cowichan run numbers

[Poppa Swiss]

I'm not talking about this year, we all know whats going on there right now [xx(]

But I'd like to know if anybody has numbers on the size of the coho and chum runs the Cow usually gets?

Or where I can find this information for that matter.

[Ghost21]

Piss pour returns.. Over fishing .. Natives putting nets up .. and a crappy Hatchery program.. = Bad returns

[Tailspin]

Find some time for some annual Hay Bail tossing off the Silver Bridge![}:)]

Should make some short work of those FN nets with all this Skywater.

Maybe a Steelhead or two can get through the Gauntlet?:D

[scottyboy]

you would think if a river is in trouble with fish returns and is closed 4 a reason .that it would mean everyone . savages as well. [B)]scottyboy

[Morty]

Right on madddog!good idea
Wish i had a couple o bails last thurs when i was drivin over sooke bridge.They're still setting nets right across the river with these low returns\low water conditions for what by now must be scaaaaabbyy boots????????
All I had on hand was a cup of coffee,but I'm pretty sure I missed[:D[8D

[LastChance]

Be nice if someone could fall a nice big log right upstream from 'em. Or push a big root ball in.

[scottyboy]

shoulda bin like pei years ago

[Poppa Swiss]

well there should be a lot of nice big logs pouring down the cow now with all the rain.

[TheRock]

There should be NO fishing of any kind at all river mouths and in ANY rivers when fish are trying to go spawn! For the love of god.. let the fish f'n SPAWN FOR f**CK SAKES!!!! WHEN WILL WE ALL LEARN..?? WHEN IT'S TO LATE LIKE ALL WAYS.. I THOUGHT HUMANS WERE SUPPOSE TO BE SMART..? STARTING WITH DFO.. VERY FRUSTRATING TO SEE SUCH STUPIDITY...

[Time]

Disagree Rock
All fishing should occur at the river mouths and in the rivers.
For the sporty, remember, not everybody has a boat.
For the commercial, if they got rid of the seine fleet and went back to local net pens or fishtraps it would be possible to more accurately assess the runs before harvesting took place. Also you could minimize and/or eliminate bycatch by doing live sorts, by size and species (e.g. separating the steelhead from the sockeye).
JMHO
Tight lines.

[wolf]

I think the way they seine fish now is good they take only what they need or dump the rest last summer up off craycroft they would seine BUT they dont lift the basket they make a condensed pond out of the net, then there were 2 boats on the side separating the fish when they got what they could take ie sockeye and pinks they would just let the rest of them go and was really impressed how they took the care on the fish, as for a gillnet you get every thing so it all comes down to one thing we have to live with the fact THERE is always going to be commercial fishing $$$$$$$$$$ dictate that.


Wolf

[TheRock]

I may have come across a little harsh on my no river fishing comment, I will try to keep emotions out from future comments,..however,we all know that a ban on all river fishing would never happen in today's world. It is all so good to hear that there is good protective selective seine net fishing on rivers but how often does that really happen? When every one is watching sure, how about all the illegal netting and pouching and over fishing behind the scenes? What I'm try to say, to put it simple.... the 1% of fish that do make it back to the river from the ocean, give them all the chance to go spawn, stocks would rebuild stronger, more fish in the ocean, commercial and sport fishing would grow and be more productive, more money for the economy. Why harvest the 1% of fish that are trying to go spawn and produce for the future ?

[wolf]

Rock did you realise that most commercial boats now have video monitoring on them its one step anyways.

Wolf

[TheRock]

Yes I do know some of the commercial boats have video monitoring. It is one small step but not enough. How many commercial boats do? less than 1% ? Do you believe video cameras prevent illegal poaching? Do you think those tapes get reviewed? Tens of thousands of hours of tapes? Sure, sign me up, I'll watch videos for $30/hr. We are off topic know... Why does Commercial, Sport and Natives harvest/pouch the 1% of fish that are trying to go spawn in our rivers that will produce for the future ? It boggles my mind..... it really does.....

[yo mama]

Everybody has to tigten there belts on fishing. We always blame the commercial, native, seals, warming... but we never think about our selves cause our limits seem to low to do damage. If you take 4 salmon per day and multiply how many people are bagging that from Califonia to Alaska, we do great damage as well. Simple math to figure all of this out. Cut back limits for sporties and commercial, abolish native "special" fishing practices and make them join the rest of us with a limit. It is 2006, how many more years can they say they are food fishing and get away with it. I can't go back to my home country and claim it is my right to kill as many fish as I want!

[r.s craven]

Agreed.... it's not about anyone's inherent right to fish,
it's about preserving the salmon stocks.
this business of allowing netting in the rivers is insanity.[xx(]
we should all play by the same rules.

[reel easy]

I totally agree with Rock, the salmon that go through all the perils and return to spawn should be respected in the highest degree. Instead of throwing spears and flossing line at them we should be doing everything possible to help them, whatever that may be. Last summer the wife and I moved hundreds of smolts out of small pools where they had gotten trapped ,if everybody helped, even just by taking your kids to the river and telling them how incredable these fish are, we might, still have salmon in 20 years. If you think I'm overeacting just ask someone from the east coast about the Atlantic salmon.

[knucklebuster]

I know this will ruffle some feathers but most are used to it by now.
The other day my kid came home with a salmon in a garbage bag. he said it was a chum and he got it from a friend who was snagging them on the cowichan.His friend is first nations. He was casting a treble hook in the river and he dragged this one out by the tail.He didn't want it so offered it to my kid.
I opened the bag and found a beautiful,chrome, hatchery coho.about 8#.
Funny that i'm not even allowed to fish in this river.But others are allowed to kill for fun.
I don't think this river has a chance of survival.Obviously, the message isn't getting through.
There is a write up in the local paper about the chinook returns in the Cow and the Goldstream.They say it is the worst on record.and they predict that these runs will be gone in a few years.
If the coho had been a chinook, do you think that would have made a difference? How many chinook do you think met the same fate?
I have been fighting this for years and have gone as far as calling chek6 news to get them up here to see the people spearing and tossing the dead fish back but it seems it is a little too political for them to pick a side.Maybe they are afraid of the reprocussions(sp) from the first nations.
What else can we do?

[alley cat]

You need to talk to the Cowichan Tribes hatchery and transport group, they took over 300 chinook and transported them upstream to rearing and spawning channels; escapment was 700 plus and there is now an under water camera in the Cowichan at the main rivers point where it begins to branch to the estuary , this showed some interesting numbers of varied salmon specie , they also have an active and dedicated patrol group to discourage incidental fishing of all cultures , they also cut back their food fishery by more than half in reaction to the poor numbers , if there was one person who got away with illegal jigging don't smear the whole group over that individuals actions.
Our own culture along with other cultures have a proportion of those who will disregrd regulations and fish whenever they want to ; if you want to slam people hit away at the poachers of all Nations , you want to target specific types of people look to the immigrant Asian stock arriving at our shores and follow their depredations of all sea life.

AL

[knucklebuster]

It wasn't a intended to be a smear. I realize there are poachers of all types. I was pointing out that there is a serious problem here and would have thought that first nations would be on top of the list to realise it. My point was that some how the message of urgency isn't getting through.It is at crisis stage and for somereason people still don't get it. We all have much to loose but the first nations loose more than a sport like most of us.They will loose a part of there culture. Extinct is forever.
p.s. I have gone after the asian groups raping the oyster beds and after the white man snagging coho out of a low water pool on the Vedder but today we're talking about the Cowichan

[High Five]

I disagree with native right to fish, and I fish Cowichan every year. It may seem a little harsh but DFO needs the right to close ther river when ever you want to.

I am local fisherman on the river, and I watch Native/Non-Native kill and just leave them on the side of the bank. The river is in trouble with erosion,low water levels,fishing pressure,global warming. The Cowichan can't hold heavy rain anymore, and drys out too quickly.

Just because to first nations runs the hatchery doesn't give them the right to blast to river with nets and spears whenever they feel like it. Many people in Duncan view this act negatively. If they want to spear then they should be allowed only when the river is open. As for the cameras,fish counting station etc. DFO pays for these out of Ottawa's tax dollars.

[frango]

I happen to work for CHEK TV news and have for 28 years. I have lost count on the number of stories we have done on this issue. It's not too political we don't pick sides and we don't fear reprocussions. There are issues on many vancouver island rivers.

[knucklebuster]

quote:Originally posted by frango

I happen to work for CHEK TV news and have for 28 years. I have lost count on the number of stories we have done on this issue. It's not too political we don't pick sides and we don't fear reprocussions. There are issues on many vancouver island rivers.
Frango, its good to hear that about chek 6. I would love to see pics of this on the 5 oclock news. It just always seemed to me to be avoided. The only people I ever hear complaining are the people on here. If more of the general public saw this I'm sure there would be more screaming.

[saltybeaver]

"Charges unlikely in illegal chum sale, DFO says Cowichan Valley Citizen Wednesday, February 23, 2005 Page: 8 Section: News Byline: Andrea Rondeau Source: The Citizen Some Cowichan Tribes band members remain upset and angry over what they see as inadequate action taken by both officials at the federal Department of Fisheries and Oceans and the Tribes chief and council after almost $43,000 worth of chum were sold illegally. "It's a big legal issue. It's not small, and everything's kept under the rug," says band member Kevin Thorne. The fish were caught legally in 2003 through the food fishery and should have gone to the community for use as food fish or for ceremonial purposes. Instead, however, the $42, 800 worth of chum salmon were sold to an export company from China"



I wonder how often this happens and nobody gets cought ? Maybe this is where all the fish have gone ? and what are they doing with 43,000 worth of salmon that they dont need that year ?

[Poppa Swiss]

quote:and what are they doing with 43,000 worth of salmon that they dont need that year ?

No kidding, their food allowance is obviously way overblown if $43,000 (wholesale value I assume) can go missing. I don't know what sort of poundage that equates to, but its more then a couple of pick ups full of salmon. How about banning that chinese company from doing business in the province?

Yes I agree they should get a food fishery - ONLY if the river can support it and they should also be forced to keep tight records as to where the numbers of fish take and how they are used.

I know the Cow has many more problems then simple overfishing, but the sport guys can't even C&R on the river so that leaves only one group directly taking fish from these runs.

[Ghost21]

Well goes to show you fisheries isn't dropping enough hay bails down the river[xx(] Everyone knows they net the river. I don't understand that.. You get a 14' spear and your 1' from a fish and you still have to net fish... give me a break .. Fish allowence OK. understandable.. but ONLY if the river can support such a thing. makes me sick in any case[xx(][xx(]:([xx(][xx(][xx(][xx(]

[High Five]

quote:Originally posted by Poppa Swiss

[quote]and what are they doing with 43,000 worth of salmon that they dont need that year ?

The quote speaks for itself. Can't wait when there is nothing left in river. How long is this going to go on?

These facts may be obvious but I want to understand so if any one has info let me know:

1.Hatchery is partly run by First nations, but mostly funded by community tax dollars. Not to shure?
2.DFO studies are currently being done in river to asess impact. Funded by tax dollars.
3.Counting station on Cowichan is operated by Fisrt nations who are payed in tax dollars by DFO.
4. River improvement projects are partly funded from community, and First nations,

So my question is simple why do they need such large amounts43,000 on a dying river? Do they put excess amount of 43,000 in the river each year ? Who keeps track of fish being caught?

[scottyboy]

just get out and walk the river, you will be shocked .

[scottyboy]

what also really pisses me off , i know guys that buy fish from the indians for nexted 2 nothing and as many as they want. bull...t

[High Five]

Yeah that does happen quite a bit. I was offered some fish a while ago when I was checking out if the estuary had any fish in early Sept.

[Morty]

I've heard a few times over the years about those guys that sell salmon out of a van ? up there, and always thought it could have just been rumor.Then last year, an ex coworker of mine told me that him and all his E.ind freinds and family wait until fall to buy all their salmon from these guys that cruise around town selling salmon out of their van!! I don't know if this is legal for them to do or not? but it really wouldn't surprise me.[V]
Then there was this greasy neighbor I had a couple years ago.This guy was 100% white and had a freind from up there.He would brag about visiting his buddy on the res and snagging a cooler full of 30 pounders -in PLAIN SITE of the tribal "conservation officer"!!:(
I really worry about the future of this river if these people are allowed to continue doing whatever the F they want.
Alley Cat you make it sound like these guys are volunteering on their weekends or something..Like Smiley said aren't we paying for all this equipment\programs as well as their paychecks - tax free to boot.[}:)]
[}:)]

[LET IT GOOOOO]

quote:Originally posted by frango

I happen to work for CHEK TV news and have for 28 years. I have lost count on the number of stories we have done on this issue. It's not too political we don't pick sides and we don't fear reprocussions. There are issues on many vancouver island rivers.


Why not step the hell up then???
If you care about this issue, then preach it to your "chek TV crew".
We're talking about extinction!!!
It's time that all walks of life start standing up for our fish...even if it's "food fish".
Let all stocks revive.

LET IT GOOOOO......CATCH IT ANOTHER DAY.

[darmin]

bottom line is until the politians get some treaties signed with the natives were up sh... creek so we have to continue paying them off to keep them quiet