki is above all that? No chance, most of the things he spews is just that, propaganda, look at his stance on GMO's and how it goes exactly opposite of that of what SCIENCE (which many of you talk about on here) actually says. Did you guys not see his Q and A period in Australia? Suzuki spews just as much BS as the Conservatives and anti climate change propaganda machines. The actual truth is probably half way between what both say

Mr Suzuki owns mansions, a very large yacht (saw it and him in Port Hardy in 2009), and makes his fortune off of essentially fear mongering. While his intentions may be pure (I, nor you, know his intentions, they may not be pure), he still takes an extremist view which is unsubstantiated by science. Look at his predictions on ocean levels as well as ice levels by 2020, no chance they will be even close, he purposely exaggerates to gain media attention and scare people into changing their ways.

 

[GLG]

Attacking the messenger is a sign of a weak argument.
It's the message that is important.
So here we have it.... is GW true or false.
Three questions to ask to cut through the BS.

1. Does CO2 trap heat?
2. Is the concentration of CO2 rising?
3. Are we responsible for that rise?

As you may have guessed, the answer to all three arguments is “yes”.

First: We have known that CO2 has trapped heat for over 150 years. We know because John Tyndall stuck some CO2 in a box with a thermometer in it, shone some light through it, and found that the temp was higher when there was more CO2. This experiment has been used in school for years to teach children science.
http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/Features/Tyndall/

Second: Keeling Curve. 52 years of direct measurements of CO2

Third: Turns out, we’ve emitted twice as much CO2 from the burning of fossil fuels as is necessary to account for the rise in CO2. The other half has been absorbed by our friend the ocean, and is causing ocean acidification. The data go back to 1751, and come from fuel production data.

In summary, CO2 traps heat, the concentration of CO2 is rising, and humans have dumped twice as much CO2 into the atmosphere as is necessary to account for that rise. We have a gun, the gun is smoking, and we pulled the trigger.


The rest is BS to hide the truth and to use a phrase from Harper.
Look we have Pandas.... or Look I'm dumping the penny.
Anyone that attacks the messenger is falling for the Panda/Penny line.

Disclosure Copy/paste from around the web to save time and why reinvent the wheel.

 

[soxy]

LOL...do you know how stupid this sounds?" We know because John Tyndall stuck some CO2 in a box with a thermometer in it, shone some light through it, and found that the temp was higher when there was more CO2. This experiment has been used in school for years to tech children science."
So this is crap that you base global warming on?
Let alone man made global warming. If that's what you call proof, a childrens experiment you are sadly out of touch, just like Suzuki.
Just wondering about you and a few others that seem to only post in this section and all the political crap, do you actually fish?? Do you have any actual fishing posts pertinent to this forum? Why don't you just go to a political forum and spew your anti government rhetorical analysis.

 

[GLG]

Prove me wrong....
No you can't... all you can do is attack me.
Bright...

And in other news.....

Sun News (The Faux Report)—The so-called polar vortex caused hundreds of injuries across the Midwest today, as people who said “so much for global warming” and similar comments were punched in the face.

Authorities in several cites said that residents who had made ignorant comments erroneously citing the brutally cold temperatures as proof that climate change did not exist were reporting a sharp increase in injuries to the face and head regions.

In an emergency room in St. Joe's, Ezra Levant, forty-one, was waiting to be treated for bruising to the facial area after he made a crack about how the below-freezing temperatures meant that climate-change activists were full of shyt.

“I’d just finished saying it and boom, out of nowhere someone punched me in the face,” he said. “This polar vortex is really dangerous.”

The meteorology professor Dave Logstock, of the University of Toronto, issued a safety warning to residents of the province hammered by the historic low temperatures: “If you are living within the range of the polar vortex and you have something idiotic to say about climate change, do not leave your house.”

 

[GLG]

Why don't you just go to a political forum and spew your anti government rhetorical analysis.

I joined March 2007 and you joined November 2013
And you think I should leave ..... what have you brought to this forum?
A quick read of you past posts show why you came here.
You like to argue but your falling short with your logic.

 

[Big Green Machine]

do you actually fish?? Do you have any actual fishing posts pertinent to this forum?

I've fished with him so I can verify that he does fish. Lol. Soxy, what do you have to say about the latest polls suggesting that Harper and the Conservatives have a 60% disapproval rating? Mostly because he refuses to keep an open mind about scientific research, IMO. I know, polls are not always accurate, look at the Liberal win in the past BC election, but come on.

 

[chris73]

LOL...do you know how stupid this sounds?" We know because John Tyndall stuck some CO2 in a box with a thermometer in it, shone some light through it, and found that the temp was higher when there was more CO2. This experiment has been used in school for years to tech children science."
So this is crap that you base global warming on?
Let alone man made global warming. If that's what you call proof, a childrens experiment you are sadly out of touch, just like Suzuki.
Just wondering about you and a few others that seem to only post in this section and all the political crap, do you actually fish?? Do you have any actual fishing posts pertinent to this forum? Why don't you just go to a political forum and spew your anti government rhetorical analysis.

Wow, your intelligence is really starting to shine now! Thanks for the laugh! lol

 

[soxy]

Prove me wrong....
No you can't... all you can do is attack me.
Bright...

And in other news.....

Sun News (The Faux Report)—The so-called polar vortex caused hundreds of injuries across the Midwest today, as people who said “so much for global warming” and similar comments were punched in the face.

Authorities in several cites said that residents who had made ignorant comments erroneously citing the brutally cold temperatures as proof that climate change did not exist were reporting a sharp increase in injuries to the face and head regions.

In an emergency room in St. Joe's, Ezra Levant, forty-one, was waiting to be treated for bruising to the facial area after he made a crack about how the below-freezing temperatures meant that climate-change activists were full of shyt.

“I’d just finished saying it and boom, out of nowhere someone punched me in the face,” he said. “This polar vortex is really dangerous.”

Now the real article..

From The New Yorker: The so-called polar vortex caused hundreds of injuries across the Midwest today, as people who said “so much for global warming” and similar comments were punched in the face.

Authorities in several states said that residents who had made ignorant comments erroneously citing the brutally cold temperatures as proof that climate change did not exist were reporting a sharp increase in injuries to the face and head regions.

In an emergency room in St. Paul, Harland Dorrinson, forty-one, was waiting to be treated for bruising to the facial area after he made a crack about how the below-freezing temperatures meant that climate-change activists were full of ****.


Nice try...grasping at straws and editing the left tard New Yorker shows your true colors GLG but that's okay... Just like Suzuki.

 

[Lipripper]

There is only one way to settle this................

 

[SerengetiGuide]

A hypocritical messenger who funds much of the research done most certainly affects the messages validity. The climate is changing, but it is not catastrophic and world ending like Suzuki likes to make others believe.

 

[Dennis.t]

Time to pop some corn again...munch, munch, munch...