Keeping Chinook Fishing Open from Sidney to Sooke

[Governor]

DFO could close chinook fishing for several months (March 1 to June 30) this spring around the south Vancouver Island approach waters of the Fraser River. This could impact anglers from Cowichan, Southern Gulf Islands, Sidney, Oak Bay, Victoria, Pedder Bay, Cheanah round to Sooke at Sheringham Pt.

Some of the wild Early Timed Fraser, Early Summer Fraser and Summer Fraser Chinook weak stocks that pass us by each spring do need rebuilding. Returns have been dropping for several years. [u]Conservation is the key here</u> to sustainability of these weak stocks. Without question the FN Food, Ceremonial and Social Fishery on the Fraser has priority over all groups but only after conservation has been met. So commercial and recreational anglers WILL bear the brunt of any conservation management measures regardless.

DFO have suggested special catch reporting is vital if our public fishery is to remain open to chinook during that time. Without it being in place this year and for the next few years the chinook fishery may well close. A proactive move by us, the local angling community, to broaden the reporting of our catch during the times where those weak stocks migrate through would be a very defensible position to take to DFO. However, as part of proposed special catch reporting requirements, there is a need for about 30 anglers (charters and joe tin boaters) who actively fish during that time and in those waters to voluntarily report catch in detail on each trip via a written logbook program.

So I ask ...Do you all want to stay on the water fishing for chinook this spring?

If so ... How many of YOU would be willing to participate in a carefully managed logbook reporting program?

[u]This is not a nasty joke, it's real folks so we need to work proactively and cooperatively as an angling community to maintain our chinook opportunity. </u>

Please respond and help make this a good news topic



God never did make a more calm, quiet, innocent recreation than angling - Izaak Walton

[LastChance]

I'm in.

Last Chance Fishing Adventures

www.lastchancefishingadventures.com
www.swiftsurebank.com

[Tailspin]

I'll report them,

As a note, all of the fish I have been getting are hatchery marked. Last year 97% of my DFO head returns were from the Nisqually river in Puget Sound, the remainder were of American origon but smaller unknown hatcheries. These were fish caught from November to May 30th 2008.

www.tailspincharters.com

[wolf]

If they shut us down then they better go as high as nananimo or beyond as well for I know last year they were hammering bigger fish then anybody around up there, is DFO that stupid to think that the fraser run ONLY comes along the westcoast maybe they come down the georgia strait side as well???Forget I asked that I must remember this is DFO.

And when will they annouce this???? a day before on feb 28th ??????????? as we are still waiting and its close to 2 weeks from now from the last SFAB meeting when the DFO guy(kent) said we would know somethhing about the opening on that Friday by the 6th?????So I guess a feb 15th opening for halibut is out now????

IM REALLY getting tired of this whole thing and yes I have written 4 letters now and ill write another one soon I have clients in waiting wanting to book to come here and yet here we are waiting and waiting it is complete bull$hit.

Sure ill fill it all out for them but maybe there wont be anything but hatchery fish in it hmmmmmmm now that would be nasty woundnt it we dont get any but FN does?????? something very wrong here

Sorry my rant for the DAY


Wolf

Blue Wolf Charters
www.bluewolfcharters.com

[LastChance]

Funny you said that, I was thinking of only targetting hachery fish myself. Them guys in Puget Sound do a GREAT job with the hatchery.



Last Chance Fishing Adventures

www.lastchancefishingadventures.com
www.swiftsurebank.com

[r.s craven]

I would be happy to report details if it keeps me on the water & fishing.
let me know how i can help...

[mason.jar]

There are a few anglers in the Nanaimo region that work very closely with DFO along these same lines or very similar, and thy have done so for many years. This for certain is not a new idea, however if you enjoy angling in your region, it is an action that we all must support. If DFO does not have accurate data, how else, but to make the ominous decision to close an area, could they safeguard it to ensure escapement targets are met?? Our best option is to develop an accurate, tangible catch reporting process that will help develop a better understanding of what truly is happening to the salmon within all of our different regions in order to better create working relationships with all stakeholders of the resource and DFO management. Mason

[www.savebcsalmon.ca]

[Cuba Libre]

Just confirms what I was thinking [V]-- Port Hardy is looking better than ever for my fishing base this summer...

http://i554.photobucket.com/albums/jj412/Batbreath/Intruder2-2.jpg

20ft Alumaweld Intruder

[chris73]

I am not sure if I'll be out fishing enough but would help out if needed...

[wolf]

Mason if the info we gave to DFO was truly taken and supported by us canadian people then yes i would have no problem what so ever in suppling correct and up to date data I keep a record of all my activities as it shows me a pattern.

BUTwith DFO and there track record with in seasons closures of halibut,salmon,prawns, reductions rules you lamost have to be a lawyer to figure everything out. oh and then a season opens for retention of sockeye to only close it 3 days later and then they allow a commercial opening.



They are worthless all the data they collect from what they get I really dont think they care!!!! 5% of halibut are taken from feb to the end of may and then it jumps up to a 100% by the end of sept and yet there it is in black and white where the problem lies (dfo document) ant YET we still dont have an opening for halibut.
And yet YOU want to support them yeah right


They want us to really trust them with all the crap they give us you might as well have a pack of wolves looking after a herd of elk because you know once your gone they will go in and make there own rules and eat everything up.


Ill say sorry now if I have offended you in anyway as I stat facts.

Thanks Wolf

[The Fish Assassin]

quote:There are a few anglers in the Nanaimo region that work very closely with DFO along these same lines or very similar

Some of the tagged fish I catch off Nanaimo shows where there from when you send in the head. You can catch those same fish here as down around Vic.

Take only what you need.

[mason.jar]

quote:Originally posted by wolf




Ill say sorry now if I have offended you in anyway as I stat facts.

Thanks Wolf




I am not at all offended by anything that you have stated, however please provide some facts for what you have said, as it really doesn't develop any concrete evidence other than to form substantiated evidence of a defunct system. All stakeholders must come to realize that each of DFO's decisions are made based on the most accurate data that is available to them from every source possible. In other words if DFO is working with skewed inaccurate data, then how could they possibly make a proper and accountable decision in favor of any entity other than for the sustainability of stocks, of which they are mandated to accomplish. My personal view is tell them the truth, share your data, give them the most accurate snapshot possible. The only way we can develop a working relationship to benefit all stakeholders is to cooperate to the fullest extent. Mason

[www.savebcsalmon.ca]

[porcupine]

If they want accurate data, why don't they ask us to turn in our old fishng licenses when we buy a new one. The major concern that I have is that if they take the data from "highliners" they may apply the data to all anglers and grossly over estimate the number of fish taken.

[wolf]

Mason All the info was shared with us on paper by DFO and a power point presentation, where else do you want the info from???????????they are using that as data so dont we?????? i dont know what you are asking?????and given to us...
this is nothing new i have it all here this has been going on now for 3 years its just that it has come out now finally there is alot more to come trust me we are not even into summer yet!!!!!!!!

So be forewarned




WE have given them numbers and facts from evrything but thet choose to ignore it.

Are you aware there is 14,000 ministry of fisheries employed in ottawa and they are the ones making decisions for the west I bet you my left nut that half of them havent even seen an ocean but they are the ones making decisions for us here nice really fng nice!!!!!!



Wolf

[Tailspin]

Good Points by porcupine, why don't they collect our old licenses?



www.tailspincharters.com

[mason.jar]

I am fully aware and am deeply engulfed in the stream of information that comes from many levels and sources throughout the industry, including but not limited to various factions that I choose to participate in. What I am conveying to you is, that DFO has never had a totally accurate in season snapshot of what the sporty's encounter. "In season snapshot" being the key phrase, it is absolutely crucial that we share this data in order to grantee our opportunities. You talk about a past opening and closing opportunity for sport caught sockeye, where a planned commercial opening continued while sport was idle by watching. Well sockeye have never been a sport priority option, it is a commercial priority below conservation and FN. Mason

[www.savebcsalmon.ca]

[wolf]

quote:Well sockeye have never been a sport priority option,

OH MY GOD I cant believe you have just said that do you by any chance work for DFO???????

It wasnt that long ago the port alberni was standing room only for the early sockeye run which brought milions of $$$$$ to that town as people from all over went there hundreds of sportfisherman went there the town was a buzz tourist bucks were coming in which helped that town in a huge way now just like every fishing based town they are slowing bleeding and getting weak.

SO how to you think they get there info ???? they fly a plane around and count boats and then I could only imagine they put an number that most of us are getting a fish or 2.
So in fact if they keep cutting funding to policing the system well of course they wont get proper data but why should we have to "help" them out affter many many and repeated times they have screwed us????

If your wife/girlfriend cheated on you 5 or 6 times a year after a while are you going to cooperate with her???????if you do your a dumb man after a while you would get fed up and go I hope.why keep bashing your head in????


Wolf

[mason.jar]

Wolf, "we" as in sports anglers are not the only stakeholders in the equation, once you come to realize this and understand sharing a resource you will come to have far less stress in your life. Unfortunately we do not have priority in every fishery, historically we have had priority below conservation with chinook and coho, two highly regarded species in the sportfishing industry. It has hardly been 20 years since we have started to encroach and put our focus onto what had been previously regarded as commercial fish. It was only when chinook and coho stocks started to majorly crash did the sportsfishing community start to target other species in a big way. I agree that there have been many, many bad decisions made by DFO managers in the past, however, let me emphasize that was the past, today and tomorrow are what count now. If "we" don't want to bend in order to form a functional working relationship with all stakeholders and the managers of DFO, then "we" are going to be the group that gets left behind. Cooperation is our only option! Mason

[www.savebcsalmon.ca]

[BlackPearl]

Im into doing whatever it takes to keep fishing open...from now to july...the crock of it is...i dont know who you are mason...you did not provide me a website or a phone number to confirm with someone from Fisheries that my volunteering efforts would indeed keep fishing open and me being able to keep chartering to help pay for my boat and mortgage and all the insurance companies i pay into...know what i mean? The government is working against us...not with us(sporties/guides)....why is there not a DFO website where we sporties could make suggestions to them or too report catches...Fisheries needs to get its head shook and there needs to be someone taking charge and making the right and fair decisions. that'll never happen but *$@! something needs to happen big time.

[mason.jar]

quote:why is there not a DFO website where we sporties could make suggestions to them or too report catches...Fisheries needs to get its head shook and there needs to be someone taking charge and making the right and fair decisions. that'll never happen but *$@! something needs to happen big time.

BlackPearl, to answer your question the process is called SFAB and SFAC, get involved at the SFAC level, it is impotent that you do considering the emphasis that you have made in reference to your post and how the fishery relates to you as a "sporty" and how it effects your business. Work towards the long term gains, rather than the short term losses that each and every one of "us" has experienced. I shall reiterate, "let me emphasize that was the past, today and tomorrow are what count now. If "we" don't want to bend in order to form a functional working relationship with all stakeholders and the managers of DFO, then "we" are going to be the group that gets left behind. Cooperation is our only option!" Mason

[www.savebcsalmon.ca]

[Tailspin]

quote:Cooperation is our only option!

A tough pill to swallow after over 28 years of Cooperating and Volunteering at hatcheries, stream rehab etc, etc. Where has that got me now other than restricted access to the resource? A pretty thin line between cooperating and leaning over for another spanish inquisition!

I find it hard to believe the few Fraser bound chinook that may be intervened by rec fisherman on there journey to the gravel mined, silt infested reds of the Fraser, is just cause to suggest a complete closure until June. Habitiat destruction might be a safer bet to concern DFO's powers with rather than a hand full of potential interceptions on the South Island?



www.tailspincharters.com

[wolf]

I totall realize it mason trust me, dont worry about that I have seen too many years of totall mismanagement by these clowns in what they do.
Its damn hard to trust the gov. when all you get from them is lies and then more lies I have worked directly doing a creel survey for the lodge I worked in the upper knight inlet area at we all went to all the trouble of scale.gill plate ,recording for 3 months, it was very time consuming and boring but we did it after you have guided all morning your tired but we figured it was going to "help" DFO !!!!! BUT it was all for nothing as after it was all said and done they said thanks and basically threw the data we collected away as they "Didnt need it"

And you tell me to get on board and help out give me break I have done my part only to be shat on!!!!!

You say sockeye isnt a sport fish well tell my uncle that (RIP) over 40 years ago when a bunch of them used to go to the alberni inlet for the first or second week in june along with probably a few thousand other guys just to target sockeye and NOT springs.

I think you have to "come and realize" this!!!!!!!!

Wolf

[The Fish Assassin]

quote:people from all over went there hundreds of sportfisherman went there

And you wonder why theres no more fish, gosh you guys still don't friggin get it do you? This is not an limitless resource. I would have to say that in its hayday there where thousands of sport fishermen bonking those alberni socks. Every year the runs would be smaller and smaller. Then big surprize, there isn't many fish anymore. Man you sure don't have to be a rocket scientist to figure this one out. It happens over and over again on the coast. The fish have a really hard time making a comeback becuase as soon as someone figures out that "fishing is good" the whole sports fleet goes there. Followed by commercials. Then people stand around in 4 years going, hey I think those F/N's from that area caught all the fish! Nobody ever sees themselves as part of the problem, and that IS the problem!

Take only what you need.

[mason.jar]

quote:Originally posted by wolf



You say sockeye isnt a sport fish well tell my uncle that (RIP) over 40 years ago when a bunch of them used to go to the alberni inlet for the first or second week in june along with probably a few thousand other guys just to target sockeye and NOT springs.

I think you have to "come and realize" this!!!!!!!!

Wolf


Wolf, now I know 100% that you are a fisherman for sure! Please tell me more about this, you have me on the edge of my seat. Make sure you have this story correct before you embellish it any further.

[www.savebcsalmon.ca]

[BlackPearl]

shouldnt the government be more concerned with the bycatch's by trawlers ...they are allowing 48000 to 68000 in the pollock industry a year....isnt that a major amout of chinook salmon...confused young angler...mason or wolf any comments on why we shouldnt be in rage over those type of numbers....?

[wolf]

LOL ok but maybe it wasnt 1000's of guys but they used to head up there just for sockeye along with many many other fisherman that was the point I was trying to make and then they had there supply for canning it really wasnt that long ago too now that fishery unfortunattly is in trouble as well.

PS yes im a true fisherman thanks for pointing that out:D:D

To put this back on track im very frustrated with the whole thing DFO is doing and yet (dont take it the wrong way) you want me and many of us to help them when they have screwed me personally and many sportfisherman and FN like I said in an earlier post We gave them tons of data and who know where it went you can only do so much.
Its bleeding badly and slowly soon it will be dead.

Thanks you do make me laugh

Wolf

[fish4all]

quote:Originally posted by The Fish Assassin


quote:people from all over went there hundreds of sportfisherman went there

And you wonder why theres no more fish, gosh you guys still don't friggin get it do you? This is not an limitless resource. I would have to say that in its hayday there where thousands of sport fishermen bonking those alberni socks. Every year the runs would be smaller and smaller. Then big surprize, there isn't many fish anymore. Man you sure don't have to be a rocket scientist to figure this one out. It happens over and over again on the coast. The fish have a really hard time making a comeback becuase as soon as someone figures out that "fishing is good" the whole sports fleet goes there. Followed by commercials. Then people stand around in 4 years going, hey I think those F/N's from that area caught all the fish! Nobody ever sees themselves as part of the problem, and that IS the problem!

Take only what you need.
WOW...someone does get it. Look at the species that are in trouble springs,coho...soon to be halibut and and inshore rockfish. When will this group ever admit to the impact they have on stocks. Pretty sad when one type of fish are all but gone and you move onto something else to decimate.
Realistic bag limits and yearly limits are a must if we want a fishery in the future.

[mason.jar]

quote:Originally posted by holmes

so no one wants to even acknowledge my idea?




Holmes, the process that has been working in the right direction for some time now is SFAB and SFAC with huge kudos to groups like SFI, and BCWF and other groups working on "our"[sporty's] behalf. "We" as individual anglers have the opportunity to participate in person on the SFAC level. The last thing that "we" as sport anglers should ever want to do is deflect our focus from the end result goals of our accumulative efforts. "We" all need to work with what has been deemed successful in developing long term working relationships between industry professionals, volunteers and DFO managers. SFAB and SFAC process is not an instant gratification or short term fix to any fishery issues in decision making. The process is structured to help build long term working solutions that include all stakeholders in the balance. I would rather see DFO spend money working within the confines of focused tangible solutions from what has already been deeded to be a successful process, rather than trying to reinvent the wheel and waste all kinds of money that their budget cannot afford trying to manage and sift through thousands of queries posted on an already balloted hard to manage website. Honestly, "we" already have a tough time finding in season and post season data, imagine how slow it will be on their side to react to information overload. Keep focused, stay informed, offer solutions, simply put, join SFAC group in your region. Like a dog, barking means absolutely nothing without the action behind it! Letters don't do a lot either, I am serious when I say join the process, it does matter. Mason

[www.savebcsalmon.ca]

[mason.jar]

You are welcome to contact me via email mason.jar@canada.com
Mason

[www.savebcsalmon.ca]

[mason.jar]

quote:Originally posted by BlackPearl

shouldnt the government be more concerned with the bycatch's by trawlers ...they are allowing 48000 to 68000 in the pollock industry a year....isnt that a major amout of chinook salmon...confused young angler...mason or wolf any comments on why we shouldnt be in rage over those type of numbers....?


The Alaskan pollock fishery was shut down recently for exceeding Chinook bi catch this year. PSC is recognizing issues with mixed stock and over fishing in both Canada and the USA. Each country has it's guidelines and Acts to follow and they are serious about ensuring sustainable fisheries in all of the Pacific regions. There have been lots of management mistakes in the past, however DFO is not totally responsible for the state of British Columbia's fisheries. For certain DFO and every stakeholder has had a hand at diminishing a percentage of the resource. Please remember when you are directing your anguish that there are uncontrollable variables like global climate change to name a major one. DFO is not at all 100% to blame, nor is any single stakeholder, it comes down to everything working in accumulation against the life of all fish from the day they are hatched. Long and the short, DFO is actively monitoring bi catch and has long recognized this issue as a grave concern. Mason

[www.savebcsalmon.ca]

[The Fish Assassin]

Time to stack those salmon licences on those pollock fishermen? They take the salmon anyways why not use up the salmon quota on them and forgo the troll fishery?

Take only what you need.

[BlackPearl]

If only we actually had someone listening that could make changes...