BLACK BOX

[totally tyee]

This is an arguement that I have been involved in many times. What is everyones oppinion on the use of a Black Box? I personally think that it makes no difference what so ever. I know that Yo Mama has an opinion on this and there are many different factors. Whats yours?
Totally Tyee



Edited by - totally tyee on 01/26/2004 19:19:08

[Gooey Bob]

I've got to agree with DHA on this one. It was actually guiding out of Weigh West in 1997 that convinced me. I was more than sceptical about the black boxes I saw on the boats of the more experienced guides and in fact, I put both feet deeply in my mouth mocking them.

About my second week there the bite was totally on for pretty much every guide at Portland Point except me. I kept hearing radio conversations between fellow guides talking about "cranking the box up to 7, they really want it hot!". Of course I had no idea what they were talking about and kept changing gear to no avail, but found out what was going on when I got back to the dock. The fish needed a "hot" `positive charge off the cable to get them interested that day. According to the other guides, all you had to do was crank up the box and the bite came on. There I was skunked, no tip, and pissed off guests. Needless to say, I put in a request for a black box the next day and haven't looked back since.

Now, its not always that simple, but I have had a few days since where it seemed that the charge off the cable made all the difference. In most cases, a black box will make sure your boat isn't repelling fish.

DHA is right - the technology was developed by commercial fishermen. The correct use of a black box is not simple and if you screw it up it can cause more harm than good. Read the manual!!!!

Bob

[Gooey Bob]

I've got to agree with DHA on this one. It was actually guiding out of Weigh West in 1997 that convinced me. I was more than sceptical about the black boxes I saw on the boats of the more experienced guides and in fact, I put both feet deeply in my mouth mocking them.

About my second week there the bite was totally on for pretty much every guide at Portland Point except me. I kept hearing radio conversations between fellow guides talking about "cranking the box up to 7, they really want it hot!". Of course I had no idea what they were talking about and kept changing gear to no avail, but found out what was going on when I got back to the dock. The fish needed a "hot" `positive charge off the cable to get them interested that day. According to the other guides, all you had to do was crank up the box and the bite came on. There I was skunked, no tip, and pissed off guests. Needless to say, I put in a request for a black box the next day and haven't looked back since.

Now, its not always that simple, but I have had a few days since where it seemed that the charge off the cable made all the difference. In most cases, a black box will make sure your boat isn't repelling fish.

DHA is right - the technology was developed by commercial fishermen. The correct use of a black box is not simple and if you screw it up it can cause more harm than good. Read the manual!!!!

Bob

[Gooey Bob]

I've got to agree with DHA on this one. It was actually guiding out of Weigh West in 1997 that convinced me. I was more than sceptical about the black boxes I saw on the boats of the more experienced guides and in fact, I put both feet deeply in my mouth mocking them.

About my second week there the bite was totally on for pretty much every guide at Portland Point except me. I kept hearing radio conversations between fellow guides talking about "cranking the box up to 7, they really want it hot!". Of course I had no idea what they were talking about and kept changing gear to no avail, but found out what was going on when I got back to the dock. The fish needed a "hot" `positive charge off the cable to get them interested that day. According to the other guides, all you had to do was crank up the box and the bite came on. There I was skunked, no tip, and pissed off guests. Needless to say, I put in a request for a black box the next day and haven't looked back since.

Now, its not always that simple, but I have had a few days since where it seemed that the charge off the cable made all the difference. In most cases, a black box will make sure your boat isn't repelling fish.

DHA is right - the technology was developed by commercial fishermen. The correct use of a black box is not simple and if you screw it up it can cause more harm than good. Read the manual!!!!

Bob

[Gooey Bob]

I've got to agree with DHA on this one. It was actually guiding out of Weigh West in 1997 that convinced me. I was more than sceptical about the black boxes I saw on the boats of the more experienced guides and in fact, I put both feet deeply in my mouth mocking them.

About my second week there the bite was totally on for pretty much every guide at Portland Point except me. I kept hearing radio conversations between fellow guides talking about "cranking the box up to 7, they really want it hot!". Of course I had no idea what they were talking about and kept changing gear to no avail, but found out what was going on when I got back to the dock. The fish needed a "hot" `positive charge off the cable to get them interested that day. According to the other guides, all you had to do was crank up the box and the bite came on. There I was skunked, no tip, and pissed off guests. Needless to say, I put in a request for a black box the next day and haven't looked back since.

Now, its not always that simple, but I have had a few days since where it seemed that the charge off the cable made all the difference. In most cases, a black box will make sure your boat isn't repelling fish.

DHA is right - the technology was developed by commercial fishermen. The correct use of a black box is not simple and if you screw it up it can cause more harm than good. Read the manual!!!!

Bob

[yo mama]

Ya I think totally knows how I feel on this subject. I can really only attest my knowledge of the black box to the QCI's. I seen two boats have a great season using them while the rest of the boats had average results. All of the other guides were considering purchasing the box when these boats results took a plung this season. I figured out the success was the fisherman not the gear as they were trolling a little fasted than the other boat which was triggering more hook ups.

My personal opinion and let me repeat this is my thought on the subject is that after 20 years of fishing all over the coast I have concluded that fisherman give to much credit to the fish.

It's pretty sad really.

Yes I will admit that some items tend to improve catch rates (ie flashers) but to tell me that a fraction of a volt going down 50 feet of cable through your downrigger clip and dispersed through out the pacific ocean is like some magnet to salmon, I cant belive it.

The one thing I know what works is a obsrvant fisherman who can adapt his or her methods to catch fish in all situations by figuring out the feeding habits of a fish with a brain the size of a pea.

I mentioned this to a west coast lodge owner once who had proved there wasn't much to them by swaping his "hot" boat that was dialed in with the box with another guide who was having difficulties hook fish. The second they swaped boats so did the number of fish and the box came up dry.

Just my thoughts on da matter!

Buhda

[yo mama]

Ya I think totally knows how I feel on this subject. I can really only attest my knowledge of the black box to the QCI's. I seen two boats have a great season using them while the rest of the boats had average results. All of the other guides were considering purchasing the box when these boats results took a plung this season. I figured out the success was the fisherman not the gear as they were trolling a little fasted than the other boat which was triggering more hook ups.

My personal opinion and let me repeat this is my thought on the subject is that after 20 years of fishing all over the coast I have concluded that fisherman give to much credit to the fish.

It's pretty sad really.

Yes I will admit that some items tend to improve catch rates (ie flashers) but to tell me that a fraction of a volt going down 50 feet of cable through your downrigger clip and dispersed through out the pacific ocean is like some magnet to salmon, I cant belive it.

The one thing I know what works is a obsrvant fisherman who can adapt his or her methods to catch fish in all situations by figuring out the feeding habits of a fish with a brain the size of a pea.

I mentioned this to a west coast lodge owner once who had proved there wasn't much to them by swaping his "hot" boat that was dialed in with the box with another guide who was having difficulties hook fish. The second they swaped boats so did the number of fish and the box came up dry.

Just my thoughts on da matter!

Buhda

[yo mama]

Ya I think totally knows how I feel on this subject. I can really only attest my knowledge of the black box to the QCI's. I seen two boats have a great season using them while the rest of the boats had average results. All of the other guides were considering purchasing the box when these boats results took a plung this season. I figured out the success was the fisherman not the gear as they were trolling a little fasted than the other boat which was triggering more hook ups.

My personal opinion and let me repeat this is my thought on the subject is that after 20 years of fishing all over the coast I have concluded that fisherman give to much credit to the fish.

It's pretty sad really.

Yes I will admit that some items tend to improve catch rates (ie flashers) but to tell me that a fraction of a volt going down 50 feet of cable through your downrigger clip and dispersed through out the pacific ocean is like some magnet to salmon, I cant belive it.

The one thing I know what works is a obsrvant fisherman who can adapt his or her methods to catch fish in all situations by figuring out the feeding habits of a fish with a brain the size of a pea.

I mentioned this to a west coast lodge owner once who had proved there wasn't much to them by swaping his "hot" boat that was dialed in with the box with another guide who was having difficulties hook fish. The second they swaped boats so did the number of fish and the box came up dry.

Just my thoughts on da matter!

Buhda

[yo mama]

Ya I think totally knows how I feel on this subject. I can really only attest my knowledge of the black box to the QCI's. I seen two boats have a great season using them while the rest of the boats had average results. All of the other guides were considering purchasing the box when these boats results took a plung this season. I figured out the success was the fisherman not the gear as they were trolling a little fasted than the other boat which was triggering more hook ups.

My personal opinion and let me repeat this is my thought on the subject is that after 20 years of fishing all over the coast I have concluded that fisherman give to much credit to the fish.

It's pretty sad really.

Yes I will admit that some items tend to improve catch rates (ie flashers) but to tell me that a fraction of a volt going down 50 feet of cable through your downrigger clip and dispersed through out the pacific ocean is like some magnet to salmon, I cant belive it.

The one thing I know what works is a obsrvant fisherman who can adapt his or her methods to catch fish in all situations by figuring out the feeding habits of a fish with a brain the size of a pea.

I mentioned this to a west coast lodge owner once who had proved there wasn't much to them by swaping his "hot" boat that was dialed in with the box with another guide who was having difficulties hook fish. The second they swaped boats so did the number of fish and the box came up dry.

Just my thoughts on da matter!

Buhda

[FunFisher]

Pardon my ignorance on the subject but what are you reffering to when you say black box.


Thanks

[FunFisher]

Pardon my ignorance on the subject but what are you reffering to when you say black box.


Thanks

[FunFisher]

Pardon my ignorance on the subject but what are you reffering to when you say black box.


Thanks

[FunFisher]

Pardon my ignorance on the subject but what are you reffering to when you say black box.


Thanks

[Gunnel_King]

Where can one pick up a "black box"? any websites?



Tall Tails

[Gunnel_King]

Where can one pick up a "black box"? any websites?



Tall Tails

[Gunnel_King]

Where can one pick up a "black box"? any websites?



Tall Tails

[Gunnel_King]

Where can one pick up a "black box"? any websites?



Tall Tails

[yo mama]

www.scotty.com

[yo mama]

www.scotty.com

[yo mama]

www.scotty.com

[yo mama]

www.scotty.com

[yo mama]

Fun fisher,

A box box is a device that controlls the amout of positive ions or "electricity" your boat discharges into the water.

[yo mama]

Fun fisher,

A box box is a device that controlls the amout of positive ions or "electricity" your boat discharges into the water.

[yo mama]

Fun fisher,

A box box is a device that controlls the amout of positive ions or "electricity" your boat discharges into the water.

[yo mama]

Fun fisher,

A box box is a device that controlls the amout of positive ions or "electricity" your boat discharges into the water.

[totally tyee]

Some interesting points on both sides of the arguement

[totally tyee]

Some interesting points on both sides of the arguement

[totally tyee]

Some interesting points on both sides of the arguement

[totally tyee]

Some interesting points on both sides of the arguement

[Sam Salmon]

A Black Box doesn't make fish bite-what it does is attract them towards the wire.
It's said to work better in crowded conditions for whatever reason.

livin' la vida pesca!

[Sam Salmon]

A Black Box doesn't make fish bite-what it does is attract them towards the wire.
It's said to work better in crowded conditions for whatever reason.

livin' la vida pesca!

[Sam Salmon]

A Black Box doesn't make fish bite-what it does is attract them towards the wire.
It's said to work better in crowded conditions for whatever reason.

livin' la vida pesca!

[Sam Salmon]

A Black Box doesn't make fish bite-what it does is attract them towards the wire.
It's said to work better in crowded conditions for whatever reason.

livin' la vida pesca!

[Fins -n- Skins]

I use a black box, love it, wouldn't fish without it. If you are not checking your voltage regularly you are only fooling yourself. Believe me the guy in the other boat is checking his !! DIAL THEM IN!!!

[Fins -n- Skins]

I use a black box, love it, wouldn't fish without it. If you are not checking your voltage regularly you are only fooling yourself. Believe me the guy in the other boat is checking his !! DIAL THEM IN!!!

[Fins -n- Skins]

I use a black box, love it, wouldn't fish without it. If you are not checking your voltage regularly you are only fooling yourself. Believe me the guy in the other boat is checking his !! DIAL THEM IN!!!

[Fins -n- Skins]

I use a black box, love it, wouldn't fish without it. If you are not checking your voltage regularly you are only fooling yourself. Believe me the guy in the other boat is checking his !! DIAL THEM IN!!!

[yo mama]

If find that if I lower a lil' cable into the falls pool and turn the "box" up to .80, I cant keep the steelhead off!

[yo mama]

If find that if I lower a lil' cable into the falls pool and turn the "box" up to .80, I cant keep the steelhead off!

[yo mama]

If find that if I lower a lil' cable into the falls pool and turn the "box" up to .80, I cant keep the steelhead off!

[yo mama]

If find that if I lower a lil' cable into the falls pool and turn the "box" up to .80, I cant keep the steelhead off!

[vince gee]

Hey mama last time i was at the falls pool most of the newbies there were using cable for line!

[vince gee]

Hey mama last time i was at the falls pool most of the newbies there were using cable for line!

[vince gee]

Hey mama last time i was at the falls pool most of the newbies there were using cable for line!

[vince gee]

Hey mama last time i was at the falls pool most of the newbies there were using cable for line!

[Gooey Bob]

Interesting thoughts on the box.

As stated in my earlier post, I still believe their greatest power is in making sure that the charge on your cable isn't repelling fish. On the very rare occaison I've seen, without a doubt, that they've attracted fish and made the difference between fish and no fish.

That being said, clearly, if you aren't where the fish are, and\or are running stupid gear, no amount of tehcnology is going to help you.

Good point on running your gear well behind your clip DHA. Long before I ever used a black box, I found running a minimum of 14 pulls behind the clip greatly improved my success, especially on shallow Springs. The exception was with flashers and hoochies where running closer to the clip gave more kick to the hoochie.

Is it getting it away from the boat, or the charge of the cable?

Bob

[Gooey Bob]

Interesting thoughts on the box.

As stated in my earlier post, I still believe their greatest power is in making sure that the charge on your cable isn't repelling fish. On the very rare occaison I've seen, without a doubt, that they've attracted fish and made the difference between fish and no fish.

That being said, clearly, if you aren't where the fish are, and\or are running stupid gear, no amount of tehcnology is going to help you.

Good point on running your gear well behind your clip DHA. Long before I ever used a black box, I found running a minimum of 14 pulls behind the clip greatly improved my success, especially on shallow Springs. The exception was with flashers and hoochies where running closer to the clip gave more kick to the hoochie.

Is it getting it away from the boat, or the charge of the cable?

Bob

[Gooey Bob]

Interesting thoughts on the box.

As stated in my earlier post, I still believe their greatest power is in making sure that the charge on your cable isn't repelling fish. On the very rare occaison I've seen, without a doubt, that they've attracted fish and made the difference between fish and no fish.

That being said, clearly, if you aren't where the fish are, and\or are running stupid gear, no amount of tehcnology is going to help you.

Good point on running your gear well behind your clip DHA. Long before I ever used a black box, I found running a minimum of 14 pulls behind the clip greatly improved my success, especially on shallow Springs. The exception was with flashers and hoochies where running closer to the clip gave more kick to the hoochie.

Is it getting it away from the boat, or the charge of the cable?

Bob

[Gooey Bob]

Interesting thoughts on the box.

As stated in my earlier post, I still believe their greatest power is in making sure that the charge on your cable isn't repelling fish. On the very rare occaison I've seen, without a doubt, that they've attracted fish and made the difference between fish and no fish.

That being said, clearly, if you aren't where the fish are, and\or are running stupid gear, no amount of tehcnology is going to help you.

Good point on running your gear well behind your clip DHA. Long before I ever used a black box, I found running a minimum of 14 pulls behind the clip greatly improved my success, especially on shallow Springs. The exception was with flashers and hoochies where running closer to the clip gave more kick to the hoochie.

Is it getting it away from the boat, or the charge of the cable?

Bob

[totally tyee]

It can help you repel the dogfish. From what I know each species of salmon has its own setting on the blackbox.
1 box per boat

[totally tyee]

It can help you repel the dogfish. From what I know each species of salmon has its own setting on the blackbox.
1 box per boat

[totally tyee]

It can help you repel the dogfish. From what I know each species of salmon has its own setting on the blackbox.
1 box per boat

[totally tyee]

It can help you repel the dogfish. From what I know each species of salmon has its own setting on the blackbox.
1 box per boat

[Rodbreaker]

"It can help you repel the dogfish.
Yes but the charge would have to be so high it'd repel Salmon as well.<img src=icon_smile_dissapprove.gif border=0 align=middle>

that's why there's a warranty!

[Rodbreaker]

"It can help you repel the dogfish.
Yes but the charge would have to be so high it'd repel Salmon as well.<img src=icon_smile_dissapprove.gif border=0 align=middle>

that's why there's a warranty!

[Rodbreaker]

"It can help you repel the dogfish.
Yes but the charge would have to be so high it'd repel Salmon as well.<img src=icon_smile_dissapprove.gif border=0 align=middle>

that's why there's a warranty!

[Rodbreaker]

"It can help you repel the dogfish.
Yes but the charge would have to be so high it'd repel Salmon as well.<img src=icon_smile_dissapprove.gif border=0 align=middle>

that's why there's a warranty!

[yo mama]

The funny thing is that Scotty charges about 200 and change for one of these and I could visit the local radio shack and come up with one for a mear 5 dollars!

[yo mama]

The funny thing is that Scotty charges about 200 and change for one of these and I could visit the local radio shack and come up with one for a mear 5 dollars!

[yo mama]

The funny thing is that Scotty charges about 200 and change for one of these and I could visit the local radio shack and come up with one for a mear 5 dollars!

[yo mama]

The funny thing is that Scotty charges about 200 and change for one of these and I could visit the local radio shack and come up with one for a mear 5 dollars!

[yo mama]

Maybe if you knew something about electricity, you would know that its a variable resistor not a voltmeter slapnut. A voltmeter mesures electricity and a variable device alters it! And they are quite cheap.



Edited by - yo mama on 01/28/2004 18:43:37

[yo mama]

Maybe if you knew something about electricity, you would know that its a variable resistor not a voltmeter slapnut. A voltmeter mesures electricity and a variable device alters it! And they are quite cheap.



Edited by - yo mama on 01/28/2004 18:43:37

[yo mama]

Maybe if you knew something about electricity, you would know that its a variable resistor not a voltmeter slapnut. A voltmeter mesures electricity and a variable device alters it! And they are quite cheap.



Edited by - yo mama on 01/28/2004 18:43:37

[yo mama]

Maybe if you knew something about electricity, you would know that its a variable resistor not a voltmeter slapnut. A voltmeter mesures electricity and a variable device alters it! And they are quite cheap.



Edited by - yo mama on 01/28/2004 18:43:37

[yo mama]

Ya skinz,

Gotta keep an eye on that boy!

[yo mama]

Ya skinz,

Gotta keep an eye on that boy!

[yo mama]

Ya skinz,

Gotta keep an eye on that boy!

[yo mama]

Ya skinz,

Gotta keep an eye on that boy!

[yo mama]

Read than talk. You don't even know what your saying.

You were replying to the fact I said I could build one for 5 bucks not test it!

[yo mama]

Read than talk. You don't even know what your saying.

You were replying to the fact I said I could build one for 5 bucks not test it!

[yo mama]

Read than talk. You don't even know what your saying.

You were replying to the fact I said I could build one for 5 bucks not test it!

[yo mama]

Read than talk. You don't even know what your saying.

You were replying to the fact I said I could build one for 5 bucks not test it!

[Bravefart]

A wiring diagram and a list of parts would be nice. So far a variable resistor and a volt meter.
There is a black box on E-Bay that uses a pulse that the manufacturer claims outfishes the Scotty about three to one.

Davie

[Bravefart]

A wiring diagram and a list of parts would be nice. So far a variable resistor and a volt meter.
There is a black box on E-Bay that uses a pulse that the manufacturer claims outfishes the Scotty about three to one.

Davie

[Bravefart]

A wiring diagram and a list of parts would be nice. So far a variable resistor and a volt meter.
There is a black box on E-Bay that uses a pulse that the manufacturer claims outfishes the Scotty about three to one.

Davie

[Bravefart]

A wiring diagram and a list of parts would be nice. So far a variable resistor and a volt meter.
There is a black box on E-Bay that uses a pulse that the manufacturer claims outfishes the Scotty about three to one.

Davie

[yo mama]

Hey Davie,

Actually the Scotty has a pulseating mode on it.

[yo mama]

Hey Davie,

Actually the Scotty has a pulseating mode on it.

[yo mama]

Hey Davie,

Actually the Scotty has a pulseating mode on it.

[yo mama]

Hey Davie,

Actually the Scotty has a pulseating mode on it.

[Bravefart]

Yo Mamma
Checked Scotty site and yes indeed they have a pulse black box.

Have a look at this one for your opinion.

If you have any ideas on an electronic diagram. I can make the circuit board.

Davie

[Bravefart]

Yo Mamma
Checked Scotty site and yes indeed they have a pulse black box.

Have a look at this one for your opinion.

If you have any ideas on an electronic diagram. I can make the circuit board.

Davie

[Bravefart]

Yo Mamma
Checked Scotty site and yes indeed they have a pulse black box.

Have a look at this one for your opinion.

If you have any ideas on an electronic diagram. I can make the circuit board.

Davie

[Bravefart]

Yo Mamma
Checked Scotty site and yes indeed they have a pulse black box.

Have a look at this one for your opinion.

If you have any ideas on an electronic diagram. I can make the circuit board.

Davie

[Bravefart]

Forgot the tag

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3657525957&category=36151

[Bravefart]

Forgot the tag

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3657525957&category=36151

[Bravefart]

Forgot the tag

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3657525957&category=36151

[Bravefart]

Forgot the tag

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3657525957&category=36151

[yo mama]

Ya I have not done one brave but I learn this stuff in school. Basicly a boat is a 12 volt circuit and your trying to take the 12 and variably adjust it and restrict it down to a low (.01-1.00) voltage. Do some home work on the net and drop me a email if you need any more tips.

[yo mama]

Ya I have not done one brave but I learn this stuff in school. Basicly a boat is a 12 volt circuit and your trying to take the 12 and variably adjust it and restrict it down to a low (.01-1.00) voltage. Do some home work on the net and drop me a email if you need any more tips.

[yo mama]

Ya I have not done one brave but I learn this stuff in school. Basicly a boat is a 12 volt circuit and your trying to take the 12 and variably adjust it and restrict it down to a low (.01-1.00) voltage. Do some home work on the net and drop me a email if you need any more tips.

[yo mama]

Ya I have not done one brave but I learn this stuff in school. Basicly a boat is a 12 volt circuit and your trying to take the 12 and variably adjust it and restrict it down to a low (.01-1.00) voltage. Do some home work on the net and drop me a email if you need any more tips.

[totally tyee]

DHA, what are your favorite setting to use on your black box? Do you run it hot for sockeye season in the inlet?

[totally tyee]

DHA, what are your favorite setting to use on your black box? Do you run it hot for sockeye season in the inlet?

[totally tyee]

DHA, what are your favorite setting to use on your black box? Do you run it hot for sockeye season in the inlet?

[totally tyee]

DHA, what are your favorite setting to use on your black box? Do you run it hot for sockeye season in the inlet?

[Tailspin]

Jack! Is that you calling my name? Fish on.

[Tailspin]

Jack! Is that you calling my name? Fish on.

[Tailspin]

Jack! Is that you calling my name? Fish on.

[Tailspin]

Jack! Is that you calling my name? Fish on.

[wolf]

Well the ever popular debate on black boxes to be honest it is the fisherman who catches fish, its all in the roll of the bait. However saying that i can lower the voltage on my boat by doing certain things to clips and different wire and adding more or less zincs on a boat. The other thing is when you meter the cable at the boat say at .6 of a volt do we even know what it is at the bottom of the cannonball that is 90 ft down with your flaser and bait 30 feet back? Also i know from personal experience that every day on the ocean is totally different with the mixture of fresh water in the ocean if you are fishing near creeks and river like pt. renfrew it changes the polarity quite a bit.It seems where i fish on the west coast that the fish bite mostly on the tide changes and the incoming floods so there will be times when your out there at the crack of dawn to times when you go out at 11:00 in the morning but i also think if you are confident in what you know works you seem to catch fish you can put a piece of bait in a holder and just tell you are going to catch a fish with that perfect roll if you put it in there thinking oh it may work you might catch a fish or your going to drown that pice of bait all day long until then good luck wolf

[wolf]

Well the ever popular debate on black boxes to be honest it is the fisherman who catches fish, its all in the roll of the bait. However saying that i can lower the voltage on my boat by doing certain things to clips and different wire and adding more or less zincs on a boat. The other thing is when you meter the cable at the boat say at .6 of a volt do we even know what it is at the bottom of the cannonball that is 90 ft down with your flaser and bait 30 feet back? Also i know from personal experience that every day on the ocean is totally different with the mixture of fresh water in the ocean if you are fishing near creeks and river like pt. renfrew it changes the polarity quite a bit.It seems where i fish on the west coast that the fish bite mostly on the tide changes and the incoming floods so there will be times when your out there at the crack of dawn to times when you go out at 11:00 in the morning but i also think if you are confident in what you know works you seem to catch fish you can put a piece of bait in a holder and just tell you are going to catch a fish with that perfect roll if you put it in there thinking oh it may work you might catch a fish or your going to drown that pice of bait all day long until then good luck wolf

[totally tyee]

I disagree that it is all in the roll. Back many years ago when I was working at a marina with a rental boat fleet I once witnessed a guy catch a 30 pound spring on a blue anchovy special teaser head, but the kicker is, there was no bait in the head. FISH ARE STUPID
When there are few fish around the roll of the bait becomes important.

[totally tyee]

I disagree that it is all in the roll. Back many years ago when I was working at a marina with a rental boat fleet I once witnessed a guy catch a 30 pound spring on a blue anchovy special teaser head, but the kicker is, there was no bait in the head. FISH ARE STUPID
When there are few fish around the roll of the bait becomes important.

[yo mama]

Im with ya there totally, I've had a spring hit just a teaser as well!

[yo mama]

Im with ya there totally, I've had a spring hit just a teaser as well!

[yo mama]

I'm still amazed that fisherman will not give credit to themselves for catching fish but will credit the voltage of the boat or the color of teaser head. Years of experience in knowing what depths and colors and speed combined with times of year catch fish. Do you really think that a newbie that reads a book on how to catch salmon and bought all the equipment of a charter guy is going to hammer fish like the charter guy....NO because of the life time expeience that the charter guy has accumulated over the years. That what catches fish, not just one thing like the roll of you chovie, numerous factors combined.

[yo mama]

I'm still amazed that fisherman will not give credit to themselves for catching fish but will credit the voltage of the boat or the color of teaser head. Years of experience in knowing what depths and colors and speed combined with times of year catch fish. Do you really think that a newbie that reads a book on how to catch salmon and bought all the equipment of a charter guy is going to hammer fish like the charter guy....NO because of the life time expeience that the charter guy has accumulated over the years. That what catches fish, not just one thing like the roll of you chovie, numerous factors combined.

[totally tyee]

well said mamma, couldn't have said it better myself

[totally tyee]

well said mamma, couldn't have said it better myself

[wolf]

Yo mama isnt that what i had basically said? I totally agree with you on that it isnt just the bait roll but i would say 75% of it is i have been chartering off of sooke now for more than 8 years and fished it for 20 and i have experimented with different baits and rolls to see what fish seem to like and i have come to my own conclusions in what they like and dislike. Also when it comes to voltage on the wire different cannonballs read differently then others i have metered some that were higher than normal and some that were lower than normal it all depends on whoever made them and how pure the led is and the best time to check it is while your out fishing not at the dock where you will get a false reading from marinas with power hookups and other boats near you because as you know electricity takes the easiest route i find it amazing the amount of people that accually fish out there that dont catch fish so the blame it on a boats voltage so they go and buy one of those black boxes and still dont catch as many fish then they ask me why i dont have one on my boat i just tell them i dont need one as i throw another slab on to the fish cleaning table.Its all dependent on how you know the area and the experience that you have as you said great insight thanks. Wolf

[wolf]

Yo mama isnt that what i had basically said? I totally agree with you on that it isnt just the bait roll but i would say 75% of it is i have been chartering off of sooke now for more than 8 years and fished it for 20 and i have experimented with different baits and rolls to see what fish seem to like and i have come to my own conclusions in what they like and dislike. Also when it comes to voltage on the wire different cannonballs read differently then others i have metered some that were higher than normal and some that were lower than normal it all depends on whoever made them and how pure the led is and the best time to check it is while your out fishing not at the dock where you will get a false reading from marinas with power hookups and other boats near you because as you know electricity takes the easiest route i find it amazing the amount of people that accually fish out there that dont catch fish so the blame it on a boats voltage so they go and buy one of those black boxes and still dont catch as many fish then they ask me why i dont have one on my boat i just tell them i dont need one as i throw another slab on to the fish cleaning table.Its all dependent on how you know the area and the experience that you have as you said great insight thanks. Wolf

[yo mama]

exactly wolf!

[yo mama]

exactly wolf!

[totally tyee]

One thing that has always baffled me is the fact that you can fish from 5am til 2pm and not have a bite and then all of a sudden every boat in sight is playing a fish. I wonder if those fish are there all along or a school moves in.
I happen to belive that those fish are there all trhe time because if the is a BITE at 2pm, it is most likely that the BITE will come on at 2pm the following day or close to it.

[wolf]

have you ever thought that that was when the incoming flood started because with every incoming flood it brings in more bait and those big spring follow, you have to remember those big fish dont like to swim hard against current that how they get so big they are a lazy fish so when the current pushes them in to the shoreline thats where we as fisherman wait for them and all hell breaks loose. FISH ON!!!!!

[totally tyee]

Wolf I don't think that it is the flood tide. It happens on both the flood and the ebb and neither one more than the other. C.S I have seen the same thing happen in many areas and it puzzles me. Its usually pretty close to the same time everyday
TT

[wolf]

TT where are you fishing when the ebb is as good as a flood we fish on the west coast side (Sooke) and it is mostly tide dependent and cuurent dependent. also where i guide in knight inlet in the summer an incoming flood is 99 times out of a 100 going to be a great time we even change our outing times to maximize the whole incoming flood so the guests have the most chance of getting a big fish and the most fish.but in saying that the crack of morning you will always catch fish for the first hour especially if you are fishing over reefs the bait moves in close to shore at night to hide in the kelp thats why the springs are there but as soon as the sun starts to hit the water and creating shawdows the fish leave the shallows and head into deeper waters havent you wondered why you catch more fish on a cloudy or overcast day in shallow water 30 to 50 ft? think about it NO shadows hhhhhmmmmmm.

[Fins -n- Skins]

Dial them in !!! 5.6 5.8 or maybe 6.0

[yo mama]

I like to hook it up to my guest's seat so when they get out of hand crank up da juice and pizow!! gott em!

[yo mama]

Speaking of Fins and Skins, happen to see Geoff Courtnal in Duncan today of all places. Last time I saw him, he was wackin' pinks with Henry on that golf/fishing show.

[vince gee]

I had a black box for my use a couple times in grade 10 or 11!

[wolf]

i see him lots of times off of possesion pt or otter pt in the summer times hes got a nice grady thats for sure.

[Alexis]

This is one subject I'll dive right in on. I had this conversation with old Blainie Scott (Owner of Scotty Products) and his supplier from Russell Electronics Ltd.(The folks that make the black box) a year before Blainie died. Both agreed that if you're running a fibreglass boat with one motor and two riggers, the black box will do absolutely nothing for you except act as a placebo. Your boat is not producing enough of a current to matter one iota. If however, you run a metal boat, have more than one motor, or fish 3 or more riggers, then the black box will be helpful. The more metal in the water, the more current you're producing. Unless of course you're a complete git when it comes to wiring.

They both laughed when I asked about a 17 foot boston whaler, with a 50 Yammie on it, but said it was the average fishermen that didn't need one, that made them their money.

I believe that the average fishermen will buy anything if they think it will improve their fishing chances, and if after using the product, they catch a fish, they will automatically assume that it was the product, and the product only, that caught them that fish. Remember Dumbo's feather?

[yo mama]

The fish bite the best when they are hungry. Simple as that, a certain tide doesn' t mean buttons to the fish, it only assists the fisherman on how the can efectivly present their lure to the fish. Payed very close attention to this subject over the years and have changed many angler's minds in the process.

[totally tyee]

Wolf, I am not disagreeing with you, I'm just not completley sold on the fact that the Flood is better. Sure I grew up with my Dad telling me all the time that the flood is better but I have not seen anything like it, From Trial Island to Langara Island. Sure there are spots that the flood will push the bait into like the Meat hole and Beachy Head but I think its just myth.
TT



Edited by - totally tyee on 02/20/2004 13:31:03

[Fins -n- Skins]

Alexis what if your running two motors and the kicker is not grounded and the boat is not bonded. Your cannon balls your using the lead is bad, you connect the downrigger clip straight to the wire without nylon cored or stainless swivels. You have green wiring or you have power from one or two wires not leading anywhere. You don't have your battery in a battery box, not changing your Zincs etc, etc. This is not too say that these guys will not catch fish, but the fisherman i see at Sooke doing well in derbies year after year, have Malcolm Russell test there boats every year for problems. And i bet that everyone of them has some sort of black box whether they need it or not. Some boats are just plain fishy they don't need help but others do and i have seen and help friends dial in there boats when one side of the boat is not producing. I have changed friends minds into getting a black box, not because they catch more fish but because thats just one less problem working against you. Dial them in !!!!

[wolf]

well TT that is your opinion but from the many years fishing sooke i probably fish it 5 days a week min.sometimes every day for long stretches in the summer it is almost scary how day to day the bite will come on later and later each day, until it will flip back to an early morning bite.
For the last 8 years i keep track in this book i made each fish i catch ,what time ,what it was caught on ,how big,wind direction and speed,location,wheather cloudy or sunny fog rain etc., and how deep, I know that sounds anal but growing up and being taught bye a bunch of old timers now.( they werent when i was a kid LOL) they always would say to me to catch a spring think like a spring.It is almost scary how when you look back after the year of fishing how you see a definate pattern with the current flow to fish biteing at various times. Thats how i determine what time i head out for charters because as you know when you have paying guests all they want is fish they dont care about times they are on a meat hunt they want what they are paying for especially if its only a 5 hour charter, us as guides want them back as repeat clients so when you know when the fish are going to bite thats when you go out.
Its quite funny when you head out to otter pt. at around 11:00 and you ask the regulars you see out there all the time hows it going and the say" been here since 5 am only seen 3 fish caught now im leaving".then the flood starts around 12:30 and you start seeing fish being caught all around you till the flood starts declining and all you see around you are the guide boats the the few die hards who knows whats going on.Hopefully what i have said will help people catch more salmon because thats what its all about right catching fish!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Fins -n- Skins]

Hey Wolf i find the Trap good on the Ebb and Otter good on a flood, but sometimes its a little difficult to fish Otter on the flood in the afternoon with a westerly blowing in. Thats why alot of those guys fish the morning because they can't stick it out when it blows up. I see you around Secretary alot but i haven't found much success there, still trying to figure out which tide is best for there. Any advice or is the flood still the best?

[MyEscape]

Hello thanks for all the great advice here... I just purchased the pro troll black box much cheaper than scotty's and in case you didn't know the fellow that invented scotty's is the person who designed the pro troll after leaving scotty... One thing I can say is"yes"putting in the time does help but after alot of research I feel a black box was the way to go. Must say that the black box has helped me find alot of my power leaks further more its no secret that the more things you do right the better the chances to land the big one..

[vince gee]

Hey fins i think maybe you should be sick next week and come drift with me and the wolf and you guys can discuss black boxes all day,hell the only black box i knew was back in high school!

[yo mama]

Hey vinny,

What do you say we hook up a couple of electric riggers and a black box to the drift boat and then we can lower the glos down through the deep slots on the Cowie. Steelheads o plenty! haha

[vince gee]

I might get banned for saying this but what the hell-HSUS DONE IT ALREADY!

[totally tyee]

Hey Wolf
Excellent point. In my experience I have always moved to Sheringham on the Ebb and Otter on the flood as with many other people do the same thing. You are very right about Otter though. I can remmeber fishing in one of the derbies about 5 years back when Otter didn't light up until around 1 oclock in the afternoon. Same with Renfrew, many times the bite is not until 11-12 oclock.
I think we may have met before Wolf, I know that we have a few mutual acquaintances. Take Care
TT

[totally tyee]

Hey Wolf
Excellent point. In my experience I have always moved to Sheringham on the Ebb and Otter on the flood as with many other people do the same thing. You are very right about Otter though. I can remmeber fishing in one of the derbies about 5 years back when Otter didn't light up until around 1 oclock in the afternoon. Same with Renfrew, many times the bite is not until 11-12 oclock.
I think we may have met before Wolf, I know that we have a few mutual acquaintances. Take Care
TT

[totally tyee]

I think this is the longest thread on this great forums history

[totally tyee]

I think this is the longest thread on this great forums history

[wolf]

hey fish-n-fins secratary is a little gem but it is tricky to fish there is 6 reefs that you can hit in a little area e-mail me at home and ill tell how and when to fish it LOL or better yet ill show you in the summer chat to you later wolf

[wolf]

hey fish-n-fins secratary is a little gem but it is tricky to fish there is 6 reefs that you can hit in a little area e-mail me at home and ill tell how and when to fish it LOL or better yet ill show you in the summer chat to you later wolf

[Alexis]

Fins N Skins, I did say that a complete git, when it came to electronics would have voltage leaking all over. If that's the case, somehow I don't think adding another electronic device in the form of the BB is going to help them catch fish. If they can't figure out how to wire the boat, change the zinc and ground everything, they certainly aren't going to be able to figure out how to operate the BB.

From personal experience, over 20 years guiding, what it really comes down to in fresh and salt water is practice. You learn when, where, how deep and on what by trail and error and it will make you a much better angler than someone who NEEDS to rely constantly on some external device.
To paraphrase an old line from a movie, " Electronics? We don't need no stinking electronics!"<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

[Alexis]

Fins N Skins, I did say that a complete git, when it came to electronics would have voltage leaking all over. If that's the case, somehow I don't think adding another electronic device in the form of the BB is going to help them catch fish. If they can't figure out how to wire the boat, change the zinc and ground everything, they certainly aren't going to be able to figure out how to operate the BB.

From personal experience, over 20 years guiding, what it really comes down to in fresh and salt water is practice. You learn when, where, how deep and on what by trail and error and it will make you a much better angler than someone who NEEDS to rely constantly on some external device.
To paraphrase an old line from a movie, " Electronics? We don't need no stinking electronics!"<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

[wolf]

You are right on alexis thats exactly what i have said about this whole subject and no i do not own a black box they are way to expensive for what they do (nothing). but just like the famous CHARLIE WHITE LURE it caught more fisherman than fish ha ha.



Edited by - wolf on 02/21/2004 18:36:59

[wolf]

You are right on alexis thats exactly what i have said about this whole subject and no i do not own a black box they are way to expensive for what they do (nothing). but just like the famous CHARLIE WHITE LURE it caught more fisherman than fish ha ha.



Edited by - wolf on 02/21/2004 18:36:59

[MyEscape]

Just to respond to some of the statements since yesterday I find the black box a great way to check the volts from your boat and then after that tweek it up or down. By the way it's been proven time and time again that fish are attracted or repelled by current. My boat is wired perfect now but there are alot of other factors that change how much current your boat puts out. Beats carring a volt meter flip the switch and the truth is told.

[MyEscape]

Just to respond to some of the statements since yesterday I find the black box a great way to check the volts from your boat and then after that tweek it up or down. By the way it's been proven time and time again that fish are attracted or repelled by current. My boat is wired perfect now but there are alot of other factors that change how much current your boat puts out. Beats carring a volt meter flip the switch and the truth is told.

[wolf]

yeah i guess a volt meter isnt important and too heavy to carry on a boat.

[wolf]

yeah i guess a volt meter isnt important and too heavy to carry on a boat.

[MyEscape]

Wolf I respect the fact that many fishermen don't use black boxes but
I didn't start fishing yesterday, everybody has an opinion and thanks to the internet I have read many and there's more for then against.
I think that nothing beats time on the water but how can you pass judgement if you don't even use one...

[MyEscape]

Wolf I respect the fact that many fishermen don't use black boxes but
I didn't start fishing yesterday, everybody has an opinion and thanks to the internet I have read many and there's more for then against.
I think that nothing beats time on the water but how can you pass judgement if you don't even use one...

[wolf]

read what i have said in this whole forum then think about it

[wolf]

read what i have said in this whole forum then think about it

[MyEscape]

Wolf I have reread all that you wrote and must agree you make some very good points. I use to fish from shore in Nanaimo even though I had a boat and thanks to the help of seasoned fishermen I learned alot about how to catch fish some days out fishing the guys who spent there whole day out on the boat and I was at home by 9am. By the way you may know one of the people that has taught me alot he use to fish alot in sooke Don Crow. I wish I could spend as much time on the water as alot of the others on this site. I love fishing but now live in courtenay and own a bigger boat and just felt after all the research I had done the black box might be one more positive thing I could do to increase the odds in my favor. I look forward to reading more from you and the others that have great input in this site.
Thanks....

[MyEscape]

Wolf I have reread all that you wrote and must agree you make some very good points. I use to fish from shore in Nanaimo even though I had a boat and thanks to the help of seasoned fishermen I learned alot about how to catch fish some days out fishing the guys who spent there whole day out on the boat and I was at home by 9am. By the way you may know one of the people that has taught me alot he use to fish alot in sooke Don Crow. I wish I could spend as much time on the water as alot of the others on this site. I love fishing but now live in courtenay and own a bigger boat and just felt after all the research I had done the black box might be one more positive thing I could do to increase the odds in my favor. I look forward to reading more from you and the others that have great input in this site.
Thanks....

[MyEscape]

You might all like the read @ protroll.com this is the guy who invented scotty's black box and left scotty after a falling out in the 90's he also has designed many others for comm.use....

[MyEscape]

You might all like the read @ protroll.com this is the guy who invented scotty's black box and left scotty after a falling out in the 90's he also has designed many others for comm.use....

[totally tyee]

whats the price of this protroll? what are the differences?

[totally tyee]

whats the price of this protroll? what are the differences?

[MyEscape]

If you shop around you will find them as low as $160. You can even run it on a 9 volt battery. The only thing I changed is the sleeves that sit on the down rigger wires the ones that pro troll uses move the stops on my elect. down riggers. You can buy the sleeves from scotty there less the $20 for two and are a great fix.

[MyEscape]

If you shop around you will find them as low as $160. You can even run it on a 9 volt battery. The only thing I changed is the sleeves that sit on the down rigger wires the ones that pro troll uses move the stops on my elect. down riggers. You can buy the sleeves from scotty there less the $20 for two and are a great fix.

[IronNoggin]

quote:...I believe that the average fishermen will buy anything if they think it will improve their fishing chances, and if after using the product, they catch a fish, they will automatically assume that it was the product, and the product only, that caught them that fish. Remember Dumbo's feather?...

aYup. IMHO, black boxes can make a difference, dependant upon the configuration/construction of your boat. Nearly all Area G Trollers (WCVI) have and use them and have for years. Since successful fishing defines their livelihood, that says a lot to me. I've seen the results when one boat is "leaking" and/or not using the BB alongside one that is, the one that is properly grounded and dialed in for spp of fish always wins.

That being said, I personally don't use one. I run a 16 foot whaler, w/ a zinced out 50 Mariner. My downriggers are the old bicycle antique types (intentionally, I do have Scotty's but like the older look and function of the antiques). I've found you can easily adjust your perceived voltage rate simply by lengthening/shortening a non-conductive tether between your cannonball and the clip on the wire. And my little rig certainly doesn't seem to have much problem putting fish to the net.

Cheers,
Nog

[IronNoggin]

quote:...I believe that the average fishermen will buy anything if they think it will improve their fishing chances, and if after using the product, they catch a fish, they will automatically assume that it was the product, and the product only, that caught them that fish. Remember Dumbo's feather?...

aYup. IMHO, black boxes can make a difference, dependant upon the configuration/construction of your boat. Nearly all Area G Trollers (WCVI) have and use them and have for years. Since successful fishing defines their livelihood, that says a lot to me. I've seen the results when one boat is "leaking" and/or not using the BB alongside one that is, the one that is properly grounded and dialed in for spp of fish always wins.

That being said, I personally don't use one. I run a 16 foot whaler, w/ a zinced out 50 Mariner. My downriggers are the old bicycle antique types (intentionally, I do have Scotty's but like the older look and function of the antiques). I've found you can easily adjust your perceived voltage rate simply by lengthening/shortening a non-conductive tether between your cannonball and the clip on the wire. And my little rig certainly doesn't seem to have much problem putting fish to the net.

Cheers,
Nog

[wolf]

Well now you are on a whole different subject there noggin a commercial boat is totally different than a sport fishing boat a commercial boat has enough wire and cannon balls out fishing to sink one of our sport boats another thing is have you ever seen the wiring on one of those boats it is pretty scary on SOME of them, a rough estimate would be that they have probably 5 to 10 times more electrical components on there boat compared to a sport boat. like what you have said what is on your boat what you are fishing in a fairly basic setup with not a lot of eguipment so of course you wont be creating electrical "problems" you even said you like the "aniques" but ya know using electric down riggers are pretty awesome and they make my job a whole lot easier thats for sure when i have to guide up at the lodge i work at they only give us one elec. and a old cranker i hate it so i usually bring my own elec. just because once you use elec. you never want to go back.

[wolf]

Well now you are on a whole different subject there noggin a commercial boat is totally different than a sport fishing boat a commercial boat has enough wire and cannon balls out fishing to sink one of our sport boats another thing is have you ever seen the wiring on one of those boats it is pretty scary on SOME of them, a rough estimate would be that they have probably 5 to 10 times more electrical components on there boat compared to a sport boat. like what you have said what is on your boat what you are fishing in a fairly basic setup with not a lot of eguipment so of course you wont be creating electrical "problems" you even said you like the "aniques" but ya know using electric down riggers are pretty awesome and they make my job a whole lot easier thats for sure when i have to guide up at the lodge i work at they only give us one elec. and a old cranker i hate it so i usually bring my own elec. just because once you use elec. you never want to go back.

[Tailspin]

Roe bags has had a few black boxes in his time, not all made from scotty. Some from the red lion. Bags have you any input on the box?

[Tailspin]

Roe bags has had a few black boxes in his time, not all made from scotty. Some from the red lion. Bags have you any input on the box?